Mich. Gun Owners Protest ....

Discussion in 'The Constitutional & RKBA Forum' started by JohnHenry, Jun 12, 2012.

  1. JohnHenry

    JohnHenry Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2011
    Messages:
    1,622
    Location:
    Livingston county, Michigan
  2. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2009
    Messages:
    4,152
    Good to hear somebody is speaking up about it.
  3. marlin795

    marlin795 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    759
    Location:
    Calvary Chapel Conference Center; Murrieta,CA
    Wow. OCing a handgun is one thing, OCing a rifle is just asking for it in my opinion.
  4. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2009
    Messages:
    4,152
    As much as I would like people doing it, it is kind of unnecessary.
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2012
  5. raven818

    raven818 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    Messages:
    7,271
    Location:
    Jax, Fl.
    Hmmm, let's see. What went wrong here. Gimme a minute.
  6. hogger129

    hogger129 Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2009
    Messages:
    4,152
    How is one supposed to provide proof of ownership? I have the receipt for my handgun and a couple other papers I got it with, but I keep them at home locked up, I don't take em with when I'm carrying.

    As for showing ID, I probably would have. Aren't you required to show it if an officer of the law asks for it?
  7. raven818

    raven818 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    Messages:
    7,271
    Location:
    Jax, Fl.
    Wasn't there. But, IMO, they probably asked that question AFTER the part about..resisting..disturbing..uncooperative. They call that 'stacking'. Pretty common.

    Yes, always a good idea to show proof of who you are. Otherwise, you could be someone they are looking for, etc..

    There is a positive outcome. Now they have his prints on file. So the next time, he can say..you've got my prints, why don't you find out yourself.
    :rolleyes:
  8. graehaven

    graehaven Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2007
    Messages:
    2,955
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    He was "creating a disturbance?" Bull crap.

    Also, sorry, but this is America. The police do NOT have the right to demand you identify yourself. "Papers please, comrade."

    What is this country coming to? We are in serious trouble. More jack booted thuggery.
  9. whymememe

    whymememe Former Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,444
    Location:
    FEMA Region IV
    He's not old enough to have an M-1.
  10. graehaven

    graehaven Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2007
    Messages:
    2,955
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    He's 18. How old does he have to be?
  11. whymememe

    whymememe Former Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,444
    Location:
    FEMA Region IV
    legally 18, but he is not old enough.
  12. raven818

    raven818 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    Messages:
    7,271
    Location:
    Jax, Fl.
    Anyone who want's to debate with an officer if he asks for an ID, is certainly welcome to do so. None of my business.

    Most cities of any size have bondsmen. A lot of folks I ran into had a bondsman on retainer, and a lawyer. True. Just pay them a few bucks a week when your not in jail, and when the times comes, they're already paid.

    In and out in no time at all.
  13. whymememe

    whymememe Former Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,444
    Location:
    FEMA Region IV
    i'm with you raven818, If you respect the Officer, most times the outcome is better.
  14. armoredman

    armoredman New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,438
    Location:
    Proud to be in Arizona
    He's 18, which federally is legally old enough to purchase a rifle and rifle ammo. I don't know the laws of that state/jurisdiction, but it's very likely he is legally old enough to own and carry it there, as well.
    Sounds like a kid wanting to get his name in the paper, "Doing Something", which makes for great grandstanding, and nothing else. In any case, his family will likely never gift him another firearm! The young lady in the picture would have been better served with a regular sling - looks like an ersatz combat patrol crossing the street!
  15. graehaven

    graehaven Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2007
    Messages:
    2,955
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    If he was arrested because it was a LOADED rifle, that's probably understandable, in an urban or even suburban area. It's not the norm, at least not nowadays.

    The "creating a disturbance" line is just so much cop doublespeak. I'm so tired of hearing about cops who have genuinely CROSSED the line to infringe on people's rights that I'm NO LONGER giving them the benefit of the doubt.

    They have to EARN it back. THAT is reality.

    That being said, I doubt that the published story contains ALL the details, they rarely do.

    As USUAL, anything to make gun owners LOOK bad, they'll run with it.
  16. ka64

    ka64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,765
    Location:
    Richmond & Sterling Michigan


    Only if you're being detained & a reason must be given for the detention.
  17. carver

    carver Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2008
    Messages:
    15,986
    Location:
    DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just we
    As a general principle, citizens who are minding their own business are not obligated to "show their papers" to police. In fact, there is no law requiring citizens to carry identification of any kind. In Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada, the Supreme Court upheld state laws requiring citizens to disclose their identity to police when officers have reasonable suspicion to believe criminal activity may be taking place. Commonly known as "stop-and-identify" statutes, these laws permit police to arrest criminal suspects who refuse to identify themselves. As of 2008, 24 states had stop-and-identify laws. Regardless of your state's law, keep in mind that police can never compel you to identify yourself without reasonable suspicion to believe you're involved in criminal activity.

    But how can you tell if an officer asking you to identify yourself has reasonable suspicion? Remember, police need reasonable suspicion to detain you. One way to tell if they have reasonable suspicion is to determine if you're free to go. You could do this by saying "Excuse me officer. Are you detaining me, or am I free to go?" If the officer says you’re free to go, leave immediately and refrain from answering any additional questions.

    If you're detained, you'll have to decide whether withholding your identity is worth the possibility of arrest or a prolonged detention. In cases of mistaken identity, revealing who you are might help to resolve the situation quickly. On the other hand, if you're on parole in California, for example, revealing your identity could lead to a legal search. Knowing your state's laws can help you make the best choice.
    http://www.flexyourrights.org/faq

    Here is the list:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_a..._.E2.80.9Cstop-and-identify.E2.80.9D_statutes
  18. raven818

    raven818 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    Messages:
    7,271
    Location:
    Jax, Fl.
    Excellent post, Carver. +1
  19. goofy

    goofy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,036
    After reading this and not knowing the details (just what the news says)and we all know they never tell us everything just what they want us to know.
    1st why was he walking around with a loaded M1?
    With out ID?
    Did have ID and refuse to show it?
    Was he a smart a## when the cops approached him?
    Did he look 18?
    When he was asked for ID did he get loud and refused to show it?
    Yes he has the right to do so but with all the crap that happens these days I don't blame the cops for questioning his actions.
    I think that walking around with a M1 on your back IS ENOUGH REASON FOR THE LEO TO ASK YOU FOR ID.
    At 18 he is aloud to have the M1 and aloud to walk around with it BUT he should be smart enough to know that this could cause people to be alarmed and is setting yourself up for trouble.( at the lest be asked why)
    With all the crap that goes on today People being shot in schools, shops,and so on strutting around with a M1 that is loaded for no reason but to show it off(was he headed to a range?)is stupid and you can expect to be questioned.
    If he told the leo what was going on and was cooperative with them would he have been charged?
    Was he cooperative and the leo took it to far to flex there mussels?
    I don't know it just seems like there is more to this story that we do not know
    Mike
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2012
  20. 45Auto

    45Auto Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,255
    In some Michigan municipalities there are "must show Id" laws. I don't know if anyone has challenged these laws in the courts or not.

    The Michigan 'Resisting and Obstructin' criminal statute has been given an extremely broad definition/application by our super conservative Court of Appeal and Supreme Court justices. Not following a law enforcement officer's orders could get you charged and possibly convicted for a wide range of petty things. It's one of several laws I would like to see overhauled in favor of the citizens; though that's not likely any time soon.

    As to the 18 year old lugging around a loaded M1; even if it's perfectly legal, why does this clod think it's a good idea? Like so many young people these days he was rude and extremely inconsiderate. What are folks supposed to think when they see some strange guy walking around town with an M1 rifle? It's not legal to use an M1 for hunting in that area. Men and women would grab their kids and run for cover! I want to see more of our useless gun laws repealed in this state, but if this fool is walking around frightening people it's not going to happen.
Similar Threads
Forum Title Date
The Constitutional & RKBA Forum Michael Reagan Dec 30, 2012
The Constitutional & RKBA Forum Bayonets and Michigan law Nov 19, 2012
The Constitutional & RKBA Forum Michigan Open Carry? Oct 25, 2012
The Constitutional & RKBA Forum Michigan's Handgun Registration Laws Oct 3, 2012
The Constitutional & RKBA Forum Authorities seize guns in SW Michigan traffic stop Sep 15, 2012

Share This Page