"Don't F**** With Me", Cop Sez' .......

Discussion in 'The Fire For Effect and Totally Politically Incorr' started by JohnHenry, Jul 21, 2011.

  1. JohnHenry

    JohnHenry Well-Known Member

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  2. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    I've got two questions.

    Ignoring the whole part about the gun and the ***hole cop that needs to be fired, sued and put in jail.

    What is this "driving around blacked out"? And why did they approach the car anyway? Is it illegal to stand on the street and talk in Ohio?
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2011
  3. Double D

    Double D Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Listen, I am on the side of the law. I agree that officers have to take risks seriously. This cop is a complete a$$ and should be fired immediately. He is a loose cannon and should not be allowed to carry a firearm. A mental evaluation is in order and anger management classes are a must. The citizens in that county are at risk.
  4. cycloneman

    cycloneman Active Member

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    He needs to get l**d. A vacation, and a new job cuase he aint fit for this. And what is the big deal. If your a cop you have to assume everyone you pull over is armed and then address that first. Here in my neck of the woods all cops assume we have guns cause we usually do.

    I did not hear one thing whatsoever that would lead that cop to act like that.
  5. RunningOnMT

    RunningOnMT New Member

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    I agree with everyone that this cop was a bozo that has watched too many Dirty Harry movies and should be fired. He in fact is the one who is unqualified to carry a gun, and I do believe what he said to that driver might constitute a felony.

    That said if I were giving a CCW class, I would instruct a student to ignore the officers order to shut up and state loud and clear that I was licensed by the state of Ohio to carry and conceal, and that I was presently armed. The only thing this driver did wrong was he failed to be forceful enough. Yes you are told to obey an LEO's instructions, but people don't usually get shot for failing to obey an order to shut up, and it's better to piss the cop off for a second than to not make sure he knows you are armed.

    Alpo, "blacked out" means without headlights on. And as far as standing on the street talking, unfortunately this is the sad state of affairs in which we find ourselves, and it isn't just in Ohio. Just watch a few episodes of Cops and you will see this all the time. People are accused of soliciting or looking to buy drugs merely for being in the "wrong" neighborhood at the wrong time.
    People are stopped, detained, and then ordered out of an area with the warning, "If I see you out here again, you're going to jail." A violation of so many amendments to the constitution it isn't funny.
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2011
  6. carver

    carver Moderator

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    Like a lot of you, I too have a CCW. While I am in support of our LEO's, they are people too, and prone to failures, just like the rest of us. I live in TX, and this state is another State that requires CCW holders to notify the LEO that he/she is armed. The LEO's in this situation did a lot of things wrong, IMHO. So did the CCW holder! Now we all know that Cops dirve around in bad neighborhoods blacked out, looking for criminal activity. My question is why was this CCW holder in a bad neighborhood, where he didn't live, and why was he talking to a known prostitute, and pimp? While I don't condone the LEO's actions, or words, I have some serious doubts as to the CCW holder as well. Because I do have a CCW I don't go to bars, I don't go into bad neighborhoods, I don't look for prostitutes, and I don't hunt for trouble! I will notify any LEO that I am armed first, and foremost! The CCW holder in this story had his permit in his hand, and could have offered it to the LEO who was standing by the drivers door while the other one was searching the back seat. A bunch of mistakes were made here by both parties. The LEO's, IMHO, did over react, and the words spoken by the one officer should get him fired.
  7. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    Apparently I was unclear. I know what "blacked out" meant. But, it is illegal, everywhere in this country, to drive after dark with your lights off. My question was meant as, "Why in the hell are the cops doing that?" It is like driving on the left side of the road, or driving 100mph in a school zone. It's illegal for a reason. It's dangerous.

    I guess I was the only one that did not know that "Now we all know that Cops dirve around in bad neighborhoods blacked out, looking for criminal activity". Silly me, I expect the police to obey the laws they are supposed to be enforcing.
  8. carver

    carver Moderator

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    Alpo, you know as well as I do that Cops are above the law! They do what they want. Watch the film, and you will see them run the stop sign too! How many times have I seen a cop on his way to doghnuts, and coffee, driving 10-20 mph over the speed limit. In heavy traffic I've seen them run their light to get thru traffic faster. Speed limits are there for a reason. Yes it is illegal to drive at night with your lights off, the reason for this action, according to the LEO's, is to get up close before the bad guys know they are there. But since they get to say what is, or is not the law, they do pretty much as they like. Not all Cops think this way, but enough of them do to give the rest a bad name. LEO's should have to obey the same laws that the rest of us do. But who will hold them accountable?
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2011
  9. dad2thebone

    dad2thebone New Member

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    Yea you would think it's a no-no for cops to do that but its taught and done by almost all Leos. Blacking out is just sneaking up. they cause a TC (wreck) it's on them. After a review this loudmouth either got suspended or fired and most likely a lawsuit. For my safety and because it gets attention quick i put both hands on the dash till they get close then tell em im armed.Makes em wonder why so they ask. works for me.
  10. cycloneman

    cycloneman Active Member

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    1. We dont know what this guy was doing talking to a whore and pimp. Maybe he was offering Christ word? I see it all the time down here in New Orleans. In fact they come from all over the country, they tear down the old flooded houses, rebuild them for free and take away jobs from local contractors, like me. God bless them! :rolleyes: They talk to the scum as if they are safe or something. They go into the worst parts of town. Brave and stupid, but i guess they are fullfilling some need in their head. I look at them as zoo keepers.

    2. Maybe he was lost. Happened to me. Had a cop ask me lots of questions one night cause i was on a crack alley street. How the heck did I know. Happens.
  11. cycloneman

    cycloneman Active Member

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    As far as this cops attitude is concerned he come across as dominate. He is better than you. He is portraying being bigger than the driver. His insults are hostile. He says something to the effect that the driver shouldn't even go outside amoung the rest of the public. He has in his mind allready shot and killed the driver when he tell him he outta pump 10 rounds in him.

    This isnt just a bad day for this individual. No one in their right mind would talk to someone like this. In my opinion he was threatning the drivers life and I would fault the driver if he pulled his gun and blew this POS away. Thats right after seeing this video, hearing what i heard, sitting on a jurly, i would let the driver walk.

    When I was young real young I was hit over the head with a gun and told that i would have one pumped in my head. I walkd from that, God willing. But I tell you one thing Jack, if anyone says to me your gona get led pumped in you, it's on, one of us aint walking away.
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2011
  12. 45nut

    45nut New Member

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    Officer placed on admin leave

    From the article:

    Once the investigation into Harless is completed he will face a disciplinary hearing, Police Chief Dean McKimm told WJW.

    “I think it’s important for citizens to understand that the behavior demonstrated on the video is wholly unacceptable, and it violates many of our rules, our regulations and standards we demand of our officers,” the chief told the Repository.
  13. Double D

    Double D Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

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    If they dont get rid of this guy while they have a chance, it will come back to bite them later. I would go as far to say he will shoot and kill someone someday soon and cover it up. He has serious anger issues. If pumping 10 rounds into someone for legally carrying a firearm wouldnt cause you to loose some sleep, you are a danger to the people you are payed to protect. I can agree with the citizen feeling like his life was being threatened and shooting the cop. It was a close call.
  14. lawdawg

    lawdawg Member

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    My opinion, as a fellow cop, is this was very unprofessional behavior on the part of the LEO. I think he made a stupid, rookie mistake by searching the car with the driver still inside (a real no-no), and reality slapped him hard when he realized the driver was armed. He felt stupid for his blunder and became angry with himself and projected that anger on the driver, essentially blaming the driver for his own mistake.

    That said, let me say this; he had every right, and even a duty, to investigate what would constitute suspicious activity. Being in an area known for illegal activity (ie, prostitution, drugs, etc) and talking to a known prostitute and pimp or drug dealer, especially at late hours is suspicious. That doesn't mean anything illegal was going on and, as one poster stated, he could have been sharing Christ with them. But the officers still have an obligation to investigate. And sometimes we have to take certain controversial but necessary measures (like 'blacking out" and sneaking up on a suspect) to do our job. I don't buy that the driver was just talking to her because he knew her previously. I mean, c'mon, really?

    The cop lost control. Period. He let his emotions, his anger, his fear, get the best of him. It happens, we're humans. But he never regained control over his own emotions and went over the line in my opinion. Had he yelled and cursed for a second, calmed down and went on, he would probably have been OK. But he wouldn't let up on the guy, and the guy had done nothing to deserve it. Yeah, he was there to buy a hooker, so what? You gotta deal with these kinds of people when you're a cop. It's what we do. If you can't rationally deal with these people in these situations, you should find another line of work. He was armed but he tried to tell the cop he had a CCW. The cop cut him off, which is another rookie mistake. You let people talk, you would be surprised what they will tell you. They teach this in the academy.

    The cop needs some re-training at the least. Anger management would be a good idea, perhaps. Maybe a suspension if this is his first legitimate complaint, termination if this is an on-going problem. The driver needs to have his CCW reinstated (assuming he lost it) and an apology from the officer.

    I wish I could say that I never lost my cool on the job. But I don't think any of us, non-law enforcement included, can say that. But this cop went way over the line and needs to be disciplined in my opinion.


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  15. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    Is that another example of "cops are different"?

    If I told a cop that I was going to kill him. Threatened to shoot him ten times. With the language and threats used on that tape. Would they say, "Alpo needs training to handle his anger issues"? Would they think that maybe firing me from my job was sufficient?

    No.

    I'd go to jail. I'd be put on trial and found guilty of attempted murder and sent to jail. Aggravated assault at the very least.

    But because this piece of crap is a cop, he should not be tried. He should be "counseled", and possibly "let go". And that's enough.
  16. Nighthawk

    Nighthawk New Member

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    true - two way justice. One law for us and another law for them.
  17. jlloyd73

    jlloyd73 New Member

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    They need to fire this cop immediately and he should face criminal charges...... hopefully a felony so that he cannot own a firearm EVER.

    The reason being is that IMO any type of complaint about this officer will more than likely be true.

    God forbid this cop actually shoot someone in the line of duty. Can you honestly say that after seeing this video that this is a honest law abiding LEO? IMO opinion based on what he says to the lady and this guy.....that this cop would shoot someone for no reason and do everything he could to cover it up......and from what he said, his partner would cover for him too.
  18. Double D

    Double D Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Im with ya on this one alpo. You are dead on.
  19. lawdawg

    lawdawg Member

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    Actually I get threats on my life regularly. We used to be able to arrest someone for disorderly conduct or harassment (both a low-level misdemeanor in Alabama) if they verbally threatened our lives, but the courts have ruled that we, as public servants, should have "thicker skin" and these cases get thrown out of court now. So we pretty much have to take and go on. Verbally threatening someone, and actually doing a physical act in an attempt to harm someone, are completely different.

    The cop was WRONG, Period. No two ways about it. But he never laid a hand on the guy as far as I can tell from the video. He cussed and threatened the guy repeatedly, even threatening to pull his "Glock .40" and kill the guy. But he never pulled his gun, so far as I know. I don't know about the laws in Ohio, but that's not a felony anywhere I know of.

    If you were tried and found guilty of attempted murder for verbally threatening to shoot someone, without ever even pulling a weapon, then you have a pretty bad attorney.

    I don't know about the laws where you live, but here is my choice of charges when a verbal threat is given:

    Section 13A-11-7 — Disorderly conduct.(a) A person commits the crime of disorderly conduct if, with intent to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, he:
    (1) Engages in fighting or in violent tumultuous or threatening behavior; or
    (2) Makes unreasonable noise; or
    (3) In a public place uses abusive or obscene language or makes an obscene gesture; or
    (4) Without lawful authority, disturbs any lawful assembly or meeting of persons; or
    (5) Obstructs vehicular or pedestrian traffic, or a transportation facility; or
    (6) Congregates with other person in a public place and refuses to comply with a lawful order of the police to disperse.
    (b) Disorderly conduct is a Class C misdemeanor.

    Section 13A-6-23 — Menacing. (a) A person commits the crime of menacing if, by physical action, he intentionally places or attempts to place another person in fear of imminent serious physical injury.
    (b) Menacing is a Class B misdemeanor.

    This would only apply if the person physically pulled a weapon

    Section 13A-11-8 — Harassment(a)(1) HARASSMENT. A person commits the crime of harassment if, with intent to harass, annoy, or alarm another person, he or she either:
    a. Strikes, shoves, kicks, or otherwise touches a person or subjects him or her to physical contact.
    b. Directs abusive or obscene language or makes an obscene gesture towards another person.(2) For purposes of this section, harassment shall include a threat, verbal or nonverbal, made with the intent to carry out the threat, that would cause a reasonable person who is the target of the threat to fear for his or her safety.(3) Harassment is a Class C misdemeanor.

    ALL EMPHASIS MINE

    Note that all these are misdemeanors. And there's no statute that I know that would elevate any of these offenses if the victim is a cop. Physically assaulting a cop is a felony, verbally threatening him isn't. Assault requires injury. But again, this happened in Ohio, and I'm quoting Alabama law.


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    Last edited: Jul 22, 2011
  20. Hatch

    Hatch Former Guest

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    I would agree excepting that assault is the threat of violence, battery is either the attempt or fruition of it.

    now... with that in mind, once you've been threatened by someone who says they want to take out their .40 and plug you... should you have utmost concern for your safety or theirs?

    He's lucky he's a cop, or at least was a cop when he made those statements, if he tried that crap on a lot of people that actually choose to obey the law and expect not to be assaulted for it, he might have some serious problems. Well, his estate might have serious problems... because once you take it to the level of "pull my .40" then it's basically self defense.

    If he doesnt lose his job I'd be amazed.
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