Jew,Christian, Mormon, a childs question

Discussion in 'Religious Discussions' started by dartswinger, Aug 26, 2012.

  1. Double D

    Double D Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Looking for the perfect church? You will never find it. Once YOU walk in, it is no longer perfect.....
  2. RunningOnMT

    RunningOnMT New Member

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    I'm getting that old deja vu feeling again Terry. We've been down this road a few times my friend. Here's why I keep getting involved in this discussion. I understand your position as a moderator and have no problem with not even getting into this subject again except for the fact that both you and Jack feel compelled to speak in such glowing terms about a few "sects" (not my first choice of words) that it almost sounds like an endorsement. This statement you make:

    "I have never found a church anywhere that I felt everyone in it was lost.
    None.
    I have never found a church anywhere that I felt everyone in it was saved.
    None."

    is what I have a problem with. I can accept the second part of it about never finding a church where everyone was saved, with no problem. But I find it incomprehensible that a Christian pastor would say they've never found a church where everyone was lost.

    Without naming names, you and I both know that a few religions so indoctrinate their members in their ideology that there is zero chance of there being a single member that is unaware of what their church teaches, and I can say without fear of being overly judgmental that if anyone accepts those doctrines, they are indeed lost. I can provide a list of what those damning doctrines are but I am already deeper into this discussion than I ever intended to be. Some pretty hateful and insulting things have already been said on this thread which prove the wisdom of your forum policies. So I'll make you a deal. Since I can't stand to let certain comments by without challenge, I'll just stay off this particular forum before you have to ban me. Of course you know this is nothing personal and I'll keep in touch with your privately for any doctrinal discussions.
  3. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    I've had and still do have death orders from islam
    i have a statement from 3 baptist ministers that i should be locked up for life, or euthanized for my beleif on gays ( they also want to rewrite the bible to take out all the sin so everything is AOK )
    and i've had the catholics on my case after someone told a heap of em i hate catholics ( not true at all but causeed a stir )

    these are main stream religions

    i can show video or written statements in the media to prove the above

    this sect you talk about

    never once heard any of them talking about killing or attacking anyone

    they aint promoting sin as normal

    and they aint demanding people like me who oppose that be locked up or killed

    funny that ...

    you talk of main stream religions as soon as anyone talks about their religion ( knowing all religions are man made ) as the only right one , they are lost

    the bigotry against all others set in and away we go
    ready for a holy war to kill all them sects and pretenders

    arh that old time religion , nothing like it eh ..
  4. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    We will just have to agree to disagree, ROMT.
    MANY people go to church XX because they were raised in it, their friends and family go there, and in their hearts they do NOT accept all of that churches doctrine.
    I have never found a church (of any size, at least) where this was not the case.
    I am, of course, omitting tiny groups of idiots like the Westboro Baptist 'church', where I find it incomprehensible that someone takes part in a group like this without fully believing it.
  5. 45nut

    45nut Active Member

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    Was not Jesus called the rock of offense? Every Mormon I've ever known are good moral family oriented people. Which is why I think people are drawn to their church. Paul says that to add to or subtract from the Bible is a no no. I know about the canonization and all it entailed and some find fault in the process. I accept what the early church designated as the Bible.

    So, extra Biblical writings that are held up as Holy and Divinely inspired are a sign to me that a church's theology may be veering off course and I take appropriate precautions.

    If I had 3 prophecy's, I would judge the second and third by the first. If you did that with the bible, book of mormon and the pearl of great price, it would be very interesting. see here
  6. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    actually thats taqqiya thats practised even upon the ummah ( the muslim people ) by the clerics

    so please explain how moo ham odd have "revelations" , bells would ring and he would shake and his wife would cover him and when he awoke from these revelations he would quote the bible and his followers would write it down

    Sir , my understanding of the islamic faith and world is rather good

    read the thing


    The Muslim Qur'an was made up supposedly from "memory" from those who supposedly committed the words of Muhammad to memory, and from a few scraps found under a bed. This was originally begun about 15-20 years after Muhammad died at his wife Ayish's home in Medina, and he was lowered into a hole in the ground, where he remains. The compilation was not finished until at least 150 years after Muhammad's death. This "hearsay" argument seriously brings the credibility of the Qur'an into question. But, that's only the beginning. All the errors, including simple mathematical and historical errors you will see in the Qur'an below renders it impossible to be a divine revelation.

    Al Bukhari, a Muslim scholar of the 9th-10th century, and the most authoritative of the Muslim tradition compilers, writes that whenever Muhammad fell into one of his unpredictable trances his revelations were written on whatever was handy at the time. The leg or thigh bones of dead animals were used, as well as palm leaves, parchments, papers, skins, mats, stones, and bark. And when there was nothing at hand the attempt was made by his disciples to memorize it as closely as possible.

    Zaid b. Thabit said: “The Prophet died and the Qur’an had not been assembled into a single place.” (p. 118, Ahmad b. `Ali b. Muhammad al `Asqalani, ibn Hajar, "Fath al Bari", 13 vols, Cairo, 1939/1348, volume 9, page 9)

    Zuhri reports, 'We have heard that many Qur'an passages were revealed but that those who had memorized them fell in the Yemama fighting. Those passages had not been written down, and following the deaths of those who knew them, were no longer known; nor had Abu Bakr, nor `Umar nor `Uthman as yet collected the texts of the Qur'an.

    “During the battle of Yamama, 450 reciters of the Quran were killed.” (The True Guidance, An Introduction To Quranic Studies, part 4 [Light of Life - P.O. BOX 13, A-9503 Villach, Austria], p. 47- citing Ibn Kathir’s Al-Bidaya wa al-Nibaya, chapter on Battle of Yamama).

    Muhammad's child wife said this after Muhammad died:
    "The verse of the stoning and of suckling an adult ten times were revealed, and they were (written) on a paper and kept under my bed. When the messenger of Allah expired and we were preoccupied with his death, a goat entered and ate away the paper."


    References: Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. page 269; Sunan Ibn Majah, page 626; Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi 'l-Hadith (Cairo: Maktaba al-Kulliyat al-Azhariyya. 1966) page 310; As-Suyuti, ad-Durru 'l-Manthur, vol. 2. page 13


    but YES they have a holiday for it

    that holiday was started by a caliph to distract the people from the news he had stashed money away elsewhere ( with jews!!!!! ) and the city state was broke and all bets where riding on a raid on another city state

    they did ok and so it became a tradition

    412 years after moo ham odd died.. funny that
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2012
  7. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    Oh and krhords

    According to the Qur'an: "Muhammad is the Apostle of Allah. Those who follow him are merciful to one another, but ruthless to unbelievers" Surah 48:29. "Kill the Mushrikun (unbelievers) wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and lie in wait for them in each and every ambush..." Surah 9:5. Also see Surah 9:29: PICKTHAL: "Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture (Christians & Jews) as believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, and forbid not that which Allah hath forbidden by His messenger, and follow not the Religion of Truth, until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.". Please note that there is not a single verse in the entire Christian Bible that contains this "open-ended", universal command to kill/or be ruthless to unbelievers.

    Surah 47:4 says:

    Therefore, WHEN YOU MEET THE UNBELIEVERS, SMITE AT THEIR NECKS; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.

    Many Quran translators have tried to soften the meaning in their translation by adding the words “in war” in brackets after the word “Unbelievers” but they are NOT there in the original Arabic text. smiting thier necks would explain the neck slicing they do to jewish settlers ..

    whats this about ??

    http://new.elfagr.org/dailyPortal_Print_News_Details.aspx?nwsId=167367&secid=1

    yes its in arabic

    its a arhmadhi muslim news site ( they too are being huinted in egypt at the moment )

    here it is translated , the pic is a flyer of contact points for a great game that pays and gets rewards , KILL A COPTIC CHRISTIAN

    where to claim your reward and how ..

    well ?


    [​IMG]

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 6, 2012
  8. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    translation sucks eh , i'll do it myself ..
  9. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    The Torah has more info than the Old Testament?

    Don't think so.

    I just pulled my Torah and checked -
    It only contains the five books of Moses - Genesis through Deuteronomy.

    Generally, it would make sense to learn about what it is that you profess you do not believe in.
  10. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    and i think in the mean time you need to reread romans , heck reread it all if you think Christs wants wimps ...
  11. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    leviticus goes on and on though Terry

    thats like a encyclopedia itself eh
  12. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Numbers has always been the hardest for me.
    Begat and begat and begat -
    After a few pages, the emphasis is on the first syllable.
    NUMB

    I think he meant the Tanakh; at least that contains all of our OT, (although not more as stated)
  13. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    mennonite the begats they where always big on , as most of my familys mens names came there , folks laugh at my cousins hezakhia and zeeke ( ezekielle)

    so it was like a familiy reunion or baby name choosin
  14. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    ok the translatuion is slow as it uses a lot of peshouni slang ans i have to spell it out send it to a friend and get a rply , its out right a game to these animals

    they are offering playstations and such for a copt's head , ( a child)

    and this today

    respect for Christian and jews huh ??

    http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Almo...y-converted-to-Islam-in-Bangladesh-25745.html

    Almost 300 Christian children abducted and forcibly converted to Islam in Bangladesh
    by Nozrul Islam
    Taken by intermediaries after they convince village families to pay for an education at pseudo hostels, the children are in fact brought to madrassas (Islamic schools) where imams force them to abjure Christianity. The latest case has a happy ending however when 11 children were able to escape from captivity.
  15. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Sure is a strange way for the 'religion of peace' to act, eh?
  16. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    and folks keep on saying the same old lies that they dont persecute jews or Christians

    hey Terry did ya see the pics in the reloading bench thread , the one with my lathe and mill

    take a look at the thickness of that legal bound stuff on the bucket

    its a class action against me for a few things i've done here

    about 30 islamic organisations

    $3-4 million in legal power

    and there big complaint ?

    i teach people the truth about islam and i've gotta stop

    and advise residents about building and traffic codes and impacts
  17. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Good grief!!

    Their funding is virtually unlimited, Jack -
    How on earth do you bear up under that?

    Oh wait a minute, I already know the answer -
    You are backed by one who owns the cattle of a thousand hills -

    KEEP UP the good fight, my friend -
  18. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    He's always provided , but for this i can defend myself as there is not one criminal charge , its basically a long winded slander charge as its not racist , i already have that ruling ;) so now its about trying to stop me running a 45 minute movie at RSL clubs and CWA clubs ( returned servicemans league and country womens association ) over the coming months

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y&feature=channel&list=UL

    and i suspect they will make another play for a super mosque and sharia push again soon and wish all opposition silenced
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2012
  19. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    oh and the socialists are ticked off about this

    t short notice, we are pleased to announce a presentation by Kenneth Freeman and Don Casey, Chairman and Vice-chairman of the Alliance for Citizen's Rights Alabama from the US State of Alabama regarding Agenda 21.

    Dr. Amy McGrath has invited them to Australia between Sept 4 – 12 2012. They will be speaking to various small groups in Sydney, Canberra and Brisbane. Copies of Amy’s just published book “Wolves in Sheep’s Clothing” exposing Agenda 21 will be available on the night.

    Agenda 21 is a United Nations initiative to bring about "one world government", through agreements at series of international conferences in Rio, Kyoto, Bali, Copenhagen, and Johannesburg. By signing these treaties governments are committing their countries to an agenda which has not been subject to the democratic process. Whilst this may on the surface appear harmless, it means the adoption of the Fabian agenda where individual rights such as property are overridden.

    The US State of Alabama recently passed laws banning initiatives associated with Agenda 21 and others are considering it.
    .
    This is a unique opportunity for members of the public, to hear first hand from these two specialists in citizens rights from the US about their experiences and subsequent rationale to introduce legislation banning Agenda 21.

    Cost: Free

    Date/Time: 11.00am, Sunday, 9th September 2012.

    Venue: NEVAEH HOUSE BED AND BREAKFAST, cnr. Eastview and Great Western Highway, Leura NSW 2730
  20. jack404

    jack404 Former Guest

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    ya can see this sorta puts me in some folks bad books eh

    but whats bad for then is good for the rest of us so ..

    hi ho hi ho ;)
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