Help on old Bowie knife ??

Discussion in 'Knives & Edged Items' started by OneFatCat, Mar 20, 2011.

  1. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    I purchased an old Bowie knife from an auction today and need a little help with the value and any other information I might could gather ...the knife on one side is stamped Columbia and on the other side says W. Glaze and Co ... I am assuming the Columbia is Columbia South Carolina ...the knife appears to be very old and in very good condition ...Ive read a little about this company and my thinking is that it may be a knife that was made back in the 1860's for the Rebel army ..does not have a sheath ...

    OFC
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
  2. Bill DeShivs

    Bill DeShivs Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,747
    Need much better pictures, but there is a 5% chance that it is even 20 years old.
  3. ozo

    ozo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2011
    Messages:
    3,477
    Location:
    Nashville TN
    FatCat
    Try to get some pics close up of any/all markings. Macro if possible.
  4. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    4,416
    Location:
    Goodyear, Arizona
    To my poor old eyes the grind and knife itself looks way too modern for the Civil war era.It looks almost identical to one I purchased in 1971.
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2011
  5. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    Ok guys here are some pictures hope this helps and thank you for the information ...
    OFC
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2011
  6. carver

    carver Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2008
    Messages:
    17,233
    Location:
    DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just we
    A quick internet search turned up this:

    http://military.feedfury.com/content/22173919-collecting-civil-war-antique-swords.html

    By William Davis

    Civil war antiques are popular with antique collectors, especially Civil War swords.
    Civil War antique collectors may differ on which swords are the most interesting to collect. The purpose of this article is to identify some of the major producers of Civil War swords, and some facts about each manufacturer.

    William Glaze

    William Glaze was an agent for the Ames company until 1851, when he started the Palmetto armory in South Carolina. He produced 2000 M1840 cavalry sabers and 526 light artillery sabers in 1852. Although these were all used by the Confederacy during the war, it's important to note that these were all regulation U.S. models made nine years before the war, and in no way should have the letters CSA on them. Most cavalry sabers are marked "Columbia, S.C." on one side, and some have Wm. Glaze & Co on the other side of the ricasso. The marks on the artillery sabers are unknown.

    You just may have a winner there!
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2011
  7. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    Thank you for the research and info Carver ..I am a civil war buff and live close to Gettysburg but I did not buy it to resale but becasue I thought it might have some significance as an old Bowie knife, maybe a civil war relic if I was lucky... but it would be great to know anything I can find out about it and a ball park value so I would appreciate any comments or info I can get

    OFC
  8. ozo

    ozo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2011
    Messages:
    3,477
    Location:
    Nashville TN
    It's a really nice Bowie.
  9. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    I also picked up on this fighting knife I think from WWII ..stamped RH PAL 36 ....I paid $35.00

    OFC
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
  10. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2001
    Messages:
    8,081
    Location:
    Indiana
    That PAL 36 is in pretty decent shape, about typical, and almost identical to the one I had and I paid $35 for mine without a sheath maybe 10 years ago and sold it with a sheath that did not match for $45 maybe 5 years ago and I kinda wish I hadn't. It was a pretty handy "utility" knife and probably would have made a good fighter.

    THAT model Pal was not issued or purchased by the government as a fighting knife but it IS a pretty typical example of a WWII era commercial knife made by PAL, Western Cutlery, Camillus, etc, and other companies loosely based on the Navy Mark 1 or 2 (Kabar) that COULD have been carried as a "Fighting Knife" by soldiers in WWII. They were sold in PXs all over the world, and soldiers also bought them mail order, and were popular. There are MANY photographs of front line US soldiers in WWII that if you look closely, you will see some sort of "commercial" knife on their belt or attached to a bandolier or back pack.

    PAL DID provide both M3 Combat Knives and later M4 bayonets to the US military under contract, as well as Mark II Navys/Kabars, but that is not an "actual" US Military "Fighting Knife."

    When I bought mine I THOUGHT it might have been a Navy Mk I, and did some research, MANY companies made Mark Is and each is a LITTLE different from the others, before it was standardized or shifted to the Mark II, but the PAL 36 was an actual PAL commercial model.

    But it COULD have been USED as one.
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2011
  11. Bill DeShivs

    Bill DeShivs Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,747
    The "bowie" is modern, as you found out.
  12. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    RJ I have been told by a couple of people that have looked at the pictures that it may be a replica ...however I was at an civil war weapons auction in Chambersburg PA. Monday where three different dealers (one being a college professor who lectures at the local college on civil war history) examined the knife and all three felt it was genuine and of the period. All three felt like the patina was right and the design was of the period. One of the men did take some issue with one of the stamps on the blade however after looking it over closely for 10 min. said he felt it was genuine and asked if it was for sale. To be honest Im not sure what to think right now. I can tell you that the dealers who have actually held it in their hands and looked at all feel that its a very old knife, whether its a knife that was made for the confederate army is something else.

    OFC
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2011
  13. Bill DeShivs

    Bill DeShivs Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,747
    Most dealers and "Civil War experts" and dealers have little or no knowledge of cutlery. That's why it's so easy to fool them. The design is nothing like period knives. "Patinas" are easily done. The blade shape, and bevel grind are very wrong for a CW era knife. These are things that the CW "experts" don't know, or conveniently overlook- because, like you, they want the knife to be what they think it is. This still doesn't make the knife what it isn't. You have been advised by some of the foremost CUTLERY experts in the world. Without even examining the knife personally, it's easy to tell what it is. There is simply no need for a hands-on examination.
  14. OneFatCat

    OneFatCat New Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    Frederick Maryland
    Bill I am sure your right ...I guess I will just give up on the idea that it might be genuine ...but just for the heck of it after being told by one of "foremost" experts that W. Glaze didnt even make Bowie knives and that this blade was not right for the period I called the South Carolina Relic Room at the Palmetto Armory today and talked with a man there by the name of Joe Long. I told Joe everything about the knife ..told him that some of you guys have said it was a fake just by looking at the pictures but I also told him what the 3 men told me yesteday. He asked me to send him pictures which I did ...first let me say that he confirmed that W. Glaze had been connected to making some Bowie knives this is an exert from an email he sent me today "Scott, this is NOT a poor-quality fake; I think I could spot one of those by now just looking at pictures ...Joe" ...after looking at the pictures he was impressed enough to ask my permission to forward them to a Col. Jack A. Myer who is an authority on the Palmetto Armory and has writtin a book on the subject ...now Im sure you and your freinds here are right because obviously this is your world and you are experts ...but it will be interesting to see what
    Col. Myer says even if it is negitive ..thank you again for all the information...its been fun anyway doing some research.

    OFC
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2011
  15. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    4,416
    Location:
    Goodyear, Arizona
    Please let us know what you find out, very interested.:)
Similar Threads
Forum Title Date
Knives & Edged Items Please help ID this bayonet Jul 5, 2013
Knives & Edged Items Help with date. Mar 19, 2013
Knives & Edged Items Help Identify this bayonet please! Jul 14, 2012
Knives & Edged Items Need some help finding info on this old Sheffield. May 10, 2012
Knives & Edged Items Machete pic, ID help please Dec 3, 2011

Share This Page