Custom Combat Shotgun Package

Discussion in 'Large-Bore/Small-Bore Rifle/Shotgun' started by warpig, Feb 24, 2003.

  1. warpig

    warpig Guest

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 980
    (10/6/01 12:51:16 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del All Custom Combat Shotgun Package
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    I am reintroducing a combat shotgun package we sold a few years ago. Now that the shop is ready to reopen, its time to see if a market still exists for this stuff:

    Based on existing Rem 870, 1100, Win 1200/1300 or Mossberg 500.

    Barrel shortened to specified length, long forcing cone cut, modified to accept choke tubes (IC choke included for shot), and ported for reduced muzzle rise.
    Synthetic stock with recoil reducers.
    Extended magazine (depends on bbl length).
    Ghost ring Tritium night sights
    Action hand-honed for smooth operation and reliability.
    Matte black Teflon finish on all exposed metal.

    We used to call it the MeanStick, but that is subject to change... Complete shotguns $750.00. - $900.00 depending on base model. Class-3 AOW conversions coming soon!

    What do you think?

    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1774
    (10/6/01 5:53:11 pm)
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    Do you take custom orders? Some of that stuff I wouldn't care for, whereas some other things I like better I'd like to substitute....if of course I decided to take a step down from the '97...
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 982
    (10/6/01 6:01:31 pm)
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    Sure. Set up to do all types of shotgun work. Chokes, backboring, porting...

    What do ya'll think would make a better package?

    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1777
    (10/6/01 6:41:02 pm)
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    My 870 was set up pretty much the way I wanted it, except it was 2 3/4 only...

    20" VR barrel. with Ithaca flourescent bead...True-Choke system, had (CYL, SKEET 2, and IMP. MOD tubes,)2 shot Remington extension (shoulda had a 3 shot, but I got the 2 cheap) trigger job, skeleton follower, Choate pistol grip stock/forearm, and my special trick, an old Lyman flip up large arpeture reciever sight designed for Remington rifles, on the back of the reciever. Side mount sling, with black USGI web sling.

    That old Lyman was tough to find, but it acted just like the current rage, a Ghost ring, I guess I was before my time, BUT using buck, or the #2s we had to switch to to avoid splash back on the short range plates or pepper-poppers, it was out of the way, all I saw was rib when it was folded...

    The rage at the time was removing a section of rib and sweating a flip up open sight in that section, but I liked my peep better...just the berries out to 75-100 for slugs...I not only competed with it, but used it for all my hunting too...

    The only thing would have made it better was if I did it on an 1100 instead...I usually only won if the 1100s I was up against malfunctioned...close though...

    I don't think I'd need the ports, at least....

    BTW, can you mount a truechoke or similar in my '97? And how much?
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 984
    (10/6/01 7:03:44 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Custom Combat Shotgun Package
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    It's be close. We'd really need to mic the barrel, ID and OD. We're set up to do Tru-Choke Thinwalls, though.

    $85, includes 3 tubes.


    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1784
    (10/6/01 10:58:57 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Custom Combat Shotgun Package
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    Are they the same Truechoke tubes they had years ago? I still have my wrench and I think one tube I had lost at the time I got rid of the gun, I'll have to dig it out...I wouldn't mind the same three I had, except I was told it wasn't necessary to use the cylinder to just protect the threads...I was told they would not be hurt if you fired it without a tube in place, is that true? I MAY someday be shooting homebrew bucknball with no wads too...

    OD=.865

    ID= .725 (Both at the muzzle, of course)

    BTW, how much would you charge for a complete reblue? That is of course, if I could ever part with the original "Polish Patina" finish...

    I could just send you the whole gun and have it done at once, although, after deer season....
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 986
    (10/7/01 6:25:33 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Custom Combat Shotgun Package
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    There's plenty of meat there for standard Winchoke/Invector tubes. More available choices for tubes...

    I really wouldn't fire one without a tube in place. No sense taking the chance of damaging/severely fouling the threads or the muzzle when a choke tube is less than $20.00. No problem with the buck & ball loads using the more open chokes like IC.

    Cost would depend on what finish you want. It seems like almost EVERY part of a 97 shows, and there's a bunch of parts... Original polished rust-blue, modern salt blue, bead-blast salt blue, parkerizing or Teflon?


    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    the real fredneck
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 388
    (10/7/01 9:17:16 am)
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    a 97 with a lovely brown Teflon finish? wouldn't it look like a UPS turd van?

    TallTLynn
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 2093
    (10/7/01 4:25:54 pm)
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    AntiqueDr - I'm betting there would be a market for them. As you know I'm not really into shotguns (witness my trading away my 870) but there are a lot of people I know who think shotguns are great and would probably like a package like that. Whether they would buy one is a different matter but it does sound fascinating.

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1794
    (10/7/01 5:23:59 pm)
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    I've always had a special place in my heart for Parkerized guns, but I believe I also would like to keep it "stock," and blued, besides, I don't think any riots or Trenches were ever parkerized until rearsenaled.

    I am not too "up" on new finishes, maybe some new whiz-bang scratch/weather resistant finish is what I need, but then again, kind of anachronistic, isn't it?

    I mean, it's stood up well for 75 years+ so far, why try to improve upon it?

    Doc, let me know the advantages/disadvantages of each and the price, and I can mull it over...
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 989
    (10/7/01 11:40:26 pm)
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    Probably too long a dissertation for the board. I'll send you an email tomorrow evening.


    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    TallTLynn
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 2096
    (10/8/01 12:01:18 am)
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    Ah come on AntiqueDr - this sounds like it would be interesting.

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1799
    (10/8/01 12:11:33 am)
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    "Long Dissertation?" Maybe that should be my alter-ego screen name...

    OK OK, my OTHER screen name then...
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    AntiqueDr
    Moderator
    Posts: 996
    (10/8/01 6:52:17 pm)
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    Well, then, here goes.

    Your 97 almost certainly was rust-blued at the factory and that would be the most traditional way to go. Rust-blue is a very "honest" finish in that it is impossible to hide pits, etc. Metal preparation for rust-bluing is meticulous. Depending on if there is any pitting in the lettering, I'd have to consult with you on whether to leave that pitting or polish and recut the lettering. Rust-blue is by far the most aesthetically pleasing finish on older guns, and correctly done is the basis of a professional restoration. It is also the most fragile and requires the most maintenance. Cost can be significant, probably > $200.

    Modern salt-bluing is a process that really got started in the 40's. Metal preparation is also very meticulous, but the bluing only takes a half-hour or so. Fairly durable finish with regular maintenance, but an obvious reblue to anybody even halfway familiar with older guns. Less expensive, though, between $100 and $150 for a '97.

    Parkerizing is a tougher finish and would not be completely incorrect for a short-barrelled 97 if you were going for the arsenal-refurb look. Any noticeable pitting would need to drawfiled out before bead-blasting. Ours is a very dark gray, almost charcoal tint. $100.00

    The Teflon-based finishes entail a light bead-blast, application of the finish, and "curing" with heat. Exceptionally durable finish, and the best for hiding heavy pitting. Obviously, historically incorrect in appearance for that shotgun. You'd probably have the only such gun anywhere... we do black or OD green... $85.00

    Depending on how rough the exterior is, and what your intentions are (I can guess), I would suggest either the phosphate finish ("parkerizing") or the Teflon in black.

    In the near future I am going to make up some show-pieces in each of the above finishes for the website... gathering junkers for the project now...


    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1814
    (10/8/01 9:03:43 pm)
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    HHhhmmm.....Teflon or Parko, Teflon or Parko....Hhhhmmmmmm......
    I'm so PROUD to be an AMERICAN...

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 2092
    (11/2/01 9:01:09 pm)
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    So Doc, I'm thinking of having you redo the '97 for me this winter...

    I want screw choles, flush fit so you can't notice them unless up close, prefer TrueChoke because I used them before, in Cyl, Skeet II and Improved Modified...

    ...and I'll make up my mind on either the Parko or the Black Teflon....

    What would the total cost be, and expected turn-around time? Do you charge for the detail strip?

    And would say, January, be a good time? Have to wait until after hunting season....
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 1137
    (11/3/01 10:07:16 am)
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    Well Polish.....if you're really gonna get rid of that "lovely brown patina"......

    Gotta go Parko! Short '97, trench gun look......that's to die for!

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 2110
    (11/3/01 12:28:48 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Custom Combat Shotgun Package
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    Yeah, I'm kinda leaning towards the Parko myself, my Serial # falls in the range of actual WWI riots and Trenches, but not in one of the three "classes."

    And many of the WWI riots and trenches were rearsenaled in parko between the wars and in WWII and later...

    Plus, even though mine is a cut down 26", it is factory marked "Cyl," not a strike through, so it would LOOK like a real riot...even though it's 18 1/2" not 20 3/4" like it should be...and it has a Pachmayr pad not the black rubber....

    BUT, number one, I would NEVER represent it as a "real" one, number two, I would not want to allow somebody who has it in 50 years to do it either...and number three I ain't going to SELL it anyway...

    SOOooo...picture a "space age" black teflon finish from the 21st Century on an effective, "working" riot gun designed in the 19th...what a conversation starter THAT would be!!!!

    And I kinda like the new name the "Black '97..."

    (BTW, make that "somebody who has it in 100 years..." )
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Edited by: polishshooter at: 11/3/01 12:32:22 pm

    polishshooter
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
    Posts: 2196
    (11/12/01 9:17:37 pm)
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    Well, Doc, Bree, Fred, GP, and Bob all held the infamous '97 and all agreed it has too much "Character" as is to refinish...so I guess you lost out on the C note...

    Put 15 Remington 1 ozs down it yesterday getting ready for Deer Season this Saturday and my shoulder sure is sore today....must be getting old...

    HAD to be the Riot...only shot about 50 through the SKS, it's a popgun, and only five through a 44, rest were from the Astra and the .45, didn't have much time before the range closed....

    You know, ANYBODY that says they "enjoy" shooting 12 guage deer slugs is either lying, or only shoots 3 or 4 before the season, then 10 at deer every year...

    Heck, you NEVER feel them shooting at DEER, takes a REAL man to shoot 3 shot groups at paper more than twice ....and NOT jerk the trigger about the 4th or 5th group...
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915
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