Do you believe you need to exercise your rights to preserve them?

Discussion in 'The Constitutional & RKBA Forum' started by RunningOnMT, Oct 10, 2009.

  1. PharmrJohn

    PharmrJohn New Member

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    Absolutely. If you don't use it, you lose it. Without participation in a right, interest is lost and laws are passed right under our noses.
  2. Doc1911

    Doc1911 New Member

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    Exactly. This is one reason why we need to keep our youth interested in weapons. Without this early influence the use of weapons will decrease and thus the rights will slowly disappear.
  3. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    I couldn't agree more !!
  4. vulcrider

    vulcrider New Member

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    I've read with extreme interest all the posts in this thread. This subject has come up many times with the people I work and associate with (approximately 99 percent of which own guns and about half have CCW's plus my family and friends again about 99 percent own and half have CCW's). Many of these are all for exercising all of their rights at all times i.e. bearing arms, speech, religion, etc. and some that feel that in those exercises, infringing on other's rights needs to be minded. This is probably the crux of any argument about open carry.
    Do we, as part of the "people" as defined in the Constitution, have individual rights that supercede our responsibility to acknowledge the rights of the "people" as a whole? In other words, does my right in Ohio to openly carry supercede the rights of others who find the site of a man with a gun strapped to his thigh or on his hip (or for that matter, a large knife, a sword or rifle over his back) as a threat to his or her right to security or safety? I know that when any of my rights appear to be infringed upon, I feel threatened and certainly upset!
    I have a CCW permit. I have it to allow me to feel protected against threats to my life. By keeping it concealed, I believe that anyone who may wish to do me harm (hopefully) will stop and think before attempting such harm. Granted, an open carry will do the same thing, although I would worry that it also would invite someone to try and grab that weapon for his or her own devices. As for accidentally exposing my firearm and thus "brandishing" a weapon, when I applied for my permit, I did agree to follow the rules for having one. In my mind, an acceptable compromise between my rights and those of others.
    I don't know if there ever will be the perfect system that allows individual rights and the rights of all to be balanced to everyone's satisfaction. I believe that the system we have established in this country still is the best ever devised by man. I hope that we all can continue to make it work.
    Just my thoughts.
  5. Hardballer

    Hardballer New Member

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    I do not think that legislation because of fear is a sound course of action.

    People who are afraid of the sight of a gun have a real problem. Thank liberal education for that. And we have a real problem with coddling them in this behavior. We have become a nation of coddlers due in large part to Shyster lawyers. 3 million dollars because McDonald's didn't tell them the coffee was hot? How stupid do you have to be to not know coffee is hot.

    So I do not coddle. I do not give mealy mouthed answers to questions about my gun or why I carry it. I am direct and blunt. I carry a full sized .45 cocked and locked strong side with two extra mags in a weak side mag double mag holder.

    People ask but no one recoils in fear nor do they run screaming. I dress in jeans, a camo shirt and camo winter jacket, Western style hat and boots or leather (OMG) shoes. I'm 6' tall and weigh in at a tad over 300. Big and intimidating without a gun. With a gun, small children tell me about their gun at home, soldiers give me a thumbs up and news reporters bait me. "have you killed anything with that today?"

    I reply in all instances with a direct answer and in many cases, let em know that it is the law in Wisconsin and backed by the Constitution of the United States of America. 2A

    Hey, that's just me, you do what suits you.

    Edit: My wife is afraid of bears and wolves but I do not hear her calling for them to be eradicated. She keeps her distance but is glad I have a gun so I can protect her. She doesn't feel threatened by them because I do have a gun. (we've had a 300 plus pound black bear in the back yard that she personally faced down (within ten feet) to rescue our poodle (scooped him up and ran for the house. the bear headed in the other direction) and another one ran through the back yard lately. We have seen a timberwolf just thirty feet away in the field several times, bobcats etc. We haven't petitioned the county to move them out of sight. We know of libtards that have.

    Oooooooooooh I'm so scared, please take them away.

    She is much more afraid of the government doing something to me because I am exercising my legal right to carry. She says, she shouldn't have to be afraid of "that". I have the right, intrinsic to any man made law, to defend myself and family by whatever means.
    My wife is greatly moved by reading in detail, what our founders had done and said so that we might exercise our intrinsic rights. They gave up their lives so that their children's children down through history to us, may have and use our intrinsic rights to keep and bear arms to protect our selves and others.

    In her mind and heart and in her words; "it is a chicken _ _ _ _ dishonor to not bear arms to honor them and their sacrifice, their very own life. Just think of your own life. Think of that. Giving it up for something you believe in so strongly. Caring beyond your own life, for the future of not just your children but our children and their children too. It is an incredible honor and gift and it gives me chills to think on it.

    And she says, but that's just me. A women who is not afraid to see men and women carrying guns.
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2009
  6. johnlives4christ

    johnlives4christ Former Guest

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    i agree with you hardballer, it shouldnt matter if others get upset, offended, scared or angery because we or anyone else carries.

    i'll give you a good example

    you and your wife and your 2 kids are going into a grocery store, which would you rather explain?

    (A) Daddy why were those two men holding hands?

    (B) Daddy why did that man have a pistol?


    honestly, most people that would infringe on MY rights dont give a bean flip if what they do bothers me in any way, only that i have bothered them.
  7. vulcrider

    vulcrider New Member

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    Can't argue with any of your points. Certainly, I feel just as strongly about my rights as do you. I was just throwing out my thoughts looking for other's views.
    If nothing else, I have found that hearing as many points of view as possible helps me make the best choices for myself and those that depend on me.

    Long live this wonderful country and those that support it!
  8. Hardballer

    Hardballer New Member

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    Agreed. :)
  9. Vladimir

    Vladimir New Member

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    I do not believe you have to exercise them, but I believe you have to remain vigilant about the ones you care for. I believe someone could be a casual shooter, or even not own any guns at all, and be a huge help in maintaining the second amendment- but not without remaining vigilant.
  10. belercous

    belercous Former Guest

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    RunningonMT: I got the law from the ATF's State Laws and Published Ordinances, 27th ed. Look under the Akron municipal code Title 13 Ch. 137.02. Ohio most definitely has home rule. Did you read the part of the Ohio Constitution which I cited? (Except as otherwise...) The state allows open carry, Akron does not (execptions are as I stated previously.)
    Do I trust a training officer to tell me the law? No. I look it up myself. I've heard too many "experts" mis-state the law. As I said, a training officer's opinion carries no legal weight. The law as written does, and that's what judges go by. Now, I have not read the Ohio constitution in its entirety, but if firearms are singled out to fall under the sole jurisdiction of state law, then it would be a simple matter of challenging the Akron law as unconstitutional, open & shut case. I find it hard to believe that no one has done this yet.
    A few years ago when I was taking a hunter saftey course, a game warden with 20+ years of experience (in Illinois a game warden has more power than any other officer in the state by the way) told the class that it is illegal to have a loaded firearm in your vehicle at any time. I corrected him, but he said I was wrong. On lunch break, I went home and returned with the law. He, and all the other old-timers who "knew the law" said it must be a misprint or mistake. (you can have a loaded gun in your vehicle if it is not immediately accessible. e.g.; in your trunk.) I asked the game warden to check my law book's citation with his official copy. He did. After lunch, he corrected himself. (and by extension all the old timers who "knew" the law.) If you don't read the law yourself, you don't know the law, you are merely taking someone else's word for it. And you may suffer for it.
  11. 45nut

    45nut New Member

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    TJ,

    I carry concealed because that's the only way we can in Texas. :mad:

    1) BTW, one of the first infringements on the Second Amendment.

    2) The time and place for me to carry is all the time and everywhere. If I could do open carry, I would. But since the Great State of Texas won't let me, I carry concealed. I did open carry in AZ when there on vacation. It was fun to be in my cowboy re-enactment gear complete with a loaded Ivory handled Colt Single Action Army .45. :D

    3) Since I cannot predict when serious trouble may arise, I carry all the time to beat the odds. :eek: :D If you lived in Dallas you would too!! :eek: :mad:
  12. Southern Boy

    Southern Boy New Member

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    I also carry concealed because I have to. No open carry here except on private property. Here in the deep south it get so hot in the summer I have to drop down to a small pocket defender to remain concealed.I would open carry at times if allowed. I do when in the woods hunting up some food. I can see where some certain people could be seen as "up to no good" if carrying open, like hardheaded gang bangers or something, but freedom is freedom! No matter how your state regulates your right to arm yourself, I wish every law abiding citizen would arm themselves when out and about. The more armed people around, the more the criminals will think twice before commiting crime. Thats a fact jack.and think of how many crimes would be prevented if good people all around this great country carried and looked after one anothers personel safety. What a great way to promote the 2nd. amendment.
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