Help on Value and age of flintlock pistol

Discussion in 'The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Forum' started by CHUCKEYCITY13, Nov 19, 2012.

  1. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    Old flintlock no makers marks I can find any help with when where and how much thanks an advance for any and all help

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  2. rhmc24

    rhmc24 Member

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    From the pix with so little detail due to lack of lighting, I make it to be possibly French, early to mid 1700s. Looks like a real gun, not a tourist piece. From the little I can see of the fore end, it looks like it spent some time in the mid-East.

    If you can do some detail pix showing the lock, opposite the lock and the fore end out to the muzzle, it may be possible to be more specific about info. Some dimensions would help, lock, barrel, etc., I can only guestimate its size.

    In an advanced state of rust its chief value is as wall decor or maybe $300 for someone who might want it as a project.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  3. Buffalochip

    Buffalochip Member

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    Some things don't look right to me. It has an early gooseneck cock, but the barrel appears to be attached to the forestock with 3 tin wraps and the pins (the don't look like screws) holding the trigger guard are off center, and the butt cap appears to be poorly executed and nailed on. It is either very old but of utilitarian construction or possibly of mid East origin
  4. dcriner

    dcriner Member

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    On the left side, it looks like it is inleted for a sideplate that is missing or maybe never there. I would like to see an overall photo from the top of the gun. I'm wondering if the stock and lock are original to each other, but the barrel and trigger guard came from another gun.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  5. Hawg

    Hawg Active Member

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    It looks like a parts gun. The lock doesn't fit the inlet and neither does the trigger guard.
  6. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    Thanks for all the help here are some more pics hope they help

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  7. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    the item measures about 21 1/2" long
  8. dcriner

    dcriner Member

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    I fear that it's a parts gun, cobbled together. In the third of your new set of pix, notice how the hammer/flint are cockeyed compared to the frizzen. The design on the back of the frizzen is interesting - Arabic? Chinese? Are there any similar designs on other parts of the gun?
  9. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    Thanks to all for the help. The item was in a WWI US footlocker I guess a doughboy brought it back there were other souvenirs inside a German dagger, French bayonet and more. The item is a fun item. I can pull the hammer back and get it to spark.
  10. Jim K

    Jim K New Member

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    I think it is middle eastern, though probably intended as a real gun, not a souvenir.

    I would caution about associating the gun with its container. A WWI footlocker has been around for almost 100 years, long enough for anyone to put anything in it.


    Jim
  11. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    I am aware the footlocker has been around a while but doubt anything was added. The locker came out of the attic of a home at a farm sale the owners of the home didn't know it was there and I got it for 120.00 along with the souvenirs was the ID'd contents of the doughboy his helmet, uniforms, gasmask and bag all of his paper work photo album, shelter half, canteen and cover, Mills ammo belt, first aid packet,and medals and pins and badges also two pack of French cigarettes and more. The 1870's German Naval dagger though in rough condition sold for over 400.00, a WWI German helmet sold for 600.00 the French bayonet was a Remington Arms marked rollingblock I sold it for 135.00. I guess the pistol was something made up and sold as a souvenir. I have been dealing in WWI and WWII military items and have found some amazing souvenirs that were brought back my favorite was a 1000 to 800 BC bronze age spear head form Southern Europe. Thanks again for all the help.
  12. Jim K

    Jim K New Member

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    Well, the Germans might have been short of weapons in 1918, but .... ;)

    Jim
  13. CHUCKEYCITY13

    CHUCKEYCITY13 New Member

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    Jim I am not saying these items were captured from Germans not at all. I am saying that the items were brought back from Europe most likely France in the case of the Pistol and items mentioned here. I have a friend who brought home a Gutenberg Bible after WWII
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  14. rhmc24

    rhmc24 Member

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    At risk of being repetitive, in the first response to this thread - "I make it to be possibly French, early to mid 1700s. Looks like a real gun, not a tourist piece. From the little I can see of the fore end, it looks like it spent some time in the mid-East." I'll expand a little.

    It is common that mid-East pistols have metal bands around the barrel and fore end, in this case maybe put on for practical and/or decorative purpose. There isn't enough info to be critical of the lock or its fit to the wood - as seen, common in used and abused pistols. The nails in the trigger guard finial appear to be a repair. The side plate has had its forward half broken off, leaving the rear part showing more evidence (nails) of make-do repair. Note all the worn slots in the screw heads, indicating it's being taken apart many times.

    The lock itself is of good quality seeing the frizzen and frizzen spring held by internal screws. Note evidence of lock repairs: sear and sear spring screws, just pushing thru the lock plate and the other headed (riveted) on the outside. This lock originally had dead end screw holes that didn't come thru to the outside. Note also the little rectangle on the hammer just above its mount screw - likely a replaced hammer that had that rectangle used on its inside to arrest the fall of the hammer.

    It's an honest gun that was 'rode hard and put up wet'.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  15. Dog Soldier

    Dog Soldier New Member

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    That is one of those crude middle eastern pistols sold to tourist at the turn of the century. These things were junk put together with what ever parts they had. That lock is no way quality and it is also "Bridled" indicating it is not of the same period as the pistol.:rolleyes:
  16. Jim K

    Jim K New Member

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    I think the lockplate may be European, but the cock and the furniture are far too crude to be from any European shop. If even an apprentice turned out work like that the master smith would have told him to take up woodchopping. The lock is inset very badly, and looks as if it would break out of the stock with a few firings. But I don't really think it is a pure "non-gun" made for the tourist trade; I get the feeling it was intended to fire, even though with the touchhole eroded that large, doing so today would be dangerous.

    Jim
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