Eeek! It's a Mouse Gun!

Discussion in 'Self Defense Tactics & Weapons' started by Pistolenschutze, Nov 16, 2005.

  1. Having read these boards for a few weeks, I get the impression that most of you subscribe to the (not invalid!) theory that for self-defense, bigger is usually better. Lots of you, for example, seem to prefer the .45 ACP above all other calibers, especially if it resides in a 1911 Colt or Kimber. I think some of you would carry a 155mm howitzer if you you could figure out a way to hide and tote it! :D OK, I can buy that, at least in general. Given a choice in a gun fight, I too prefer the greatest amount of firepower I can muster. But, I would argue, carrying that kind of firepower is often not practical, nor is it always even possible given the real-world lives we all must live each day. Does anyone out there agree with me that there is a place for the so-called "mouse guns" in the scheme of things, at least from time to time? Granted, these cartridges and the firearms which use them are positively NOT the best and most efficient choice, but wouldn't you agree they're a damn sight better than nothing? As a college instructor, I often find myself in situations where I wish to go armed, but carrying anything larger than a small Beretta auto simply isn't possible. A Glock 30 in a shoulder or belt holster tends to be hard to conceal with one's coat off! Wouldn't want to give the ol' college pres a coronary, now would we? Might be inimical to my continued employment :rolleyes:

    As for me, when I find myself in that situation, I will usually carry a Beretta 3032 (.32 ACP) or a Beretta 21 (.25 auto) in a pocket or entirely-inside-and-below-the-pant-line rig. What are some of your choices of firearm/holster combinations for this kind of situation?
  2. Deputy Dawg

    Deputy Dawg Active Member

    When it has to be small a Beretta Mod 21- 22LR or a Auto-Nine 22 LR very small about the size of a Baby Browning.

  3. JohnK3

    JohnK3 New Member

    May 5, 2003
    I'll agree that bigger is not *always* better.

    I like the .32 ACP or the .380 (aka 9mm Kurz) for small pocket autos. For a revolver, I like small .32 H&R or, preferably, a .38 Special.

    I rarely carry. Usually, when I do, it's easy to plan ahead to wear the Kimber (it's a 1911, remember) on my hip along with a couple of spare mags. My wife, who doesn't have her CCW, yet, will most likely carry her CZ75 in 9mm after she does. Since she carries a purse (not an insubstantial one!) it will be a good choice, provided she switches to a decent CCW purse. There are several models out there, hopefully she'll find one she likes.

    Pistolenschutze, it's more a case of a difference in methodology, rather than an outright discarding of your ideas. Your ideas are fine, but they don't fit everyone. They fit you and that's as it should be. Use what works for you. Share what works for you, but if it doesn't get adopted by everyone, then no biggie.

    Personally, I'm seriously looking at options for a pocket pistol of some sort. Probably go with a wheelgun, as there are some very good options out there that pack plenty of punch in a small package. I'll probably go with a .38Spc, however, rather than the lesser calibers, as there's lots of choices that will fit in a back pocket, not print and provide the needed authority in a tight spot.
  4. pickenup

    pickenup Active Member

    I always carry a NAA 22 in my front pocket. At home, at work, everywhere.

    Unlike you, I have no place that I have to go, that I can’t carry something larger. When I go out, I carry a SIG 220 or 226 on the belt. Shirt covers it just fine. I have been known to also throw a Colt 380 in my back pocket, depending on what part of town I was going into.

    I did have one time when I went to “check” on the times when a CDL physician could do physicals to renew my license. I was just checking mind you, and she said, “Come on in” I had the time, and needed to get it done, so I did. I “forgot” that I was packing until she said to take off my shirt. I thought, oh cr@p, no way around it now. So I told her that I didn’t want to surprise her, and that I had a license for it, and showed her it was there. Turned out OK, she was an x marine, and had no problem with it at all.
  5. I couldn't agree with you more, John. What weapon to carry and how to carry it are indeed a highly personal choices, and the circumstances bearing on those choices vary greatly from individual to individual. My only point here was to pull a few branches and see what fell out of the tree. Like you, 95% of the time I carry something far more potent than the little Berettas, most often a Glock in .40 S&W or .45 ACP. It is both fun and interesting though, to see how others feel about any firearms or self-defense issue. I learned long ago that helpful information can come from any quarter, and that sometimes the best solution to a problem is the one you never even considered. That's what I like so much about this forum. Well articulated and politely expressed views by intelligent and well-experienced people. It doesn't get much better than that!
  6. tom vito

    tom vito New Member

    Nov 1, 2005
    Personally I agree with you, that bigger is better, but smaller is better than nothing at all. I always carry my Kel-Tec .380, even if I am carry something bigger also. It is so light, so small, and yet so controlable, it has become one of my favorite carry weapons. To be honest, I have carried heavier knives......
  7. 45Smashemflat

    45Smashemflat Active Member

    Oct 6, 2003
    First rule of gunfighting - have a gun....

    When weather and clothing permit, I carry either a 5" or 3" 1911. Having said that, the most carried piece I have is a Ti Smith 38SPL J Frame. Typically in a front pocket in a Kramer pocket holster. Sometimes in an ankle rig by Ken Null.

    Attached Files:

  8. Country101

    Country101 Well-Known Member

    Feb 28, 2004
    NW AR
    If I had a samller gun, I might wear it, but I'd stick with my Full sized Kimber 95% of the time. I'm thinkin about getting the Kimber Compact Stainless soon and that'll be as small as I go for quite a while. I'll probably always carry IWB. It best fits the way I dress(jeans and a t-shirt), so I might as well carry all I can. Another reason I haven't considered a small pocket pistol is simply the fact that I haven't found one that will be as easy to field strip as my 1911 and I dont think they would fit my hand very well. I am open to the option though if something comes along.
  9. That's a nice piece, 45Smashemflat! Love the grips on it. Where did you get them? I must admit, I too am very fond of the J-frame Smiths and often carry a 637 Airweight with Ahearn wood grips in a Kramer MSP. Isn't it funny though, how we all seem to prefer to carry a larger and more powerful handgun, but so often end up with the little J-frames because they are so light and handy?

    LIKTOSHOOT Advanced Senior Member

    Apr 26, 2001
    Cry me a river.......big and slow doesn`t mean uncontrolled! You show your inability for thought inside the box.

  11. 45Smashemflat

    45Smashemflat Active Member

    Oct 6, 2003
    The smith is all stock, purchased during the "America Hates S&W Days" when a dealer was "cutting his losses." This one is pre-key lock. The grips are Hogue, but came on the gun from the factory. I bobbed hammer and checkerd its top myself. Great little gun. I must point out though, that if I'm carrying this, there is something bigger close by in the car or truck....
  12. When I was shopping for a .38 snubbie I almost chose the S&W 638 (with a shrouded hammer) or the Centennial with a bobbed hammer, over the 637 Chief's Special with the exposed hammer. I ended up choosing the 637 primarily because I really like having single action capability available as an option, even though it is seldom used. Like you, I think a .38 snubbie is almost certainly going to be used double action, rapid fire in any "real world" encounter, but still, having the lighter trigger pull available--for me at least--outweighs the no-snag advantages of the bobbed or shrouded hammer. The weapon came with Uncle Mike's boot grips on it, but I had a pair of Ahearn woods available and put them on to spruce it it. I'm glad I did. Surprisingly, the walnut Ahearns (which are in boot grip configuration) actually seem to absorb recoil better than the Uncle Mike's rubber grips. Even +P ammo (which is what I usually carry in it) does not create excessive felt recoil. Like you, though, I always have something a bit more potent available close at hand should I chance to encounter cave bears, saber-tooth tigers, or gigantic pteradactyls. :D
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2005
  13. 45Smashemflat

    45Smashemflat Active Member

    Oct 6, 2003
    Yeah, the hogues fit good. Since its titanium, its pretty "snappy" with +P's, but not too bad. The titanium 45ACP is a different story!

    I bobbed the hammer to make pocket draws more reliable. But, the top of the hammer is checkered. So, you can start the hammer back with the trigger, and then finish cocking it for single actin fire with your thumb.

    I like the ability to go single action, if necessary. No, this is not a long range gun - but I know of at least one police shooting where the lawman went prone, and center punched the perp with a snub shot single action out around 20-30 yds. If you HAD to take a long range poke, might as well cock it first and increase your chances of a hit.
  14. user_error

    user_error New Member

    Dec 19, 2005
    I do agree that big is good, as it only stands to reason that a cannonball has better stopping power than a golf ball. As my gun salesman and friend pointed out to my on my first purchase, when my wife showed interest in one of those cute little .22 revolvers, "That gun is the most dangerous gun in the world. A woman carrying that is as good as dead!" Indeed, I look at .22s as, aside from when they're the only choice as necessary for their size, as more of a murder weapon than a defense weapon, with the stopping power of a pea-shooter.

    However, my wife and I both carry 9mm., she a Steyr S9 and I a Beretta 92FS.

    Definitely not the most power out of a weapon.

    But there is more to this than meets the eye. If I were to pull a .45 Colt revolver and hit my PCP-jacked assailant in the hand, or foot, or even lower abdomen, or even miss 2 or 3 times, I've failed to deliver suitable stopping power and so am still endangered with a threat that has *not* been neutralized. Yes, he may be without a hand, but ask your best inner-city beat cop friend how effective that is at stopping "hoppers".

    So, the solution is to get better with my weapon. And the only way of doing that is range experience. No one will EVER be effective with their chosen weapon without at LEAST 200 rounds fired downrange. .45 and .44 mag are NOT cheap! If I had the wherewithal to shoot dollar bills down the firing range I might carry a .45, but for all practical purposes, Wallmart's 10 cent winchester 9mm range bullets are just the ticket. Now I can spend about 10-15 dollars per visit to the range, rather than 70-80 bucks of a higher-cal. weapon. Not to mention the fact that my thin, graceful, elegant wife would probably crack her wrist with a snub-nose .44. Now, even though 9's don't deliver the power of a .40-plus, I can hit a 5 inch group every time at 25 yards. Stopping power isn't all in the cal. It's also about placement, and quantity.

    That is why my wife and I carry 9's. They're cheap to practice, so we're very experienced without impoverishing ourselves, and they're still a decent bullet with the hydrashocks and other defense loads available. Nothing against you .45 ers, but until I start crapping money I'll stick with the 9mm and hit the range 3 times a week.
  15. 358 winchester

    358 winchester *TFF Admin Staff*

    Apr 25, 2004
    Pensacola Fl. area
    Mouse Gun never will nor have or plan to carry one :confused:
    I do however carry a DOCTOR GUN 90% of the time that I don't have a 357 or a 45 on.
    DOCTOR GUN in simple terms is one that I will place in the EAR, EYE or NOSE before I pull the trigger, NAA in 22 LR with CCI QUIK-SHOK or my Colt 25 with Speer GOLD DOTS
    now you call it a mouse gun if you want but I call it a Doctor gun and when used as the correct tool it will get the job done :eek: :D

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