I am not saying a thing. Speaks for itself.

Discussion in 'The Fire For Effect and Totally Politically Incorr' started by cycloneman, Mar 3, 2010.

  1. cycloneman

    cycloneman Well-Known Member

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8547621.stm

    Wednesday, 3 March 2010 South Africa black-owned farms 'failing'



    In 1994 almost 90% of the land was owned by white South Africans

    Some 90% of farms redistributed to South Africa 's black population from white farmers are not productive, the government has said.



    Land reform minister Gugile Nkwinti warned the land might be repossessed if the farms continued to fail.



    Almost 60,000 sq km (23,000 sq miles) have been redistributed under policies aimed at benefiting black people who were left impoverished by apartheid. The land was bought from white farmers who sold up voluntarily.



    The BBC's Pumza Fihlani in Johannesburg says some black farmers are likely to argue that they have been struggling to get the resources and skills to develop their land. And repossessing the land would provide a whole new problem for the government, our correspondent says, as any move to return the land to its former white owners is bound to be controversial.



    Sensitive issue

    The government had set a target of 2014 to redistribute one-third of white-owned land back to the black majority.



    But Mr Nkwinti acknowledged that the deadline would not be kept. He said the focus would now shift to helping the black farmers make their land productive.



    "The farms - which were active accruing revenue for the state - were handed over to people, and more than 90% of those are not functional," he said. "They are not productive, and therefore the state loses the revenue. We cannot afford to go on like that... No country can afford that."



    At the end of apartheid in 1994 almost 90% of land was owned by the white community, which made up less than 10% of the population.



    Land reform is a sensitive issue in South Africa and has been brought into sharp focus by the decline of agriculture in neighbouring Zimbabwe , where many white commercial farmers have been violently evicted.
  2. Trouble 45-70

    Trouble 45-70 New Member

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    Maybe they need to put up Agricultural Colleges all over the Country and have agents visit farmers to help them learn the latest farm technology's that will work in S. Africa using the available resources. Extension agents can also visit the wives and teach skills they need as farm wives. The kids can go to the colleges and come out with new skills. Kind of like what worked so well in this country that the A&M colleges are still a major educational resource to the nation.
  3. bamajoey

    bamajoey Well-Known Member

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    Or they could give them back to white farmers and return to prosperity.
  4. Insulation Tim

    Insulation Tim Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    AMEN !

    They could also turn the country over to White Rule again and watch the nation return to prosperity and the horrid crime rate plummet.
  5. ponycar17

    ponycar17 Active Member

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    That's definitely a good thing. I've benefited from our local University cooperative on our little plot of land. They provide excellent services. I went to the same school but majored in something far from agriculture.

    And I think this is just further evidence that you cannot arbitrarily transfer wealth and expect prosperity. The white farmers had years of experience. Giving the land to black farmers without the same experiences (financial management, technology, etc.) is NOT going to produce prosperity over night. I think that the white farmers who sold are probably laughing all the way to the bank right now. Good intentions do not always equal good results. Government always wants to do what is perceived as the "right thing" only to get re-elected. Their constituents are often too damn stupid to realize how wrong their decisions may be. All too often, their "right thing" is the "WRONG THING" in the long run prosperity of their constituents.
  6. Old Grump

    Old Grump New Member

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    I'm pretty sure it was Bush's fault, let me check with Obama. Whole thing happened to fast without a management training program in place and the technical know how it was doomed to failure. Haste makes waste, always.

    Zimbabwe formerly Rhodesia is in the same pickle barrel but in worse shape. Proving once again rule by Communists carrying guns is a disaster happening.
  7. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

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    Why were these farms re-distributed to black people?
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2010
  8. Old Grump

    Old Grump New Member

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    Public Relations, legal speak for spin to get sympathy from liberals and dopes...or do I repeat myself.
  9. Marlin T

    Marlin T Active Member

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    OH YA, like that is what really happened, pffft.

    Would YOU just give up your farm?
    Thats what I thought.

    Is this the Hope and Change that is coming to place near you? After all, that is what spreading the wealth really boils down to.
  10. Maximilian II

    Maximilian II New Member

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    40 acres and a mule, with a chicken in every pot.
  11. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Hey, isn't getting rid of the horrid Apartheid worth a little sacrifice and starvation?
  12. cycloneman

    cycloneman Well-Known Member

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    OK OK I know i wasn't going to say anything but I love these people so much i just can't stand it. Now, if you can't feed your self in you own country much less in any other country what good are you? I dont want to hear its because of a lack of education. They have been on this planet as long as everbody else. No excuses. Look at Haiti vs their neighbors. I don't want to hear it, stop making excuses for these people.
  13. ponycar17

    ponycar17 Active Member

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    Well, actually it is... Running a farm is so much more than growing stuff. Modern farms have to also run their business affairs well. Remember that these people are competing with importers just as we are in the US. It's truly a complex business these days.

    Now, why don't they have that knowledge? That's up to individual interpretation. ;)
  14. red14

    red14 Active Member

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    I think it proves that change, just for the sake of change, usually doesn't work.

    I think that farming is just about the hardest job on the planet, except maybe a soldier/sailor. Farmers work hard, all day. Anybody just can't do it. It takes a special person to work 18 hours EVERY DAY, to make a living.
  15. Gun Geezer

    Gun Geezer Well-Known Member

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    I would guess that during the Apartheid years south african blacks were kept suppressed and undereducated to the point that they do not have the "tools" to work the farms to profitability. It will take more than redistribution of land and government give-aways to make successful farmers out of what amounted to slaves living in their own country. What's hard to understand is how democratic liberals can expect different outcomes by welfare, entitlement programs and give-aways to the poor and uneducated in this country.
  16. cycloneman

    cycloneman Well-Known Member

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    Well I don’t see it the way others see it. I think somewhere somehow somebody saw a log on the forest floor and got the idea of the wheel. I don't believe that idea came anywhere from Africa. Just saying. Some people have the ability to make things easier for themselves with some basic engineering. For example carrying water from the stream you pee in to the camp in wooded buckets on top of your head is an example of not using your brain. But I am sure there are people who still live like this today. Why? I don't know why you would want to live this way. I wonder what made that first person strain his brain to get out of such a mess. Others seem fine with drinking in the same hole they pee in.

    All I am saying is for thousands of years we have all been on this planet. Some people have decided to make rafts and boats to get around. They probably came to the conclusion to make a boat after they saw a log float in the stream where they pee. Somebody scratched their head and had an idea. Again I am going out on a limb and saying it did not happen in Africa.

    Same thing goes with math; you know 1 + 1 = 2 and so forth. I don’t believe math came from Africa. So it is no surprise to me that these people in history got by very simple. No body cared to strain their brain while they were on lunch break down by the river they pee in.

    I guess my point now is this. In 50 more years will Africans be able to farm on their own? Good question don't you think?

    So what if farming is a hard job. Boo hoo. Your not going to tell me to cut them some slack because they haven't educated themselves are you? Or that since you have to work 18 hours a day it's just too hard for a poor black man to do. Yea you gotta check the soil for ph. Yea,,,,, you gotta disc it up. Yea,,,,,, you gotta fertilize it. You gotta know how much to use. Now someone needs to know how to work that dreaded math. Yea,,,,, you gotta buy and plant the seeds. Yea,,,,, you gotta do the rain dance to the gods of water for rain. Yea,,,,,, cause you know there is just not enough workers to carry water from the stream you pee in to the crops. Oh gee! Then if the daw gone crop actually grows you gotta get someone to pick the darn things. That's if there are no bugs that got to them. Yea it's a bitch! Here is an idea just let the white man feed you. Cause working sucks!

    How long do you think it would take the African nation (with no help of course) to put a man on the moon? Go ahead I dare you to answer that one. In fact I am gona send that question to Alex Trebeck to put on Jeopardy.

    It's not their fault cause they didn't have the same chances.

    It's not their fault cause they didn't get an education.

    It's not their fault cause the white man made them slaves.

    It's not their fault cause gravity doesn't work in Africa.

    It's not their fault cause they weren't given enough.

    It's not their fault cause they didn't have the same god.

    It's not their fault cause it's too hot in Africa

    It's not their fault cause the white man outlawed math books in Africa

    It's not their fault cause they dont have a Wall mart to rip off tennis shoes from.

    It's not their fault cause they were put here on earth later then the rest of us.

    It's not their fault causa causa causa.....

    Now watermelons have to be imported to Africa from Mexico

    :rolleyes:
  17. 45nut

    45nut Active Member

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    Well Dayum cyclone, just get it out of your system. Been in LA too long?? :eek: :D :D

    [​IMG]

    Well, Dr Manning, who is black, asked where are all the contributions of Black Africa like great cities & civilizations, inventions, great writings, etc? They don't exist. Look at the state of affairs in every African nation being led by blacks.

    The Africans are now living in slums or shanty towns. The ever popular grass hut before that while still living in hunter/gatherer societies with no appreciable change in societal structure since before Christ. Their society has changed some in the last 200 years, but as soon as some Tootsie's and Hutu's get close to one another and someone has a machete, blood will be spilled. They are eons behind in basic societal evolution.

    The greatest achievements of Negro's have come in America since the abolition of slavery, present POTUS excepted.
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2010
  18. Willie

    Willie Active Member

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    I think it is simple. It is the "W" word again. No.......not white.....the word is WORK! And some just do not like it.
  19. 45nut

    45nut Active Member

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    Let me clarify some because I don't want to be labeled a racist. What I'm not saying is that the black race is inferior and the white race is superior. All I am saying is look at the societal evolution in different races and people groups. The hunter/gatherer/tribal people groups have typically progressed, in regards to societal evolution, at a much slower pace than others.

    Look at the aboriginal peoples of Australia, North America, South America and Africa. We need to remember that these groups lived the same lifestyle for thousands of years before they encountered societies that were more advanced, i.e., formation of local governments, planters, etc. The deepest parts of Africa were only reached in the last 100 years or so. I feel it takes more than say, 50 years for people groups to adapt to new lifestyles or conditions.

    It is not the race of the people group, but rather the pace of the societal evolution that is the issue at hand.

    Take for instance the adaption, or lack thereof, of the Native Americans, or Indians if you please into traditional white culture. Of all the tribes that have been assimilated since the late 1800's, I think the Inuit or Eskimo's have adapted the best. I don't know why since I'm not a anthropologist, but I would think it's because even though they are influenced by white society, they are not overrun with it and can take the parts that work best for them and mix it into their heritage/culture.
  20. red14

    red14 Active Member

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    The Seminoles in Florida have done just that. Use what they like and keep what like.
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