Savage model 25 pump

Discussion in 'Technical Questions & Information' started by gunny1974, Aug 13, 2011.

  1. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Just disassembled this 22 cal. It will load and fire, eject a single shell. Multiple shells jam and I believe the shell stop is missing. The carrier and the lifter function well, but there appears to be a piece missing in the carrier. The schematic lists a shell stop. Problem is they are sold out. If I had a picture or a drwg, I would make one. There is no data available for this model, and the model 29 is not close enough to help. Does anyone have a picture of the carrier with th shell stop installed. I originally thought this may operate like the marlin 336 with the carrier acting like the shell stop also.
    I would appreciate any help and thanks in advance.
    Gunny 1974
  2. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Gunny,

    If this works I've attached an exploded drawing for the Savage M-25. The omly trouble is reading it.

    Attached Files:

  3. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Thanks steve 99f. I have the same problem reading it. The carrier has a slot in it about .125 wide, which I believe to house the shell stop. The only way to ascertain how it fits and what it looks like is to see a good picture. They only produced these from 1925 to 1929 and therefore their popularity did not deserve a detailed look at the guts. If there was a book avilable, I would purchase it, but none to my knowledge. I may have to buy one to fix this one.
    Thanks for the effort, I appreciate it. Once I fix this one, pictures will be available of all of the parts.
  4. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Well, let me go get mine. I'll see if I can get a looksee. Is your fore end attached with 2 screws from the right side of 1 screw from both sides?
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  5. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Gunny,

    I took mine apart and took some pics, hope this helps.

    Attached Files:

  6. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Mine has 1 screw on each side of the forearm. These pictures are great. I am going to digest them and reply. I think this is exactly what I need. Great pics, I can tell you have done this before. Thanks bunches.
  7. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Thanks gunny. Not very good with the camera. If there is an angle that works better for you, describe it and I'll do the best I can.

    The 25's with the screws, one per side, are the early version. Mine has two on the right side. Not a great design and it wasn't repeated on the 29, 29A or 29B. Fore end was prone to cracking. I am logging serial numbers on a spreadsheet to try to determine the SN range that this variation took place. Would you rpovide me your rifles SN with the last two digits X'd out? PM is OK too. Either way thanks.
  8. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    This rifle actually belongs to a Ft Bragg soldier who is in Iraq. This belonged to his grandad and his wife brought it to me for repair. Not restoration, but just shootable. He is due home in a couple of months and this is one of his suprises. I also have a Stevens 315 for him that needs a cocking hook that I will make, as I cannot find one. I am getting some pics of this carrier to send in the next reply. Serial number 200XX. His grandad did some "work" on this gun and I will have to re-repair his work. But It is for a good cause. Bringing guns back to life is my passion, and I have a few of my own that still need this kind of TLC!!
  9. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Just so you can see this one. Apparently the shell stop has a "hook" that extends through the slot and fits into the hole opposite. There is also a spring around ithis is from your pictures. you can see there are differences. I will have to figure if " grandad " tried some enhancements, just to confuse someone

    IMG_6601r.jpg

    IMG_6602t.jpg

    IMG_6607t.jpg

    IMG_6610t.jpg
  10. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Gunny,

    Then this IS for a very good cause. It does look like it's missing the piece in the carrier. Keep in mind that pappy may not have customized it, there may have been more to the changes Savage made than just where they put the fore end screws. The carrier is certainly different. Having said that it does look as if someones been in there.

    There is a poster on this board, among others, who is very knowledgeable with the mechanics of these rifles and the design evolution as well. And he takes better pictures than I do. I'll see if ican get him on this if he isn't looking already. Gene?
  11. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Re: Savage mSodel 25 pump

    Working with it today, I believe the carrier is the shell stop along with the lifter, They slide past the end of the magazine, and at the start, the first shell pushes into the carrier and the lifter stops the next shell. This is the same as a Marlin 336. I installed a weaker lifter spring and it seemed to help with the exit to the chamber. I am still concerned about the missing parts which appears to be the cartridge guide.
    I knew these two guns were basket cases and knew I would have to fab some parts. But I did not know there would be no info on the parts. The Stevens 315 SxS will be easy as the broken cocking hook is about half there and will be a piece of cake compared to the 25. I appreciate your help, so will his wife. I did order a carrier and lifter from Numrich as this lifter is pretty beat up.
  12. Sav22

    Sav22 New Member

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    Gunny; Steve sent me a PM, I only get on this forum occasionally. His comment on my knowledge of the mechanics of the Savage 22's failed to consider that of all the models the only one I have not sat down and took apart happens to be the 25!!!!... So I just sat down and started to take one apart. The piece you are missing is not the cartridge stop but a spring loaded piece that appears to snap over and ride in some of the grooves milled into the back side of the slide arm - this has something to do with how the carrier swings, exactly what it does cannot be seen.

    I took the piece out of one of mine and the first shell would go into the carrier and end up in loading position but the action would not close - the carrier would not drop, I could get the gun to function by pushing down on the carrier through the ejection port as I closed the action - that spring loaded piece's only purpose must be to get the pin in the side of the carrier to track through the grooves in the slide arm correctly.

    As you can see from the pictures that piece is very thin at the 'barb' and even has a small hole drilled through the weakest part.

    I would also look at the rear of your slide arm, it looked to me that I could have damaged those by forcing the action closed when I had that piece removed – make sure there is not damage to yours.

    The cartridge stop is the larger piece that mounts in the inside of the carrier - you can see it blocks the opening for a shell when it is up - when the action is closed it is forced down to open the carrier to accept a shell.
    [​IMG]
  13. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    Thanks to both of you. Great pictures. I believe you got me started in the right direction. I will advise when I get the guide made and determine its function. I need to wait for the parts I ordered to get here, as the gun functions as is, if the action is moved very very slow. The carrier needs polishing, but is dinged up so bad, the shells hang. Polishing will not help much on this one. I think that a smoother carrier and lifter would allow faster cycling.
    Will let you know. The parts were shipped yesterday.
    Thanks Steve, and Sav22, for your help
  14. gunny1974

    gunny1974 New Member

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    She picked up the guns today and was happy with the results. Thanks again Steve and sav22. The part that sav 22 removed is called the action stop and indeed you can damage the action if it is not there. The cartridge guide is the spring piece on the back side of the carrier. You will notice that both of yours has a hook on the top, and mine does not. That hook covers the opening so that the cartridge stays in place, in the carrier. As the carrier move up, a relief in the reciever allows the cartridge guide to move away giving room for the shell to pop up into the bolt and then into the chamber. I had to make this piece, and the gun performs quite well. Her husband is due back in 5 weeks.
    Hope the above is not too long winded. At least I now know how the action is supposed to function.
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2011
  15. steve99f

    steve99f New Member

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    Gunny,

    That's good news, glad it all worked out. There is one thing that is worth mentioning that I had forgotten. Another collector a while back posted that these rifles should only be fired using standard velocity or target ammo. This is true of many rimfire arms made before the mid 30's. On the Model 25 in particular perhaps you recall the chamber end of the barrel being heavily relieved on both sides for the ejectors. That relieving thinned the chamber walls making it critical that no high velocity 22 ammo be used on any sort of steady basis. Be a shame to ruin that rifle.

    Steve
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2011
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