Opinions Please--Equipment for reloading

Discussion in 'The Ammo & Reloading Forum' started by PPK 32, Apr 26, 2009.

  1. PPK 32

    PPK 32 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,170
    Location:
    Frickin, Illinois
    After today's visit to a gun show, it has prompted talk between some of my shooting buddy's about getting into reloading. I know very little, except to make sure if I get into it, do the research, there are no short cuts. Had several people think ya can just dump brass and powder in and make a round. I had to enlighten a few. Anyway, if money were not a problem, what would you recommend, with the goal in mind of making several rounds in a short span of time. One fellow spoke of a "progressive press", another recommended Dillon. I'd like to know what you guys think and why. Thank you for your time.
  2. Haligan

    Haligan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2008
    Messages:
    2,012
    Location:
    FEMA Region II
    I've found progressive presses very usefull in making handgun(straight-walled) ammo.
    For rifle rounds I prefer single stage presses.
    Once you buy a manual like; Lyman, or Lee Modern reloading, I think you'll find it reads like any good book. Before long your gonna see that reloading is not that difficult.

    Sure you have to be carefull, sure you have to follow the load data. But it's only rocket science.:D

    I have been reloading for many moons, (mabe 12 years now). I've used a couple presses. But I enjoy the easy step by step, slow, steady, single stage press. I know progressives can give my more rounds per hour, but I find the relaxing, methodical step by step process, very appealing.

    Read the book(reloading manual), you should feel a whole lot more confident on reloading and what equipment you should get. (That's a pretty good deal for the price of a book)(Usually less than $25.00)
  3. Insulation Tim

    Insulation Tim Well-Known Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,523
    Location:
    Ohio
    I started on this quest about 4 months ago after joining a sportsmen's club. Just about everyone at the pistol and rifle range reloads. Doing so saves money, but I think that just as importantly, allows you to build "your" custom round.

    I purchased the Lee Classic Breech Lock Kit that had everything that you need except the dies. I had to go elsewhere to finds the .45ACP dies and yet a third location to find powder, primers and lead bullets (these are the times). This is a single stage press and I have cranked out about a thousand rounds. I enjoy it and tend to do one function, i.e. depriming, in batches of 300 to 400 at a time.

    I never bought the books that everyone says you need to own. The information on loads is on the manufacturer's web site and even though Lee Instruction are a little hard to follow...."YouTube" solves that problem. Even though I'm an "old" guy....I have always felt that anything in print is potentially out dated when printed.

    That being said, I really only intend to load one round for the forseeable future....the .45 ACP for my three 45's.
  4. gdmoody

    gdmoody Moderator Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    10,378
    Location:
    Northeast Georgia
    I started relaoding about 35 years ago with an old RCBS press that someone gave me. I used if for a while then I bought myself a LEE single stage press that I am still using 32 or 33 years later (I have had to replace a couple of parts). In about June of last year, I decided to go progressive so I bought a used LEE Loadmaster progressive press. I used it for a few months and for the first time ever, I started having squib loads (loads with low or no powder). I got rid of that press and bought myself a Dillon RL550B progressive press which is, in my humble opinion, the Rolls Royce of presses.

    If money were no object, I would definately recommend going with a Dillon progressive press. Money would HAVE to be no object because Dillons are quite expensive. After you buy the press, you are just getting started spending. You will then have to buy the dies (but you can use other manufacturers dies), the tool heads, the conversion kits, the powder through dies, and the list seems to just keep going on.
  5. carver

    carver Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2008
    Messages:
    15,767
    Location:
    DAV, Deep in the Pineywoods of East Texas, just we
    Like gdmoody, I have been reloading over 30 yrs. now. Since you have stated that you, and your buddies, will be using the ammo that you make, then I will again have to agree with gdmoody! Buy the Dillon RL550B. It will crank out enough ammo to satisfy you all, unless you guys get into the full auto stuff.:D

    Attached Files:

  6. TranterUK

    TranterUK Guest

    I have also reloaded for quite a while, at least 30 odd years and still enjoy doing it. There isnt much I still enjoy after all that time, which must tell you something....

    As for getting started I recommend a visit to a good gun store and a chat with the guys there. Dont just buy what they say though, ask about the options and weigh them up along with the excellent advice given in the posts above. You will learn really quickly, and it is a very rewarding hobby.
  7. Waldog

    Waldog Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2007
    Messages:
    172
    If you have never reloaded I STRONGLY recommend getting started with a single stage press. Get a reloaders packaged set up by RCBS, Hornady or, Lyman. After you have learned on that then you can progress to a progressive press. Don't worry, the single stage press is not wasted money. You will always use a single stage even if you buy a progressive press.

    Read this for a "Fair and Balanced" evaluation of progressive loading presses: http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/dillonLeeHornadyComparison.pdf
  8. PPK 32

    PPK 32 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,170
    Location:
    Frickin, Illinois
    Some really good info, as usual, and lots of food for thought. Thanks.
  9. 3ME

    3ME New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    Messages:
    57
    It really depends on what you are going to load, and what you plan to do with it. If you are going to load a lot of anything (or several anythings) a progressive is the way to go. It is a simple matter of speed. I have a Dillon 650 and very happy with it. It is ideal for .45 ACP loads because between me and my sons, we go through a lot of them. I also load .357 Sig, .40 S&W and .223 Rem on the 650.

    For hunting loads and high accuracy loads, I still do them on a single stage press and hand weigh each one. That is still the way to assure maximum consistency. In the time it tales to load 100 rounds of .270 Winchester by hand, I could probably load 700 rounds on the Dillon, but the power charges would vary more and there would be other minor differences in the quality. Don't get me wrong, the Dillon does a super job, but it cannot make power charges that are consistently within 0.1 grains. The only way to do that is to hand load each one. That takes more time and more care, but that 100 rounds of .270 Winchester will last me several years of hunting because I don't shoot that many of them. In an average year, I will shoot 10 or so checking zero and maybe 4 while hunting.
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2009
  10. 312shooter

    312shooter Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,265
    Location:
    Las Vegas NV
    PPK 32

    I think all of us on this forum asked this question at one time and it shows you're right on track. Generally you have two extremes here progressive and single stage reloading both serve their purpose well. I shoot both rifle and pistol equally (match and plinker quality rounds) and a turret press IMHO answers the "in between" situation. It's much faster than single stage but not as quick as progressive, its simple enough for a beginner and allows you to advance die stages without losing track of 4 or 5 processes happening at once as in the progressives. I'd consider a turret or "semi-progressive" if you want to reload for several calibers, both rifle and pistol.
  11. PPK 32

    PPK 32 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,170
    Location:
    Frickin, Illinois
    Excellent point, while I shoot mainly hand guns, my shooting buddies shoot both rifle and hand guns, therefore there would be a lot of switching. Thanks.
  12. GMFWoodchuck

    GMFWoodchuck New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,369
    Location:
    Binghamton, NY
    I have a single stage. Now that's it's warm out I wish I had a progressive so that I can spend my time in the field rather than the basement. But when winter comes, the "time-consuming" single-stage will be well worth my time as I have nothing at all to do. But in all fairness, I usually have enough time to load and I'm not one of those 200-400 rounds a session shooters. Especially since I put my targets 300-400 yards away. That's an awfull lot of walking after awhile. :)
  13. woolleyworm

    woolleyworm Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2009
    Messages:
    4,943
    Location:
    SW Fort Worth
    Which calibers are you planning to reload? I would go with a rock chucker or similarily stout single stage to start with. You will NEVER not find a use for a single stage press. I started in reloading only a few years ago, my girlfriends father has a huge reloading room and I was forturnate to be mentored on several presses before making my "first press" decision. I went with the Dillon Square Deal progressive, 90% of what I shoot is .45 and I found a GREAT deal on a gently used one here in the forums. The SDB is limited to straight wall pistol only, but it has been very very consistent and easy to use. I will have a Dillon 650 one day, but money is an object for me at the moment. With all equiment, electronic scale, powder, primers; I had an initial investment of just under $900. With the 1500+ rnds that I've already cranked out, I'm well on my way to making it worth the cost. Like the saying goes, you don't really save any $$$,m you just shoot alot more. ( alot more accurately too )

    Do your research, pick your press and then do some searching on the forums and ebay/craigslist; you'll find one out there at a good price. ( you just wont find primers right now, if you do, send me a PM :D)
  14. Freebore

    Freebore New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2009
    Messages:
    307
    Location:
    Land of the Free
    Well....there are as many opinions as there are reloaders. If I was starting out (and know what I know now) I would probably split the difference between single stage and progressive presses and go with a good turret press such as the Redding T7 or RCBS Turret. These presses provide all the advantages of a single stage along with some of the progressive models.

    The turrets allow you to load both straigh and bottle shaped cases without any hassle, and you can set them up for multiple calibers. I also agree with the others that suggest a single stage (you can't argue with the majority) does provide an easy understanding of the loading process and will alway have a home on your loading bench.



    My only closing comment is that when making choices of what kind of equipment to use, "do you load to shoot, or shoot to load"
  15. tEN wOLVES

    tEN wOLVES New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2008
    Messages:
    174
    Location:
    Northridge, California
    Howdy all

    I'm like some of the others, I've always used a RCBS Rock chucker SINGLE STAGE PRESS, but a few years ago I got involved in Cowboy Action Shooting, and you burn up a lot more ammo, so about a year ago I started doing my homework on progressive presses, and tried and looked at most that were offered, some of my friends that had been using Dillon 550, and 650, presses, told me to take a look at the new Hornady Lock & Load AP, so I did and I started really getting interested in it, then I went back to my friends and asked why they suggested I looked at something different than the Dillon if that was what they were using, I was told that they were now using the LOCK & LOAD AP, for their most used calibers and the one pard had sold his 650, but kept his 550 for use on other cal. he had. This surprised me to say the least, but they said that Hornady is now putting out the best Progressive there is right now, with Dillon coming in second. they told me the Hornady is strong sturdy and solid, but the best thing it is the SMOOTHEST of them all, and makes a more precision bullets than the others.
    I bought the Hornady L&L AP, and waited 4 months to get it, and everything they told me was true, and with the bushing conversion kit I can use it with my Rock chucker, and it is truly the SMOOTHEST PRESS I've tried. Dillon makes a great press too, but if you haven't tried the new Hornady L&L AP you owe it to yourself to check it out, it is worthy of that. The next thing for me will be the electric case loader, this press even has cert fittings so you can grease it up and keep it running smooth and reduce the wear, that was good thinking on Hornady's part, Hornady really did there home work well when thinking this out, five stations that index, a powder measure that won't dump powder unless there is a case present, a primer flower to keep pressure in the primer tube, and a powder dump that you put where the rotor is so you can empty the powder without taking the measure of the press, changing from one caliber doesn't cost an arm and a leg either, because of the bushing system/Lock & Load device, I will be able to use this press for all my needs, and will still use my Rock Chucker for my 45/70

    tEN wOLVES :D:D:rolleyes::cool:
    Last edited: May 1, 2009
  16. gdmoody

    gdmoody Moderator Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    10,378
    Location:
    Northeast Georgia
    PPK

    I will chime in again to say that if you start out with a single stage (and I agree that you should), you will be using it for years to come. Even if you eventually get yourself a progressive, the single stage will still be used. I believe that there are some cartridges that just will not "fit" into the progressives. Right now, I reload sixteen calibers (that I can think of) and I only use the Dillon for .40S&W, 9mm, and .45 ACP,
  17. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2003
    Messages:
    6,477
    Location:
    Hesperia, CA
    If money is no object the most versatile, durable and best supported by the manufacturer is the Dillon RL550B.

    1). It can be used as a single stage press, a turret press, or a progressive press with no compromises.

    2). It is durable. Mine is 20 years old and reloads ammo as well today as 20 years ago.

    3). The time saved with a progressive, be it reloading for pistol or rifle, is time you can spend shooting.

    4). If anything breaks Dillon fixes it free post haste. If the press is updated for any reason Dillon updates it for free.

    5). While Hornady and RCBS have offered progressive presses through the last 25 years, both have released many variation of progressive presses, searching for anything to match the Dillon which is virtually the same press over that same period. Dillon got it right while RCBS and Hornady are still searching.

    6). Like any tool that uses high forces to operate, reloading presses wear out. With Dillon RL550B you get a no BS warrantee that will rebuild the press for free. Mine is on it second rebuild in 20+ years of heavy use.

    7). While Dillon stuff is not cheap it is durable. But when changing calibers you don't have to buy the complete changeover kit. You only need to buy the pieces you don't already have. For instance the family of case heads for 308 and 30-06 all use the same shell holder and retaining pins. All the 30 caliber cartridges use the same powder funnel. One powder measure does them all as it includes powder bars for both big and little cartridges. You need not buy the Dillon dies as any standard die set fits the RL550B.

    If you want to buy one press in your lifetime, it should be the Dillon RL550B as it can do it all. If you start little (single stage), then get the turret, then the progressive you'll buy many presses through the years. Buy one Dillon RL550B and you got it all. The RL550B is the most versatile press Dillon makes. The other Dillons offer fewer or more features but the RL 550B is the most versatile. Few here or in your travels will have negative things to say about Dillon or their presses, especially the RL550B. I made the mistake of buying Hornady and Lee progressive presses and both are gone. The Dillon remains.

    LDBennett
  18. Waldog

    Waldog Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2007
    Messages:
    172
    If you are new to reloading I stand by my original statement of staring with a single stage press. A progressive press has a lot of things going on at the same time and can be very frustrating for a NEWBY. If you really want to start with a progressive press, here is my perspective:

    Your question usually ignites a firestorm of of "Blue verses Red verses etc." What you are not going to find is very many people that have actually loaded on BOTH DILLON AND HORNADY. I have loaded on both. Here is my perspective:

    Consider the Hornady Lock and Load Progressive. It’s cheaper than the Dillon and has several features that, IMHO are better than Dillon.

    The Dillon has been on the market a long time and have great customer service, as a result, Dillon users are dedicated to their blue presses. The Dillon's are EXCEPTIONAL presses and do an exceptional job in reloading. The competition to the Dillon is the Hornady Lock and Load Auto Progressive. Because most of the Dillon users are so satisfied I was swamped with comments like, "The Hornady L-n-L is Junk!" I asked if they had ever loaded on the L-n-L and 99.9% said no. When I did find someone that had experience with both presses, most liked the L-n-L and many had sold their Dillon's and bought the L-n-L.

    IMHO the Dillon has one major shortcoming and, most Dillon owners will agree if they are honest. The Dillon powder measure is sorely lacking in ease of use and adjustability. It meters ball type powder very well but flake type powder less so. And, extruded stick type powder is VERY troublesome and not all that accurate. To be fair, extruded powder is difficult in all powder measures. But, the L-n-L powder measure handles all types of powder MUCH better than the Dillon. Also, it is a pain to swap out the Dillon powder measure to another die plate. As a result, many owners have several powder measures on separate die plates for changing calibers. This significantly drives UP the COST.

    Also, IMHO, the Dillon priming system is less reliable than the LNL. With the Dillon system, spent primers drop through the bottom of the shell plate into a small cup. It is an “open” system and is easy to empty. However, the press gets dirty with carbon. Whenever carbon/dust/dirt or “primer dust” fouls the primer seating station this causes "flipped" or "skipped" primers. The DILLON primer system works well provided it is kept CLEAN. The Hornady L-N-L spent primers are dropped completely through the press into a plastic tube and into the trash or bottle or whatever you want to use. It is a “closed” system. You never get carbon in and around the bottom of the shell plate. The point is the dirt off the spent primers does not foul the workings of the press. I have never had a “flipped” primer. Although I have had “missed” primers that I feel were operator error (ME!) and not the fault of the primer system. (I forgot to seat the primer!) In all fairness, the LNL primer seating station will also not work properly if the primer slide is fouled with dirt or powder.

    I think you stated you wanted a powder check system. The Dillon Square Deal and 550 has 4 die stations. You need 5 stations to have a powder check. The L-N-L has 5 stations. The Dillon 650 has 5 stations, but costs significantly more.

    How the presses indexes is an issue for some people. In reading the web about "KABOOMS" (Blowing up a gun!!). The VAST MAJORITY of kabooms I have read about were directly traced back to a manually indexing press. This is not the fault of the press but operator error. If you get distracted while reloading, you can easily double charge a case. IMHO, that is less of a problem with auto-indexing presses. The Hornady L-N-L, Dillon 650 and, Dillon Square Deal auto index. The MOST POPULAR Dillon press, the 550 is a manually indexing press. Some people prefer manual, some people prefer auto.

    Next, the L-N-L uses a really slick bushing system for mounting loading dies to the press. It makes changing calipers and SNAP. After a die is adjusted for whatever you are loading you can remove the die from the press with an 1/8 turn and insert a different die. Each die has it's own bushing. The Dillon uses a die plate. The Dillon die plate costs more than L-N-L bushings. Another neat feature with the Hornady is that you can buy a bushing conversion setup and use the same bushings on your RCBS, Lyman or other single stage press and the L-N-L!

    Additionally, the L-N-L seems to be built like a tank! The ram is about 2"+ in diameter and the basic press is similar in construction to the RCBS Rockchucker. I would say that a side-by-side comparison to the either the Dillon 550 OR 650, the L-N-L is at least as sturdily built. And, in some areas I think the L-N-L is better built. i.e., The massive ram, powder measure, and primer system. The head/top of the press is solid except for where the dies are inserted. The Dillon has a large cutout that is needed for their die plates. By just looking, it would seem the L-N-L would be stronger. But, of course, that may not be the case.
    There is one piece that can get damaged on the L-N-L. There is a coil spring that holds the cases in the shell holder that can get crushed if you improperly change shell holders. That's the bad news. The good news is that they are only about $2-3 and they won't get crushed if you change shell plates correctly. The other good news is that this spring is the primary reason that while loading you can easily remove a case at any station. With the Dillon you have to remove pins in order to take a shell out of a shell plate.

    You can load anything on both the Dillon and L-N-L from .25 ACP to 500 N.E. Realistically, I would say that people with progressive loaders mostly load pistol ammo about 99% of the time. After using the L-N-L for while I feel confident that my Grandkids will be using when I'm gone.

    In summary, the Hornady L-N-L has all the features of the Dillon 650 but is much cheaper. Changing calipers is faster and cheaper. The powder measure on the L-N-L is VASTLY SUPERIOR TO THE DILLON, at least in my opinion. And lastly, Hornady has a lifetime warranty as well. My experience with customer support has been equal to Dillon. And should you have any problems their Tech Support people are wonderful. I bought the L-N-L and am very satisfied. A shooting buddy of mine is a long time, dedicated Dillon user. He has three! After giving me a ration of "stuff" about my choice, he came over and used my L-N-L and sheepishly said, "That's a very nice setup!!"

    The Dillon, Hornady and RCBS are all excellent presses. Each has it's quirks but, each is a top quality product.
  19. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2003
    Messages:
    6,477
    Location:
    Hesperia, CA
    I feel compelled to answer the above post and to point out that this “battle of the presses” has gone on for years but here is my take:

    1). “A progressive press has a lot of things going on at the same time and can be very frustrating for a NEWBY.”

    Nothing is going on if you use the press like a single stage press initially, then a turret press. Then when you have some reloading behind you, you can go to full progressive or revert to turret or single stage… that’s the versatility I talked about in my previous post.

    2). “I asked if they had ever loaded on the L-n-L and 99.9% said no.”

    I had a Hornady progressive shotgun press that was junk and Hornady did not stand behind it. They simply brought out a new model and abandoned all owners of the previous models. That is not service! The new cartridge progressive reloading press may be great but will they abandon buyers when a new version comes out???

    3). “The Dillon powder measure is sorely lacking in ease of use and adjustability. It meters ball type powder very well but flake type powder less so. And, extruded stick type powder is VERY troublesome and not all that accurate.”

    Virtually every powder burning rate is available in a ball or short cut extruded powder, both of which the measure accommodates well. Most of the Hodgdon and Winchester and some of the IMR line of short cut extruded powders meter well in the Dillon powder measure. Since Hodgdon now controls those three brands, look for more short cut extruded powders from all three, since that is one of the latest things in powders today. The adjustment of the Dillon powder bar is no more fiddly than any other powder measure but it does not have a calibrated scale so you just count turns out on the adjuster to get in the ball park. a scale is required to get it right on but that is true with any powder measure I have used.

    4). “Also, it is a pain to swap out the Dillon powder measure to another die plate. As a result, many owners have several powder measures on separate die plates for changing calibers.”

    It takes two allen screws and the powder measure is off the press head. I reload for over 20 different calibers and I have one Dillon powder measure. I do leave the sizing die on the removable press head as well as the universal powder die, and the seating and crimping die(s). That leaves each caliber set up so that changing calibers is a few minutes job.

    5). “Whenever carbon/dust/dirt or “primer dust” fouls the primer seating station this causes "flipped" or "skipped" primers. The DILLON primer system works well provided it is kept CLEAN.”

    In 20+ years of using the Dillon RL550B I have not seen this problem but I clean the priming station when I change calibers perhaps every 200 to 500 rounds, depending. The cleaning is wiping the press off in the priming station with a rag.

    6). “…..a powder check system” and “….a manually indexing press.”

    In 20+ years of reloading over 20 different rifle and pistol calibers I have never had a double charge and I don’t have a powder check system. The Dillon system is designed so that unless you do stupid things, it can’t happen. As with any reloading task you have to pay attention, no matter whose press you use. The manual indexing is the thing that makes the Dillon possible to easily be a single stage, turret or progressive press. I have used and even owned an auto indexing press and if you develop a problem in one station it becomes a nightmare to rectify.

    7). “The Dillon uses a die plate. The Dillon die plate costs more than L-N-L bushings.”

    Yes, but you slide the die plate in, drop in two pins, and you are done. It is faster to use than the Hornady design.

    8). “And, in some areas I think the L-N-L is better built. i.e., The massive ram, powder measure, and primer system.”

    While the Hornady may look stronger, it only matter how it works. The Hornady is a relatively new press compared to the Dillon which has an excellent reputation for durability. Dillon stands behind their presses full force with their “No BS Warrantee”. My experience with Hornady’s warrantee is not so great.

    9). “….people with progressive loaders mostly load pistol ammo about 99% of the time.”

    I must not be most people as I probably load more rifle ammo than pistol ammo based on reloading sessions, not cartridge count. The Dillon RL550B is a lot more than just a pistol reloader and has no real compromises when it comes to reloading either pistol or rifle cartridges. I will add that I had a Dillon Square Deal and disliked the auto advance and the limited versatility (pistol ammo only). I would not own the RL650 because it has auto indexing of the table reducing its versatility for me.

    A new reloader can and will buy what ever he wants, regardless of what I or Waldog say but at a minimum I would recommend a turret press like the Lyman and to stay away from the cheapy Lee presses and dies. If you buy Hornady, RCBS, Redding, Forester, Lyman, or Dillon then you will be buying equipment that generally will last beyond your lifetime.

    The above is only my opinion based on my experiences. Other will and DO have their opinions. Neither Waldog or I are wrong but just each have our own preferences, I hope based on real experience.

    LDBennett
  20. Waldog

    Waldog Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2007
    Messages:
    172
    Remember what I said about "Blue verses Red verses etc." Each of us has an opinion.

    Be sure to note the very last sentence in my post; The Dillon, Hornady and RCBS are all excellent presses. Each has it's quirks but, each is a top quality product.
Similar Threads
Forum Title Date
The Ammo & Reloading Forum .45 ACP - - opinions please Jan 9, 2013
The Ammo & Reloading Forum Opinions needed! Jul 7, 2012
The Ammo & Reloading Forum Opinions wanted 270 load May 7, 2012
The Ammo & Reloading Forum Primer Pictures -- Pressure Opinions? Feb 1, 2012
The Ammo & Reloading Forum i need honest opinions on this press!!! Nov 29, 2011

Share This Page