Failed 30-06 cases

Discussion in 'The Ammo & Reloading Forum' started by LDBennett, Sep 28, 2011.

  1. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    Yes this bunch of 30-06 brass was originally corrosively primed but those primer went in the trash even before they were used.

    Some 20 years ago I got loaded ammo from the friend, picked up at a gun show as unfired MIL surplus ammo in a cloth bandolier, some heavily water stained. I pulled it all apart including removing the primers. The first shooting of the brass was with modern Winchester primers, Hodgdon powders, and Winchester bulk bullets. These cases never were fired with corrosive primers. They are (were, as they are now trashed) almost 70 years old with many reloads in a semi-auto gun. They need not make any excuses! They did their job admirably!

    LDBennett
  2. gdmoody

    gdmoody Moderator Supporting Member

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    LD, I will say that you got some good service out of that brass. I don't shoot my Garand as much as I should and I will try to remedy that soon. I have some 8mm (VZ-24, Hakim, and M48) rifles that I need to take out and exercise, too.

    Speaking of picking up brass, I have an L1A1 that throws the stuff 30 or 40 feet away if you don't regulate the gas right. I also go through the trash cans at my range every time I go and have gotten very lucky at times. Not too long ago I picked up about 300 .223 brass out of one of the cans. Most likely it was once fires because of the empty .223 boxes in the can with the brass.
  3. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    How did you do that?

    I've got some Korean ought six that's corrosive. My plan was to deprime and reprime with new primers, but I'm having trouble with the depriming.

    I'm a little leery of doing it at normal speed, and doing it slowly does not seem to want to push the primers though the crimp. Instead it stretches the primer.
  4. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    Alpo:

    Of course pulling the bullet (and discarding them) is easy. De-priming is harder.

    On MIL Surplus brass the primer pockets are crimped so getting the primers out can be difficult. I just lean hard on the handle using the sizing die. Getting a run on the primer is absolutely the wrong thing to do as the live primer is certain to go off. A long steady but heavy pull is the way for me.

    I do NOT recommend this to others but it is what I do. If you choose to follow my process do clear the bench and the surrounding area of any powder or new primers. I suggest very heavy safety glasses or even goggles. Also wear hearing protection. I have removed many hundreds of live primers over the years and have yet to have one go off but better safe than sorry.

    You are then left with empty crimped primer pockets. There are many tools that will re-form them to accept new primers in a normal fashion. I have used a primer forming tool by Dillon with mixed results (more on that if you wish via PM). I have used a garage countersink tool but you have to go pretty deep to get all of the crimp removed. I had to use a plug gage to be sure the crimp was all gone. There are specific tools by RCBS and others that can do an adequate job as well. If all the crimp is not removed it may screw up new primers as they enter the pockets and get caught on the remainder of the crimp.

    LDBennett
  5. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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  6. jim brady

    jim brady Well-Known Member

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    OUCH!!!!! "Pulling the bullet and discarding them is easy"....... (Hard to type with tears in your eyes).

    I pull-down old German 8X57mm ammo - 1935 and 1936 production. I use the powder charge and bullet, just a new commercial primer and case. The primers are corrosive and most are hang-fire, so I don't use the old cases. Guys at Gun Shows love to buy them up, so I recoup my expense. Still have six sealed cases for future use.

    Just to add - these reloaded charges and bullets perform very well, even figuring on the old powder. I just have an old 98K with issue sights, but they all stay in the black at 100 yards within 3 or 4 inches.

    On de-priming live crimped in primers, that's a different critter. I think I'd snap the live primers in one session in an easy-to-clean bolt action. I'm on your side when it comes to depriming live primers, except in this situation where they are crimped in.
  7. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    Oh. I didn't even see the "discarding them" part. Ouch is right. Yeah, I've pretty much come to the conclusion that I'll just pop the primers in an ought three. Not what I want to do, but better than shooting corrosive through the Garand.
  8. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    A couple of things on this gift ammo from 20 years ago:

    Pulling bullets often leaves them marked and distorted. For that reason alone I would not re-use them.

    The primers were, of course, corrosive and I would not use them in any of my guns.

    Most all of these 1943 cartridges had suffered some kind of water intrusion as most hard clumped up powder. The only reason I accepted these cartridges was for the cases. The outside of the brass showed signs of bad storage of some kind. This would be another reason not to use the primers.

    Hey, we do what we do for our own reasons and while I may not do what you would do, I reserve the right to do it my way. But I did explain my reasons above.

    LDBennett
  9. jim brady

    jim brady Well-Known Member

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    I'd NEVER question you or your reloading practices, LD. I have learned to respect your opinion and experiance. I pull my bullets with one of those kinetic pullers - leaves no marks. Shame about that old powder. That German stuff must have been stored pretty well as the powder is still fresh.

    Had some old Spanish 7X57 years back, Was gonna pull it down, but the powder had an ammonia smell to it so I dumped all of it. Couldn't believe the strong acidic smell that stuff had. Even began to corrode the brass cases.

    Sounds like that old GI .30 brass served you well. I love reloading the LC cases. Have had to switch over to Korean KE stuff recently. Good brass, too. Like I've told you many times before, I reload all my .30-06 to GI specs (M1 and M2). Jim
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2011
  10. The Duke

    The Duke New Member

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    I rarely discard pulled bullets unless they are deformed ...I use an inertia puller for everything... Some of the old mil-surp rounds have a bullet sealer applied that effectively holds like super glue...:eek:

    I found that screwing the seater collet down on my die, then using it in the press to push the bullet downward just a little, will break this sealent and a good whack with the puller drops it out....

    Of course the bullets are contaminated with the asphaltic sealer...tumbling doesnt get it all off...So I give them a soak in some laquer thinner...outside of course...Take them out after about 30mins soak...rub off the now softened sealant with rough cloth or steel wool and then put in the vibrator with a little polish...They will come out shining like new..:)..Good bangers or for foulers...

    Ive tried the RCBS Trim Mate for clearing the primer crimp, but found the Dillion Super Swage tool faster and more accurate...The Trim Mate is super for cleaning primer pockets, deburring and champhering, and cleaning the necks...I love it..
  11. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    The Duke:

    On some cases the Dillon tool works but according to their instructions and my experience you can have problems. It seems the thickness of the head (inside to outside) varies between manufacturing lots of the cases. Since the Dillon tool uses this head thickness to reference the swaging operation, the tool can over and under swage. I experienced this on some 308 Lake City brass and could not use the Dillon tool on the mixed lots. Even the same date head stamped brass had this problem.

    I resorted to using a countersink and my lathe to remove the crimp but had to use a correctly sized plug gage to make sure all the crimp was removed. The resultant counter shrunk part of the pocket was pretty deep looking to the eye but work fine. There are other hand tool out there but just the thought of doing 1000 cases by hand made my arthritis hurt.

    LDBennett
  12. The Duke

    The Duke New Member

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    Thanks for the info, LD...I have swaged a number of .308 Mil brass and havent noticed a problem,...yet......But then again, I never took time to measure the primer pockets either..;) If the primers went in easily enough and stayed there it OK that was good enough...:D...Most of the mil stuff I load for bangers (grandson loves to pull the trigger with M4 or DPMS AR.)..The 'good stuff' I ususally will load in commercial cases, pref. Winchester.

    I got several hundred Mil cases that I will need to swage soon, both .308 and 5.56 ....Although I seperate by manuf. , I dont go as far to seperate by year..I try to keep all LC , WCC and FC headstamp... anything else goes in a bucket by itself.

    Im nearly through sorting an almost full 5gal bucket of assorted 9mm that a friend gave me...Id say about 30% of this is mil...Being a cheep SOB, I will prob use the RCBS tool to remove the crimp on these rounds...I have used a hand held champher tool before I became 'mechanized".
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