My buddy was shot Friday night

Discussion in 'The Constitutional & RKBA Forum' started by Crawdaddy, Mar 5, 2012.

  1. hunter29180

    hunter29180 Well-Known Member

  2. al45lc

    al45lc Active Member

    Mar 8, 2010
    colorful colorado
    This goes to personal responsibility and nothing more. As a gun owner, one has the right to keep and bear, and the obligation to society at large to do so responsibly.
    Any 'accident' or negligent discharge (the legal term) should fall on the head of the owner or bearer, as per the 'prudent person' rule.
    We are a society of laws and individual rights, and with that are huge and heavy responsibilities to the individual.
    That is as it should be, not some Govt. entity deciding who is 'safe' and who isn't.
    The problem are those who cry for their rights, but fail others in their obligations.

  3. time2shoot

    time2shoot Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Jan 17, 2012
    Brandon SD
  4. Crawdaddy

    Crawdaddy New Member

    Aug 22, 2011
    Excellent, thoughtful response, best so far IMO. Thanks.
  5. Ed~

    Ed~ New Member

    Jan 24, 2012
    Spoken like a true Woman!

    Now Beth, when was the last time you heard the joke about the Man who stopped the car to ask for directions when the couple was lost?

    No, that's not the way the joke went, right?

    What's really funny is that the male ego must appear competent and all-knowing at all-times. It is funny, but not all fun and games and when it comes to firearms. In fact, it's just plain sad because that attitude leads to serious accidents.

    Where do most boys learn about guns from first? Rambo. Hands on the trigger and shake it all around... do the hokey-pokey, that's what it's all about, -'till you send your friend into the hospital!

    The NRA and other Gun Clubs offer terrific (even entertaining) training classes at very reasonable prices. But when was the last time that was "cool" to take a class on firearms saftey? Was it ever cool to take driver's ed? Not really. But there was a necessity to pass tests to get your license to Be Cool in your own ride... rules & regulations.

    That's the way edumacation works with us guys. The ends only sometimes justify the means and when it comes to learning about your new firearm, it's hardly ever the end in itself.

    Let me ask this to everyone. How many people have read the instruction manual that came with every new firearm you purchased? -At least skimmed it cover to cover? -And how many never even picked it up but thrashed it along with the cheap lock and cardboard box?

    Funny, ain't it?
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2012
  6. 76Highboy

    76Highboy Well-Known Member

    Jan 1, 2012
  7. Ed~

    Ed~ New Member

    Jan 24, 2012
    Hey Paul,

    I'm glad you posted this question, even though you got flamed so harshly they made you want to push delete and crawl away. Some boys never learned not to kick a guy when he's down.

    I understand what many here are writing anyway -at a gut level. Many on this post react like this to any mention of licensing or registering firearms because it immediately strikes a bell in their heads that has "having our freedom's and rights extinguished" engraved on it. I know the feeling myself. Waiting more than 15 min for the background check is enough for me to start sweating and get shifty on my feet when I'm pawing a new gun with money burning a hole... You know that feeling too, I'm sure.

    As Beth and other's wrote, it truly is the responsibility of the individual to learn how NOT to shoot himself in the foot with his new toy (nor his friend in the belly). Yet now many times have we heard that about so many other fun things that could end up killing us or some innocent bystander before we finally made rules and laws to regulate them and the issue kinda just went away? We grew past that challenge as a society.

    Examples... let's see, uh, CAR? OK, how about Motorcycle? -Yup. Skydiving? Not yet, but they certainly won't let me take a single-engine Cessna up by myself even if I could afford a new one from the factory.

    Fact is, all our fun things are technology and technology is always changing and growing. Society has to grow and catch up with each new revolutionary technology. Smartphones are a great example. Do you know that some crazies actually hold a sandwich in one hand and the cell in the other, and steer going down the freeway with their knees? I've seen it! I was on a motorcycle when I seen it. Scared the living sh#t out of me to know I was sharing the road with that assh*le.

    Yes, there is legislation going all over about not driving with your cellphone... hands free only. As if they needed another law alongside the first: No Texting while Driving? Jeeze-louise!

    Because we can all say it is the responsibility of the drivers not to rear end someone because they "should" be paying attention to driving rather than "tweeting" --until you are the one rear-ended by someone doing just that. If you survive the accident without life-changing injury, will you still be against more "frivolous" laws being passed regulating our lives?

    Me, I ride motorcycles. I cannot wait until such traffic laws are passed in every state. Why? Because I suspect I will not survive even the first such accident with a 2,000lbs car driven by a 180lbs idiot. Maybe, just maybe the guy behind the wheel will think twice if what he is considering to do has a fine attached to it... like wearing seat-belts. That, my friends, is how people really learn: by attaching consequences to their actions.

    So that is my heartfelt response to your heartfelt question. What happened between your friends was tragic. Everyone lost in that situation but at what point are we willing to ask how we can help prevent that kind of "accident" from happening again and again? It was not only a courageous act to ask that question, it was a rational one.

    Changes in the wind with regard to fun things and personal liberties. What Beth described in CT is what everyone one here fears: mandatory education before being licensed to carry (or own). But I don't know what THE answer is. I would not like to see more regulations limiting my freedoms because, hell, I've got my sh*t together (ha ha). But I also know the value of rules & regs that serve to curb someone else's stupidity or thoughtlessness for my own safety. It is a trade-off, like everything in life: a balance.

    Cars, motorcycles, smartphones, and guns. To me they are all fun to play with and not one is holier than another. -So shoot me...
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2012
  8. CD Woods

    CD Woods New Member

    Oct 13, 2008
    Accidents will happen, and stupid is stupid. Sorry, but these two (2) comments are facts of life. We do not need more regulations or permissions granted from Local, State, or Federal Governments. The more we allow someone else to know what is right for us the more rights and responsibilities we forfeit.
  9. 45Auto

    45Auto Well-Known Member

    Apr 9, 2008
    It would be a good idea to have hunter safety classes in high school, they did when I was a kid, it was part of physical education, but I'm not sure if there is any such instruction now. The Eddie Eagle program of the NRA is good for younger kids.

    At this point, Michigan requires 10 hours of instruction prior to the issue of a concealed weapon permit. NRA instructors do these courses. No one seems to mind these courses of instruction.

    I'm not so sure about compulsory education prior to buying a firearm. It might be nice if you got a discount or some other special incentive to take a voluntary gun safety class, people are more likely to pay attention and get something out of the experience.
  10. Ed~

    Ed~ New Member

    Jan 24, 2012
    What a great idea 45Auto! That's the kind of discussion I was aiming for... If there were INCENTIVES to pursuing firearms education then it would be "cool" and people would be encouraged to learn rather than dragged like an animal to the water trough.

    But as a people we should practice discussing ideas as sport, bat it around and come up with creative solutions to problems, rather than reject certain topics outright as "Wrong Thinking" or "Danger, Will Robinson, Danger!"
  11. MSGT-R

    MSGT-R Active Member

    Feb 27, 2011
    Doesn't matter weather it's loaded or not; absolutely NOT a thing to do, I agree!

    That being said, I lost a friend in elementary school to just such an incident. Laura Powers. She had a whacko sister that was pulling the trigger; thought it would be funny to scare the little sister. She had a known "mean streak" a mile long. I always avoided her dumb ass.

    You can't legislate "STUPID".. and common sense is not common anymore. We are a society of people brought up to fear that which is not understood, and obliviots are not reined in and educated. That frame of mind did not exist a short 50 years ago.
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2012
  12. al45lc

    al45lc Active Member

    Mar 8, 2010
    colorful colorado
    I've taken two safety courses, one was a joke.
    Now, consider this. Who taught the first firearms safety course? And who taught that instructor? Who taught Wilbur and Orville how to fly? Who taught Mr. Diesel how to drive?
    Not EVERYONE is so stupid and so foolish as to NEED a firearms safety course.
    Fact is, MOST of firearms safety is simple and good ol' fashioned common sense. Yes, there are those who don't exhibit that quality, but I don't like being lumped into that group by anyone, and that's what a safety course is out of neccessity, dumbing down to the lowest common denominator.
    So what about the person who can't afford one, like a single mother working two jobs because her no-good hubby flew the coop? Time and distance could also be a factor making it next to impossible to take one.
    These are situations that those that oppose our right to carry or even buy work to make happen. They figure the harder the better, the hell with the woman who is in danger from a crazed ex-hubby or boyfriend.
    This is the biggest reason I'm against it, first a safety course, then what?
    In the history of Govt.s, when have those that run them ever been satisfied with a little control?
  13. American Leader

    American Leader Well-Known Member

    Mar 1, 2011
    No to the original question! And as far as government intervention in our lives, no again please. I want as little of all government at all levels as possible!
  14. Except that accidents imply that it there was no way to prevent it. While this incident was unintended, it was not accidental. I agree with the rest of the post.
  15. The_Rifleman

    The_Rifleman Active Member

    Feb 10, 2010
    That isn't what happened, if the topic was "reject[ed]," the soapbox you're standing on would not be here.

    Why must you be insulting?
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