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Remington 513T, Have Questions, Need Advice

9K views 29 replies 8 participants last post by  ultramag44 
#1 ·
Gentlemen,
I recently dug out my 1960's Remington 513T for a club shoot at 100 yards. I had not used it at that distance before but some of our members do it all the time and even shoot to 200 yards with Model 52's, 40X's etc. I put a 24X scope on it and proceeded to fire some reasonable, not super groups but all of the groups had fliers. Tried different ammo, Green Tag 033, Federal; 711B, etc. and decided that CCI Standard was the best that I had. Have not tried any real target ammo yet. I checked the rifle and noticed that the barrel is not free floating. The action mounts with only one screw and has no fancy bedding. This is a pretty basic target rifle.

Questions:
1. Would someone check their 513T to see if the barrel is floating?
2. Has anyone ever Free Floated a 513T barrel and got good, improved results?
3. Has anyone had trouble adjusting the Trigger Pull Weight or Over-travel adjustiments?

Thanks,
 
#2 ·
I have owned my 513T since the early '60s. It has a unertl scope on it and I still have the original peep. Mine is a tack driver. My 12 yr old went through the NRA Pro Marksman through Expert classes with it. At 50 yards it will pattern smaller than my thumb print. At 100 yards it will pattern about the size of a quarter. Our Range is only 300 yards and it will pattern in a 6 " saucer. It is one of my favorites.
 
#3 ·
bumblebee,
Thank you for your reply and the 513T success stories. Your comments are appreciated and encouraging. Would you check to see if the barrel is free floating by trying to slide a piece of paper around it from muzzle to the action. Mine was not floating. I would also be interested to learn what brand and model 22 ammunition your rifle likes to achieve that accuracy level. I have found best success with a Federal Gold Medal 711 B. I have not been able to find any quality Match 22's in my area.
Thanks again,
 
#6 ·
bumblebee,
The results are in and I'm pleased to report that they are very good. I completed the free floating of the barrel except for at the forend tip where the barrel is lightly supported by a plastic molly that is pushed into an existing screw hole. The top of this moly just touches the barrel when it is completely seated. Test firing the rifle with different ammunition brands immediately showed tighter groups at 100 yards. Last Sunday I fired in a fun club 100 yard, 20 shot match that uses two NRA, 50 foot pistol targets. Please see the targets. The best target scored 97 with seven 10's and three 9's in a 1.5 inch group. The first target was not quite as good, 2 inch group, but that was caused by the first few shots, 7's and 8's that I could not immediately see. After seeing the targets, the club Pro's unamiously told me, "Don't touch that rifle anymore!" I used Federal Ultra Match ammunition for the match. Experiments are over, modifications are complete.
Thank you for your help,

Line art Circle Monochrome Black-and-white Style
 
#5 ·
bumblebee,
Thanks again for your reply, I appreciate the information. I had guessed that you were using some good match ammunition. The real shooters here have settled on RWS R50 and buy bricks at at time on line. Expensive, but they report that it is what they need for the 200 yard shoots. I spent some time last weekend sanding the barrel grove to float the barrel. The barrel now only touches the forend at the very end. I'll do some experiments soon and report back if anything significantly improves.
Thank you,
 
#11 ·
bumblebee,
I also will never sell mine. Funny thing about this story is that if the club didn't decide to shoot the fun matches at 100 yards I would probably not have worked on it. The Pro's at the club are now after me to go with them for weekly 200 yard shoots. They have lots of funny stories about those shoots. That would really be pushing it for me as I have never done any serious benchrest shooting. I would need more stuff!
Thanks,
 
#9 ·
Remington 5-teen rifles are not designed with floating barrels. Most writers who have tried floating them have not had better accuracy. You might explore bedding your receiver with bicycle tire liner and filling gaps between the receiver and the sidewalls of the receiver well with tape to minimize and movement of the rifle in the stock. Personally, I'd follow the advice to not touch the rifle anymore - except to shoot it.
 
#12 ·
Hanover67,
Thank you for the information. Had I known, I probably would not have floated the barrel. However, the barrel free floats from the action to about 2 inched from the forend tip where it is lightly supported with a plastic moly. I was told that the approach had merit because the 40X barrel was supported with two screws through the forearm.
I am not familar with the bicycle tire liner bedding or taping the action to hold it firm in the stock. The tape is easy to try and I might do that in the future.
The good news is that the rifle continues to shoot exceptionally well and I have decided to take the good advice offered and, don't fix it, if it ain't broke! I will leave well enough alone.
Thank you,
 
#13 ·
Good work on the gun and some fine shootin'.Glad you got it worked out.I wish I were still capable of groups like that. Enjoy it Trapnbow. Joe
 
#15 ·
Hey trapnbow, I have a 513T with a free floated barrel. I bought it last year from a fellow gun club member who did the mods himself. I can't tell you the differences from before to after, since I didn't shoot it before. But I can say this, using Aguila, Super Extra subsonic ammo, from a bench rest using Williams aperture rear and Lyman globe front sights, I can group 5 rounds into 3/4"-1.0" at 50 yards with some consistency. My brother in law and nephew were pretty amazed at this rifle. They had some really nice groups as well. The Super Extra subsonic is really, really quiet out of the 513T's long barrel, like a pellet gun, really.
I will contact the previous owner and ask him what he actually did.
If you want, I will include your original post/questions. Maybe he can contact you directly, with your permission.
I absolutely love this rifle. This past weekend, I used it to win a rimfire woods walk at the club.
 
#16 ·
Hey trapnbow, I have a 513T with a free floated barrel. I bought it last year from a fellow gun club member who did the mods himself. I can't tell you the differences from before to after, since I didn't shoot it before. But I can say this, using Aguila, Super Extra subsonic ammo, from a bench rest using Williams aperture rear and Lyman globe front sights, I can group 5 rounds into 3/4"-1.0" at 50 yards with some consistency. My brother in law and nephew were pretty amazed at this rifle. They had some really nice groups as well. The Super Extra subsonic is really, really quiet out of the 513T's long barrel, like a pellet gun, really.
I will contact the previous owner and ask him what he actually did.
If you want, I will include your original post/questions. Maybe he can contact you directly, with your permission.
I absolutely love this rifle. This past weekend, I used it to win a rimfire woods walk at the club.
Ceapea,
Thank you for your reply. I especially liked hearing from someone who has a rifle where the barrel has been free floated. I am having great results with mine. I have been out of circulation for a few weeks recovering from cataract surgery. Finally I"m back! I took the rifle to the range today and shot it with some expensive RWS-R100 ammunition. The rifle settled down after about 25 rounds and then shot about 1.0" groups. That is exceptionally good for a moderately priced 22 LR Target Rifle 45 years old at 100 yards. Please see the latest target and especially the lower two targets. Target should be dated 07/30/14.
Thank you,
 

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#19 ·
Ceapea,
I forgot to mention that I would appreciate heaaring from the person who did the barrel free floating work. If they are willing, we can figure out how to better communicate. I have not done Personal Messages before but it must be easy. Please also inquire if they were able to improve the trigger pull weight.
Thanks,
 
#22 ·
Not a 513-T, but my 521-T Junior Target is it's close cousin. Same basic action, but a somewhat lighter barrel and stock. Mine came from a gunshop in a small town, and had a funky after market slip-on carbine style front sight that was ground down to uselessness. I installed a Lyman 17 globe sight, and modified an insert to have a fine wire crosshair. Works well with the Lyman 57RS peep sight.
Wish I had the 513T's better trigger. I could likely install the 513T parts if I wanted. It shoots fine enough for me. It seems to favor CCI Greentag and Standard so far. Not being a competition shooter, that's as fancy as I go on ammo!
 
#23 ·
Ceapea,
I forgot to mention that I would appreciate heaaring from the person who did the barrel free floating work. If they are willing, we can figure out how to better communicate. I have not done Personal Messages before but it must be easy. Please also inquire if they were able to improve the trigger pull weight.
Thanks,
I know that it's been a while, but I did reach out to the guy that sold me my 513T, sent him an email. I have not heard from him yet. He is supposed to be at a woods walk this weekend. I will try again.
 
#25 ·
Ceapea,
Thank you for remembering and writing. No, I do not recall your friend writing about free floating the barrel of the Remington 513T rifle. Please do not spend any more time. The rifle with the free floating barrel continues to fire fantastic groups out to 100 yards, <1" groups. It seems to me that all of the early mid price Remingtons were great target rifles out about 50 yards. However, to be successful at 100 yards and beyond you needed that extra bit of work and $$$. The trigger of the 513T continues to be a shortcoming by design.

I am on to another great challenge. That is shooting 22 caliber rimfire at 200 yards with an H&R Model 12. I bought the Model 12 as Unfired and it is fantastic! I'm in the game every week with the great rifles. My best score was done last week, 199-8X, only 0.050" out of the 10 ring with one round. Certainly expertise is important but the real winner every week seems to be the variable wind conditions and how to read it. I am a fast learmer but it is so differnt every week. Last week was the worst, the wind came in bursts with light rain. I have 3 more shoots this year to try to shoot straight 200-?X, (20 rounds for record, unlimited sight in shots, 30 minutes total time for both).

Good luck, shoot safe, pass it on,
Thanks,
 
#26 ·
I too used the bycycle insulator band bedding on my 513-T, that was first published on the old jmtpublishing site. it works! The barrel is not floated, nor should it ever be on the 5-teen's

1964 513-T, grooved receiver, Weaver T-25 scope.

Eley Club ammo, 5 shots @ 50 yards.



 
#27 ·
ultramag44,
Thank you for the reply regarding the bedding and free floating of the 513T barrel. That is a very impressive target for this rifle and I am hoping that you can tell me more about what you did to bed the action with this, bicycle tire insulator. Is that material the rubber strip that is glued to the bicycle wheel to cover the spoke screws? If so, is this rubber band, about 1" wide, then wrapped around the action front to back to solidify its position in the stock's action channel? Do you have any photographs or can you send me the original published article that you refer to from the, "jmtpublishing site?" I would appreciate any additional information.

As for the free floating barrel on my 513T. The barrel free floats from the action to about 2" before the end of the forearm. It is then supported by the lip of a a single plastic wall moly that protrudes about 0.030" off the bottom of the barrel channel in the stock forearm section. The #6 molly with the tip cut off is inserted into an existing hole. I took the idea from the Remington 40X where the free floating barrel is supported at the end of the forearm channel by two screws.
Thanks again,
 
#28 ·
Trapnbow,

Thank you sir!

Yes, it's the 1" rubber band that covers the screws in the rim. bicycle shops toss our these bands every day!

look @ the small areas, front & rear (the shiny spots) where the receiver actually touches the stock.
Front

Rear

Band Material

Rear Pad

Front Pad (An empty .22 case punches the hole for the action screw)

Two Strips Cut & Fitted to the bedding areas of the stock. The rubber is thin enough to bedd 100%, but not add unwanted bulk, or mess up the forend tip pressure.
 
#29 ·
ultramag44,
Thank you for the very detailed and descriptive photographic explaination of the bedding material and procedure. I am anxious to try this and will start searching for the thin rubber strips. Do I assume correctly that the accuracy improvement is due to the rubber strips returning the action to the same place in the stock after each firing? The rifle only has a one mounting screw and that does little to support the rear of the action.

I have not taken my rifle apart since I did the final adjustments with the floating barrel. I tightened the single mounting screw to about 65 inch pounds with a Wheeler Torque Screwdriver. When I do take it apart, I'll send photos of the barrel bedding and wall moly foreend mount.
Thanks,
 
#30 ·
Trapnbow ,

The accuracy improvement (IMHO) is due to the rubber strips giving the action 100% support instead of the 2 tiny areas it had before. The single screw does not give much support to the rear of the action. Also, rubber will soak up vibration. You may need to put a strip under the forend tip. 5-Teen rifles are designed for upwards pressure in that area, ESPECIALLY w/ one 1 action screw!

Winchester 52B's and 52C's had factory rubber bedding! the B had round, rubber buttons and C had rubber strips!

Let us know how things work out.

Regards, ultramag44
 
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