Marine Side Arm?

Discussion in 'General Military Arms & History Forum' started by dbltap, Jul 27, 2009.

  1. dbltap

    dbltap New Member

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    Watched an episode of The Real NCIS last night on the Military Channel, Naval Criminal Investigations Service. A Marine Guard was killed and his side arm was stolen. It was a Colt 45.

    Did the Marines not convert to the Beretta 9mm?

    Thanks.
  2. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

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    :) Did it ever occure to you that the crime may have taken place 50 years and they are just now making a show about it.:)
  3. Lotsdragon

    Lotsdragon New Member

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    I am not positive but I thought I heard that some of the marines havent switched over to the 9mm's yet.
  4. gandog56

    gandog56 Member

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    Seals didn't switch.
  5. dbltap

    dbltap New Member

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    It never occurred to me that I needed to be that specific. The bad guys were driving a Subaru Outback Wagon, a red one. I'm certain they didn't have those back then.
  6. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

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    When they are making a low budget TV show they don't need to get the back ground perfect. However I didn't see the show, perhaps it was a low priority installation such as a reserve center or even a training center. Gandog, The Seals are still using 1911's , Are you sure about that??
  7. 1 CAV

    1 CAV New Member

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    The Marine Crops has never stopped using the 1911. It has been their standard issue side arm since WWII.
  8. SARG

    SARG Member

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    Probably still use it ........ but I suspect they indeed did change their "standard issue" to the Italian wonder .....just like the other branches.
  9. USMC-03

    USMC-03 New Member

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    There may be some few units out there with M1911's but the M9 is in general use. I was in one of the last units to have them back in the early 90's and haven't seen one issued, other than on shooting teams, since then.
  10. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    Depends on Uncle Sam's whim every 3 yrs.
    If you look across the service right now you'll find several types of 1911, Glock, Sig 228 and 226 and 228r and DAK, HK USP, and perhaps some others. And of course the M9, which is about 98% of the handguns in use right now.

    There's not much uniformity among the uniformed service these days.:D
  11. 1 CAV

    1 CAV New Member

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    "In lieu of", in other words they modified their 1911's rather than accept the M9. As far as I know the Marines still use the .45.

    Here's the link for the info

    http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/marinefacts/blm19.htm
  12. Kane

    Kane New Member

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    i was reading in combat arms magazine thAT the marines for the most part switched but want the 45 back hence the hk45 project
  13. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    Depends on Uncle Sam's whim every 3 yrs.
  14. Kane

    Kane New Member

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    id like to point out the exact same thing happened in the war with the phillipines in the 1900s. the army adopted a .38 revolver over the colt 45 but the soldiers soon dumped it in favor of the newly made 1911. the cycle repeats.:p
  15. dbltap

    dbltap New Member

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    The base was Pearl Harbor. The T.V. show is a moot point now.
  16. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

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    Was that before they named it the model of 1911?
  17. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    If I could disagree.

    The .38 Long Colt was the cartridge used by some US Army forces in the Philippines in the war you're referring to. It was replaced by SA .45 Colt revolvers....

    But the US Army only had .45 Schofield ammunition because they had both .45 Colt and .45 Schofield revolvers (.45 S&W). The .45 Schofield cartridges will work in a Colt but not vice versa.

    The .45 Schofield load they had was about a 230 grain lead round nose bullet going 700 fps if they were lucky. (The .38 Long Colt was 150 grain lead round nose going about 750 fps)

    So...they got rid of a puny .38 bullet for a puny .45 bullet and still had Moros failing to be stopped.

    The .38 Long Colt load was a 50% stopper and the .45 Schofield load was perhaps 55% or 60%. Maybe.

    The gain was not noteworthy and the rest is a nice legend but almost all myth and lies.


    As for the 1911 and 1911A1...that came a decade later. In some way it was indirectly linked to the Philippine-American War, but by no means can the event take credit. The 1911 was influenced heavily by the US Army Cavalry, which back then was an elite organization, and .44 was the smallest they'd ever tipped their hats to anyway.

    As for the 9mm and .45 ACP. With FMJ/ball ammunition there really is no great difference in effect on target.

    Gun writers and gun magazines have created many debates that say different, which is nice entertaining reading, but in truth, both 9mm ball and .45 ACP ball are very poor choices of ammunition.

    A poorly placed .45 bullet is just as impotent as a poorly placed 9mm bullet.

    For most of the US military, 9mm makes as much sense as all the other options.
  18. 1 CAV

    1 CAV New Member

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    We had a local pawn shop owner who was robbed and during the course of the robbery the offender shot the shop owner in the face at a range of about 20 feet with a 9mm. The 9 mm flatend out on his cheek bone, didn't penetrate the skull and thank God the shop owner survived. He spent a couple days in the hospital. Now that's a story with a happy ending and I'm glad it turned out that way. But if he had been hit in the same place by a .45 round it wouldn't have turned out that way I gurantee you.

    I have a 9 mm myself, I never carry it, it's just not a good self defense weapon.
  19. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

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    But on the other side of the coin, I have seen a .25 ACP enter a forehead and exit the real of the skull. And on the farm we routinely put livestock down with a 22 short in the head, I can never remember having to use a second shot. So it's hard to say yea or nay on a certain cartridge with one example
  20. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    If we dismiss every cartridge that ever failed to stop a man, we'd have no handgun we could even use.


    I think you have it backwards on the .45 ACP. Being it is a rather slow projectile, it is one of the most prone handgun cartridges for failing to penetrate skulls. It's big hollowpoint walls often flatten and allow the bullet to glance away or track to the around under the flesh. Men have been shot by a .45 ACP in the head and went home with stitches the next day.

    But it is not just the .45 ACP. Anywhere worth a flip teaches handgun shooters to avoid head shots and otherwise only trains handgun shooters to engage the 2.5" tall ocular cavity for that very reason; the human skull often defeats self-defense hollowpoints. Not always, but more often than the thorax.

    Nothing about shooting men can be guaranteed.

    Caliber is irrelevant. 9mm NATO is no worse than any other pistol round. If it is, oh well. If it's all you have, then right then it's the best bullet on Earth. If you can do better, knock yourself out.

    Calibers don't win fights. All things being equal, we're only armed with what we know. Every sky soldier knows that.
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