Myths of WWII

Discussion in 'General Military Arms & History Forum' started by polishshooter, Jan 15, 2006.

?

Which of these did NOT happen in WWII...

  1. Spitfires flew from the decks of the USS Wasp.

    29.3%
  2. Polish Cavalry charged time after time against German tanks in 1939, getting mowed down by MGs.

    15.0%
  3. Many Non-German foreigners, slavs, Russians, Arabs, and some gypsies and Jews served in the SS.

    24.1%
  4. One of the top priority item for US Lend Lease to Russia was gold braid for General's uniforms.

    31.6%
  1. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

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    OK guys, ONE of these is a "myth," all the rest are true! Can you pick it? :cool:
  2. Well, I KNOW 2 and 3 are true. So . . . I voted for No. 4 on the theory that it's quite possible the Brits landed Spits on one of our carriers in the Pacific. As for the gold braid, that does seem a bit far-fetched. Even if it is true that supplying gold braid was a priority, it would not have interfered with other needs supplied to the Russians on the same ships.
  3. Xracer

    Xracer *TFF Admin Staff Mediator*

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    Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet!
    I believe Spits may have flown off U.S. Carriers on Operation Torch, but the Wasp served in the Pacific in WWII, so I really doubt that she launched any Spits.......and, of course, Spits were unable land on any U.S. Carriers.
  4. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    I would agree with Racer on this one.

  5. Hmmm, your reasoning seems sound, x. I don't think I've ever read of Spits being equipped with landing hooks for carrier landings, and the Wasp was indeed a Pacific fleet carrier. Maybe the Poles didn't charge German tanks with horse cavalry then, though I do know the Abyssinians did against the Italians.
  6. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

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    OK. a hint, BEFORE the Wasp went to the pacific, she resupplied Malta several times, once launching a squadron of Spitfires to reinforce "Faith, Hope, and Charity."


    I will give you extra credit if you can tell me what or who "Faith, Hope, and Charity" were..... :)
  7. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    Gloster Gladiators were the last of the "hero" bi-planes, off Malta and were part of the Hal Far Fighter Fleet. Heroics occured after the sinking of HMS Glorious. Tail numbers N5520, N5531 and N5519.

    That may not be antirely accurate as I am typing from a very foggy memory.....
  8. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

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    Ok, Marlin gets the extra credit... :cool:

    Isn't it amazing how long those three LASTED against the best of the Regia whatever, with a few luftwaffe 109s and 110s from Pantelleria thrown against them too?


    And that leads to MORE trivia...What happened to the Glorious, and why was it THERE when it happened...
  9. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    HMS Glorious was taking part, as an escort for one of the two troop convoys, Group II if memory serves me, in the evacuation from Norway of all British and other Allied personnel in early June 1940. At some point the Captain of Glorious asked to be allowed to sail alone for Scapa, due to his being hell bent for election to court marshall his Air Commander.

    She sailed on alone with two destroyers for protective cover and at some point came under attack by two German battlecruisers, Gneisenau and Scharnhorst. In the ensuing battle all three of the British ships were sunk.

    The permission granted by Admiralty to sail on alone never should have been granted.....
  10. 17thfabn

    17thfabn New Member

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    He said spitfires "flew" from the decks of the USS Wasp. Many times land based fighters took off from U.S. carriers, while being delivered to a forward base. They did not have to return. I know this was done with U.S. fighters, so I can see the Wasp delivering Spitfires that "flew" from her one time.

    The picture of Polish lancers attacking German armor is myth I believe. The Polish lancers were caught out in the open by the German armor, and a photographer snapped the picture which was mislabled for propaganda purposes.

    BTW the Russians made very good use of horse cavalry in WW II. They would infiltrate behind German lines and attack rear area units. Indirectly they took many german tanks out of action by destroying their fuel, and support units. Tanks especialy German ones in WW II need constant care. Destroying their support units was as effective as destroying them more directly.
  11. Many today don't realize that horses were used far more during WWII than one might think. The Germans used them extensively for transport of food and ammo, especially during the early stages of the war.
  12. OK, here's another trivia on battleships in WWII for ya Polish:

    What was the only U.S. submarine to sink a Japanese battleship in WWII, and which battleship did she sink?
  13. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

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    WELL, the Shinano was a CONVERTED yamato class BB, does she count? (even though she was a CV at the time she was sunk?)

    FINE job on the Glorious, marlin! DO you remember what he wanted to courtmartial the AC for? I can't remember, but I DO remember it was for something relatively trivial for a time of war, and demonstrated that some Admirals of the Royal navy at THEIR start were still were in the "peacetime" mindset just like many of ours were shortly after Dec 1941...and also, did he even have PERMISSION from the admiralty. or did he just go off on his own?

    But the best part of the fight was the "little" DD HMS Glowworm, making high speed attacks again and again on the German gun line and laying smoke all by herself, on the order of the DDs and DEs in the Taffy fight off Samar in Oct 44...just to try and draw them off the Glorious...until she too bought it...


    And 17th got it! The Polish Cavalry charging Panzers turned out to be a product of German Propaganda, but not only did I read it when I was young, I was TAUGHT that in high school, and knowing how stubborn Polaks ARE, found it easy to BELIEVE it. In fact, I was actually a liitle disappointed to find out it WASN'T true, I actually could envision it and took pride in it as a kid...


    Gold Braid actually WAS high on the list the Russians asked for in Lend Lease supplies...kinda like the Brits listing TEA as a "strategic material"...


    But I'm still thinking on the BB one, HHmmm... CRAP. I KNOW this, or else I SHOULD! What actually sunk Fuso off Savo? Hmmmm...
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2006
  14. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    I believe the straw that broke the camel's back was when the Captain ordered the AC to launch several "Swordfish" in a situation that the AC felt was way beyond reasonable and a certain death warrant for his fliers and the AC refused to follow that order.

    I seem to recall that these two never got on very well and it seems the Captain was just waiting for an excuse to get rid of the AC. It appears to be a petty difference in the proper way to utilize the men and equipment.
  15. A good guess on the Shinano, Polish, but as you say, when Shinano was sunk she had been reconfigured as a carrier though she was originally laid down as a sister ship to the Yamato-class BBs.

    Polish, the ship in question was HIJMS Kongo, sunk on 21 November 1944, in the Formosa Strait by three torpedoes from the American submarine U.S.S. Sealion.

    Interestingly, Kongo was actually built by the British for the Japanese, laid down in 1911 and delivered to Japan in 1913. Originally, she was built as a battlecruiser with 14" guns, but during the 1930s, after Japan withdrew from the Washington 5:5:3 naval treaty, she was rebuilt, given heavier armor, better engines, torpedo bulges and reclassifed as a "fast battleship." She served mostly with Japanese carriers during the war. She was the only battleship sunk by American submarines during WWII.
  16. polishshooter

    polishshooter Active Member

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    Marlin, It PROBABLY had a lot to do with the fact in the RN, Air Officers did NOT get commands, so by definition, the Captain was NOT an "aviator," and probably didn't even understand airplanes! In fact, as a LINE officer, he probably got flack from his peers, because if he was GOOD, he would probably have been given command of a "real" combat ship, a BB, BC, or even a CRUISER, and not a "carrier..." A recipe for disaster. I also read there was animosity many times between them, "line" officers looked down their nose at aviators as "not really" naval officers, but resented that they got more pay for flying, and vice versa, aviators were frustrated they couldn't advance in rank or to command other than aircraft, dead end career...


    Not like the USN, to command a CARRIER, you HAD to be an "aviator..." and "aviators" could command other ships BESIDES carriers too...so no drawback to being one!
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2006
  17. Marlin, ever notice how Polish always likes to add something at the end of his response to keep the argument going? One might say that he likes to take the, er, a, "Pole" position. :D :rolleyes:

    OK, another submarine trivia question: What American submarine acquired the name of "Submarie Killer" and is credited with the destruction of three Japanese subs on a single war patrol? :cool:
  18. JohnK3

    JohnK3 New Member

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  19. Xracer

    Xracer *TFF Admin Staff Mediator*

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    Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet!
    Hmmmmm.....I seem to remember that Ray Spruance, a "blackshoe", commanded a whole Carrier Task Force at Midway.

    (And yeah, I know all about Halsey's "hives" and the last minute change of command.....bit thank God it was Spruance who was On Scene Commander and not "Fill 'em up" Fletcher in command at Midway.)
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