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Re: Iver Johnson arms and cycle Works

Discussion in 'The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Forum' started by Moosr1129, May 8, 2008.

  1. Moosr1129

    Moosr1129 New Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
    Messages:
    4
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Hello out there,

    Just purchased a H&R and an IJ and would like to know any information about them. The following is all I know based on the seller and the guns themselves. (see photo's)

    Are either safe to use modern cartridges?

    H&R:
    32 S&W Ctg on left side of barrel. .32 S&W long.

    "HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
    "WORCHESTER MASS U.S.A." on top of barrel rib.

    Break top. 6" barrel with top rib. Blue finish. 6 shot cyl. fluted. Black hard rubber/plastic grips with target at top.

    s/n 443981 matching numbers on bottom of grip frame (butt) and cylinder face.


    Iver Johnson:
    32 S&W short. No markings for this anywhere.

    "IVER JOHNSON ARMS & CYCLE WORKS"
    " FITCHBURG MASS U.S.A. " on top of barrel rib.

    Break top. Blue finish. 3 in barrel with top rib. 5 shot cyl. fluted. Black hard rubber/plastic grips with OWL at top.

    s/n L18625 under left side grip panel. 18625 stamped into bottom of trigger guard.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Hello out there,

    Just purchased a H&R and an IJ and would like to know any information about them. The following is all I know based on the seller and the guns themselves. (see photo's)

    Are either safe to use modern cartridges?

    H&R:
    32 S&W Ctg on left side of barrel. .32 S&W long.

    "HARRINGTON & RICHARDSON ARMS CO.
    "WORCHESTER MASS U.S.A." on top of barrel rib.

    Break top. 6" barrel with top rib. Blue finish. 6 shot cyl. fluted. Black hard rubber/plastic grips with target at top.

    s/n 443981 matching numbers on bottom of grip frame (butt) and cylinder face.


    Iver Johnson:
    32 S&W short. No markings for this anywhere.

    "IVER JOHNSON ARMS & CYCLE WORKS"
    " FITCHBURG MASS U.S.A. " on top of barrel rib.

    Break top. Blue finish. 3 in barrel with top rib. 5 shot cyl. fluted. Black hard rubber/plastic grips with OWL at top.

    s/n L18625 under left side grip panel. 18625 stamped into bottom of trigger guard.

    Attached Files:

  2. Xracer

    Xracer *TFF Admin Staff Mediator*

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2001
    Messages:
    9,141
    Location:
    Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet!
    Hi Moosr1129.....welcome to TFF. :)

    Keep checking back. Our resident expert on Iver Johnsons & H&Rs, Bill Goforth, should be along shortly to tell you all you'd like to know about your guns.




    *Shameless Plug*
    Books by Bill Goforth:
    Iver Johnson's Arms & Cycle Works 1871-1993
    H&R Arms Company 1871-1986 (due fall of 2008)
    available from www.gunshowbooks.com
  3. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2003
    Messages:
    3,174
    Location:
    houston, tx
    the iver johnson is a safety automatic hammerless second model small frame 32 S&W caliber. the "L" letter code was used in 1904. all second model (1896-1908) safety automatic hammerless revolvers were manufactured for black powder cartridge pressures only and are not safe with modern ammo.

    the H&R is a large frame Auto-Ejector third model the serial number is in the range of the fourth variation manufactured between 1916 and 1924. this revolver if in good shootable condition will be safe with modern 32 S&W of 32 S&W Long ammo. the longer barrel on this revolver was a standard factory offering but usually had to be special ordered.
    bill
  4. Moosr1129

    Moosr1129 New Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2008
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    4
    would like to thank you for the information. this has to be the greatest site I have encountered.

    Thank You,

    Moosr1129
  5. bukeller

    bukeller New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2009
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    1
    I have recieved a Iver-Johnson 22 cal. 5 7/8 barrel 8 shot revolver from my dad. He told me that it was my great grandfathers. I didn't know if you might have the time & resoures to find the year it was made & maybe the value. It is a model 844 and was made in Fitchburg,Mass.The number under the triger guard is A1324
  6. Old Gun Guy

    Old Gun Guy Member

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    Location:
    N. Utah
    I can give Mr. Goforth a rest by plagiarizing his book. You have a Supershot top-break revolver w/ a 6" barrel. It was manufactured in 1956. In 100% condition, you're looking at around $110, down to about $60. in 60% condition.
    Old Gun Guy
  7. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

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    Dec 30, 2003
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    Location:
    houston, tx
    thanks for the help. but i feel compelled to give the latest values as listed in the new 30th edition of the blue book (which just came out).

    22 SUPERSHOT THIRD MODEL (AKA MODEL 844)------------------1955-1957
    Features the HAMMER THE HAMMER ACTION. Known as the Model 844 the third model 22 Supershot is the last of a line of top break revolvers that can trace it ancestry to 1894 when the Safety Automatic revolver First Model was introduced. The only difference that can be seen between the third model and late production second models is the cylinder, which is unfluted on the third model. Only offered with a blue finish and large oversized checkered wood grips. The barrel is flat sided round, round on the bottom with a full length rib. Caliber 22 rimfire with 8 rounds cylinder capacity; Cylinder has recessed chambers and flash control front rim; Barrel length: 4 ½ inches and 6 inches; Sights are fully adjustable; Weight: with 4 ½ inch barrel 24 ounces with 6 inch barrel 27 ounces; Frame height 3 7/8 inches; Frame length 5 inches; overall length: with 4 ½ inch barrel 9 ¼ inches, with 6 inch barrel 10 ¾ inches. Main serial number location on left side of grip frame grips must be removed to see. This model will be marked MODEL 844.
    VALUE: 100%=$300 60%=$175

    bill
  8. marcodelat

    marcodelat Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2009
    Messages:
    128
    From comparing the prices given it would seem that these revolvers are appreciating quickly.

    Is this due to the "value" of our dollar... or developing interest in collecting... or both just wondering.

    I wonder, Mr. Goforth, if you, as a person very involved in collecting (and promoting the collecting of) these pistols seen / noticed a significant interest in these as collectables?

    I know I'm "hooked" on 'em...

    Edited to add:

    BEAUTIFUL revolvers you have there Moosr1129, specially like the H&R with the 6' barrel
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  9. Tikun

    Tikun New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2
    I have a somewhat strange question. My grandmother gave me my grandfathers gun that she had been keeping. After looking at the pictures, it is obviously an Ivers Johnson Hammerless, but the from of the barrel has been filed off so that there is no sight and half of the words on the barrel are missing (I can read Fitchburg Mass on one line and DEC 26 03 and then fuzz on the next)
    The serial # is 16228.

    Other than the usual questions that everyone asks, ie when is it from and how much is it worth (not that the second one matters much), my questions are
    1) My grandmother always referred to it as my grandpa's 'service pistol'. He fought in the Abraham Lincoln Brigade as well as WWII and then was a postman. Which service was this probably his from?
    2) I know little to nothing about guns. WHy would you guess he filed it down?

    Thanks in advance for any help
  10. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

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    Location:
    houston, tx
    tikun,
    hard to determine exact date but most likely a late first model or early second model. manufactured between 1895 and 1897. the war of that era was the spanish american war but could have been used as late as wwI, but not military issue. during this time the military was more relaxed on soldiers carring personal protection handguns.

    the barrel was cut off from it's original length to make it easier to carry in the pocket.
    bill
  11. b.goforth

    b.goforth New Member

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    Location:
    houston, tx
    marcodelet,
    the increase in value of these firarms is a combination of all you state plus colt and S&W values have gone out of sight and the collector of modest means has to look elsewhere. i like to think my books and research have also helped in raising the values and collectibity but that is probably just in my head.
    bill
  12. Tikun

    Tikun New Member

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  13. marcodelat

    marcodelat Member

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    Well, I think you are wrong on this one Mr. Goforth! :)
  14. rosen789

    rosen789 New Member

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    Jun 30, 2009
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    Location:
    south carolina
    hi everyone i need some help identifying this forarm i think it is rare or worth some money but i don;t know what type of gun it is or the caliber it takes this is the information i can give you it says iver johnson arms and cycle works fitchburg mass usa patd april 6 86 feb 15 87 may 10 87 dec 26 93 pats pending its a 5 shot cylinder and has owl grips here are some pictures i took

    Attached Files:

  15. bspaero

    bspaero New Member

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    Oct 26, 2009
    Messages:
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    Hi !
    There is a gentleman by the namwe of Goforth who has written the entire history of this gun. It is an Iver Johnson Safty Automatic in either 32SW&W or 38 S&W cal. there is also serial #s either on the butt, under the trigger guard and most definatly under the L/Grip you must remove the grip and record the letter & numbers located there. He provides information on all of thesee weapons but you need to provide as much info as possible . The barrel should also say Iver Johnson arms & cycle works Fitchburg Ma. Pats Pending. Good Luck
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