Only in the Republic of Kalifornia

Discussion in 'The Fire For Effect and Totally Politically Incorr' started by Diamondback, Jun 1, 2011.

  1. Awtoman

    Awtoman Active Member

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    Middle Tennessee
    One of the things I like most about this place, besides guns, is that most of the time the thinking around here is generally "old school" or "old fashioned" when it comes to things like morals, honesty, courtesy, and taking care of you and yours. At 48, I was raised "old school", just before that line of thinking became obsolete. And yet, with all of us "old schoolers" here, I am just a little surprised at some of the answers here. It's not that I necessarily disagree with some of the posts here, it's that I don't remember, and can't envision, my father or my grandparents telling me about a story like this occuring during their times. The fact that it happened, and we (myself included) are not completely dumfounded that 75 people would stand around and watch a man drown, is a sad indicator of what direction society, and us along with it, have slid. We may be at the far right end of the current bubble, but the bubble is way out of place.

    Tom
  2. Buckshot

    Buckshot Active Member

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    Interesting debate on whether the man's intent should effect the outcome. Although first responders TYPICALLY do not stop to evaluate a rescue on that basis, I can easily see now, after the fact with the luxury of reflection, that my own desire to risk my life for someone might ENTIRELY change based on whether they were a helpless VICTIM (jump in without hesitation), or a moron attempting to harm themselves and very possibly if not intentionally take others with them. (Wave, come to attention, salute, go for pizza and ice cream.)

    Although it seems increasingly a limited time offer, this is still marginally a free country. If you are an ADULT (very important) and have no particular outstanding obligations (you are NOT a parent of minor children), and you want to leave the party early? So be it. But why don't you have the least consideration on your way out and make neat work of it. Do it somewhere private. Rent a boat, get away from the shore. Feed the fish.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2011
  3. Juker

    Juker New Member

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    I keep trying to picture this scenario, and it's definitely one of those "you had to be there" situations.

    The man wasn't flailing around in the water; he was standing, apparently. So it wasn't a drowing scenario, wherein I'm hopeful the cops would have gone in without hesitation.

    If it's obvious someone is trying to drown themselves - which, admittedly, is a ridiculous way of taking one's own life - how would we know they hadn't decided to take someone with them if possible? Not many people are trained in "water fighting" - was there a thought that he might have a weapon on him in this death pact? If he wanted to drown himself, what would his reaction be to someone who attempted to bring him ashore? I'm sure a lot of questions were raised in that hour.

    This wasn't a drowning child, or someone in a burning car - this was a man with mental issues in a dangerous situation.

    We lose a lot of brave men and women every year who give up their lives to save others - but if someone has such little regard for their own life that they'd pull something like this, I have to say - sayonara, have a nice trip.
  4. lawdawg

    lawdawg Member

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    South Alabama
    Not trying to be nitpicky, but there is no such thing as "non-lethal" force. All force is potentially lethal. Any "less-lethal" device or substance that could incapacitate a person enough that the police could subdue him and drag him to shore, would incapacitate him enough to drown him in neck-deep water. If the police had used such a device, such as a Taser, and he had drowned (and he almost certainly would have), then the police would be accused of his murder. There is a reason why police are trained to talk a suicidal person down in most circumstances, rather than forcibly rescue them. Most suicidal people don't care who they take with them. But I truly do not know of any device or substance that is available to law enforcement today that would work in a situation like this. I think Bobitis nailed it. Just another "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2011
  5. jim brady

    jim brady Well-Known Member

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    I'd bet that if there was REVENUE in it those city employees would have trampled each other rushing into the water. This really does point to the moral decay that's going on here and all over the world.

    A fine example is the spectators caught on camera reguarding the trial of that woman who's daughter was killed. Anyone else but me shocked by the horde of women and girls giggling and laughing as they scrambled to get seats for the trial? It was like a fun day at the circus. Never mind that a little girl - barley just past being a toddler - was butcherd and left to rot. Those females have no motherly or human compassion in them AT ALL.

    Jack - please don't judge America on what you see if you fly into Seattle, San Francisco or Los Angeles. Big cities do not reflect America - especially THOSE big cities. You want to find America, get away from the cities. Just as I doubt I'd find a REAL Austrailian if I waited all day on the steps of a Capitol building in your country - unless it was some poor soul going there to be judged by the authorities.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2011
  6. Buckshot

    Buckshot Active Member

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    Good points lawdog. Maybe SFPD can conduct an experiment about what happens when you Taser the Adam Henry while standing next to him in neck-deep water, and get back to us.:eek::D:D
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