carrying guns

Discussion in 'The Fire For Effect and Totally Politically Incorr' started by topper, Dec 24, 2009.

  1. topper

    topper New Member

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    What do you all think about a society that allows it's citizens to openly carry firearms at anytime, anywhere, without permits? I mean NO RESTRICTIONS on carrying at all. It used to be the norm in america in days long ago, and now our crime is rampant and guns are restricted, so something is amiss. Opinions are welcome.
  2. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    When I was a kid, you were not supposed to carry a conceiled firearm, but open carry was fine. When I was too young for a drivers license, my buddy and I used to ride our bicycles across town with our .22 pistols strapped on our hips, and no one thought anything about it.

    It was a better world then, and as Bill Jordon said in "No Second Place Winner", people were much more polite to each other when everyone wore a gun.

    All of this hogwash is supposedly aimed at the BAD GUYS, trying to disarm them. But the effect is that only the GOOD GUYS get disarmed and become helpless victoms. When EVERYONE was armed, the bad guys had a habit of ceasing to exist.

    It is an example of good intentions gone wrong, similar to our welfare system.
  3. mcw120566

    mcw120566 New Member

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    The following is an excerpt from an essay that I have to submit for one of my college classes, I got a poor grade finding out the hard way that my instructor was PC. Doesn’t change my feelings a bit!
    Disarming America, or not being prepared to defend your self is not the answer. The answer lies in both better education, and proper instruction. There will always be violent crimes, which is a fact will never change. However, I believe that we as a nation, would see a drastic decline in the “crimes of opportunity,” if the criminals knew that most of the population was armed with a gun and ready to defend them selves.
  4. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

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    Last edited: Dec 24, 2009
  5. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

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    Well there ya go. Crime is rampant and guns are restricted. The question is how much restriction do you need? I draw the line at a background check. If you can pass a background check, you should be legally allowed to possess a firearm, concealed or not. If people are worried that it will be like the Old West, then they should carry too in order to protect themselves. Look at it this way. A criminal is not going to buy a gun legally because the background check won't let them. Now, if criminals are able to get a gun on the black market, or by some other means, why should we tighten up the grip on people that have no criminal record and can legally own a firearm? Some people seem to think that disarming everyone would create a peaceful society. But you know what? The world isn't like a good neighbor that is always going to say hello with a smile on their face. What do you do when you're out with your girlfriend, and some raving lunatic that's 6'5" and 350 lbs comes and tries to fight, or rape or something? We're not all 6'5" and 350 so we can't just fight the guy off. No, if it were me, I would draw the 1911 and take care of business. Police are not always around either. So what do you do? We should not be licensing rights. Rights are rights. If a government has the power to license a right, they also have the power to suppress it or take it away all together.
    Who are we hurting by carrying a gun anyway? I myself would rather conceal carry if I was armed in public because I just would rather avoid someone getting frightened and making a big deal out of it. But if people want to open or conceal carry, let them. Until someone commits a crime with their weapon, they are well within their Constitutional rights.

    Another situation I get upset by is conceal carry laws here in Wisconsin. I know it's the billionth time I've brought it up, but who wouldn't be outraged by it. Our governor allows police and retired police to conceal carry if they apply for a license, yet law abiding citizens cannot. He doesn't not look at the fact that states that have passed shall-issue conceal carry have seen lower crime rates. Yet, no, he doesn't feel we should be concerned with that right now. He's allowed to protect himself. Why are we left out in the cold?
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2009
  6. obxned

    obxned New Member

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    Over the last couple of years, the number of firearms in our country and the number of citizens with permits to carry have increased by leaps and bounds. Violent crime is down 10%. It would appear that rape, robbery, murder, and car-jacking just aren't as much fun when it could get you dead.
  7. the morning light

    the morning light New Member

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    Michigan has open carry, at least they did ten years ago when I checked the law. Never see anyone carrying lately.
  8. Hardballer

    Hardballer New Member

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    Wisconsin also has open carry and I am the only person that I have seen open carrying in Pepin, buffalo, Trempealeau or La Crosse counties.

    I know I am not the only one because I have heard of others both on forums such as Open Carry dot Org. and others and from folks I have encountered while open carrying.

    For many it is fear that prevents them from carrying and, that fear is justified with the advent of police harassment. Click here.

    I have yet to hear a negative comment. Many have offered their hand to me as an endorsement of their approval and many, many have verbalized their approval in no uncertain terms.

    If one person carries, he or she can be harassed but if ten million carry, that puts an entirely different spin on things.

    I have carried a full sized 1911 for many years and still do. Condition one is the only way I have ever carried. Cocked, locked and. . . . Well. . . you know. . .

    I occasionally carry a small, inexpensive nine if I am going where the odds of harassment are high. They can keep it as long as they like in the evidence locker if it goes that way. They are a dime a dozen. Hi-Point C-9 for anyone who wants to know.

    I make my own holsters. Leather/Kydex hybrids. Along the lines of a Yaqui or Galco belt slide or I also make an IWB holster like the Tucker "The Answer". I use the FBI cant. The Tucker is by and far the best concealment holster I have ever worn.

    The belt slide I wear now is sandwiched between the belt and pants. Either holster keeps the gun tucked in nice and tight but accords a very fast draw.



    I wholeheartedly advocate open carry and concealed carry. The only thing I don't like about concealed carry is the fact that you must register both you and your handgun as well as jumping through a number of hoops.

    This is the "infringed" part. So I guess I am all for "NO RESTRICTIONS on carrying at all."
  9. Lotsdragon

    Lotsdragon New Member

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    You have to remember that the "old west" wasnt as open as hollywood makes it seem. Most towns had gun restrictions, as in you got to town you had to check your gun. Was as simple as that, though. If you were just passing through and not stopping there was no need to check your guns and all travelers were just assumed to be armed.We take the idea of everyone in the old west as a semi pro gunfighter from hollywood, that just sint true. A gun was a tool and as such was carried by those that had a need for it. But not everyone carried a firearm. The idea of "gunslingers" is another invention of hollywood as well. There were psychopaths as well in the old west and some of them did carry a gun, but many times a whole town would ban together and hang them.
    Also not everything was better in the "old days" we tend to wax poetic when thinking about it. Myself i wouldnt mind going back to the part of open carry, but many towns would just enact check your gun laws, and bg's would still exist. Because bg's dont care what any law says.
  10. Maximilian II

    Maximilian II New Member

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    I think the restrictions on firearms ownership and carry should ONLY apply to those CITIZENS who have shown themselves to not deserve their rights. That's actually more restrictive than the Constitution. Call me a liberal...
  11. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Liberal!
  12. Hardballer

    Hardballer New Member

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    Ya Liberal! Oh, Merry Christmas too. . . :D
  13. Slabsides

    Slabsides Member

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    Call me crazy, but I do NOT believe in open carry. Why? You give away the element of surprise. Being concealed, the other guy does not know if you are carrying or what kind of equipment you have. If a criminal sees that you are armed, he will alter his tactics (like blindside or kill you right off).

    It also opens you up to get your weapon taken from you. The criminal would make it his first order of business to get your weapon (again, blindside or kill you). To a crackhead, you would be dangling a nice, shiney piece of machinery worth a hand full of rocks right there off of your hip.

    As for deterence, it would likely deter petty thiefs, but it would only make the real criminals that much more violent in their attacks for reasons mentioned above.

    I could be off in my views of this, but I like to blend in with the rest of the sheep knowing that I can tear off the outer covering and expose the wolf in an instant.
  14. tcox4freedom

    tcox4freedom Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I'm all for it!!!
    My friends and I used to do the same around Memphis and Northern MS. We never had a cop or civilian give us a second glance.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2009
  15. tcox4freedom

    tcox4freedom Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I'm sorry all those arguments have been beaten to death; AND proven NOT to hold water.

    #1- BG's always have the advantage of surprise. They are the only ones who "KNOW" an attack is coming!

    #2- BG's are also cowards and lazy by nature. If they know you will be a hard target and WILL fight back, they move on to "easier" prey. (I know this 1st hand and heard it from a lot of BG's.)

    #3- Name some published instances when a BG "randomly" chose an OCer as a victim AND won!

    #4- The only reason my family's store was ever robbed, was because they thought we know longer were armed because we did NOT OC in the store anymore.
  16. tcox4freedom

    tcox4freedom Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I got this from another forum:

    I encourage everyone to check it out. It's better presented than my software can do by the cut & paste feature.

    http://www.usacarry.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=68167

    Last edited: Dec 26, 2009
  17. pinecone70

    pinecone70 Active Member

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    Heh. In my county, citizens do call the cops if they see guns on citizens. The cops don't like having to come and check permits, so they recommend we conceal.
  18. topper

    topper New Member

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    When I was a youngster of about 14 or so, a friend and I would ride our motorscooters out to the creek to shoot at old junk cars that were abandoned there. I had a .22 single shot rifle and my friend had a 16 gauge shotgun. We would put the guns across the handlebars and take off for the creek. We had a few city streets and mostly open rural roads, but sometimes there was a bit of traffic. No one ever bothered either of us. Of course the guns were unloaded while transporting, the shotgun broke open and the rifle bolt out of my rifle. Sure could not do that today!
  19. Terry_P

    Terry_P New Member

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    I think criminals should not be allowed to carry or own. There are degrees of crime, for example if some kid smoked a joint and got caught I don't think that should haunt him for the rest of his life. If someone commits a violent act then they have lost their right by their actions. That way if they are checked by authorities and are carrying then they should go to jail for it. They have no intentions of following the law and should be caged.

    As to open carry I personally don't as I have CCL's that are valid in 30 states. I think a Fed law should be passed to require all states to recognize the CC permits of all other states as they do drivers licenses. If IL and WI don't want to issue permits then under this law out of state CCL's must be honored while their own citizens can't conceal. With the current bunch in Washington it has zero chance of passing.
  20. Slabsides

    Slabsides Member

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    #1- Applies if you are unarmed, concealed or open carry. It's a fact of any confrontation. It's where SA comes in to play.

    The OP suggested everyone be able to OC. #2 and #3 cannot be compared to a totally OC society because they do not exist.

    #4-By that logic you are saying no OC establisment has ever been targeted? Look how many banks get knocked over with armed guards.....who are, no surprise, the FIRST to get neutralized.

    There are valid arguments for both methods, you choose yours and I'll choose mine. I choose to focus on CC because mass OC will never happen in this country. I'll say that again....mass OC will NEVER happen in this country. With what we have running this country, we are lucky to even still HAVE guns, much less ever be able to carry them in public openly. Get used to it....it's only going to get worse.:mad:
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2009
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