Semi auto shotgun

Discussion in 'Self Defense Tactics & Weapons' started by duane5157, May 10, 2010.

  1. duane5157

    duane5157 New Member

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    The general consenus is a pump shot gun for home defense. Is it the sound of the shell being racked or is it more likely the cost of a pump vs a auto loader. The reason I ask Im looking for an all rounder shotgun and I can get a exceptional price on the sx3 winchester. Any pros or cons I need to be aware of. Thanks duane
  2. pinecone70

    pinecone70 New Member

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    I think the sound of a pump shotgun being racked is an urban legend deterrent that stemmed from the movies. If an intruder wants to harm you, the sound may alert him to your position more than anything else. The reasons pump shotguns are nice for home defense is that they are quick to load as well as being good in tight spaces (provided they have barrels on the short side). I have a semi-auto 12 gauge for my all-purpose shotgun.
  3. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    There's pros and cons.

    With a pump, you might short-stroke it. This will either cause you to close on an empty chamber, or jam the live round in the carrier mechanism. Either way - bad. That won't happen with an automatic.

    With a pump, if one hand/arm is damaged or busy (like, holding a light, maybe), it is very hard to cycle in a new round. That also won't happen with an automatic.

    Automatics are, to some degree, ammo sensitive. An automatic (of any kind - rifle, pistol, shotgun) has to have so much pressure to work. It needs to have enough force to move the springs and work the action. Some are adjustable, so that you can set them up to work with heavy loads or with puny loads, but they won't automatically adjust. You have to set them up beforehand. Pumps will work with anything you can get in them.

    In the olden days, with paper shells, if the shells got damp they might swell, and with the automatic they might get stuck going into the chamber. With a pump, you can force them to fit. This is not as much of a problem nowadays, with plastic shells. Cheaper shells, though, have a brass-washed steel head (instead of a brass head) and it can rust, which will cause similar problems.

    With a pump, you can work it without taking your hands away from the "shooting controls". With your shooting hand at the trigger, you can reach over with your finger and hit the release, while your other hand is on the pump, so you pull it. With an automatic, you have to move your hand up to the side of the receiver and pull the bolt back, then go down to another spot and push a release to make the bolt go forward to chamber the round.

    I also think "the sound of a 12-gauge pump being racked will make the burglar wet his pants" is pure malarkey.

    While I have one automatic shotgun, my house-gun is a pump.
  4. sorral

    sorral New Member

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    When I was looking for my shotgun, I bought a pump. The clerk told me that it is the sound that will make many mess themselves. I have asked my law enforcement friends to comment, and they told me the same thing....EVERY scum bag they have arrested knows the sound!
  5. cakes

    cakes New Member

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    So, they know to shoot you because you have a shotgun!

    I think cost is a major factor. Also, as previously mentioned, autos get a bad rap because of problems that were solved a long time ago. Modern autos are as reliable as pumps.
  6. pickenup

    pickenup Active Member

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    My house shotgun is a semi-auto.
    It is loaded and ready for bear.

    As for the sound of a pump, I do NOT want an intruder to know where I am, much less, that I am armed.
  7. terryu1

    terryu1 Armed Infidel Supporting Member

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    And don't forget those scum bags who heard that sound but were never arrested .. Te He He ... RIP
  8. carver

    carver Moderator

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    Come on guys, who would have a shot gun, of any kind, for home defense, that wasn't loaded? If I had a pump shotgun for home defense it would be loaded to the gills. The only sound the BG will ever hear in my house, is maybe when I click off the safety, or the roar from the gun as the charge tears into his body!
  9. Old Grump

    Old Grump New Member

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    I have semi-auto, pump, bolt action and single shot but the pump is my go to gun because I'm more familiar with it and long usage inspires confidence in the gun.

    The only thing a boogerman would hear if I had to confront him would be the sound of my safety going off and the pounding of his heart. Nothing wrong with the semi but I shoot as fast with the pump and its easier for me to reload quickly. Probably the familiarity thing working for me.
  10. pickenup

    pickenup Active Member

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    I would take that bet. ROFLMAO.
  11. Old Grump

    Old Grump New Member

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    Since I wrote that this morning I went out this afternoon trying out some new loads for both guns, the Mossberg pump and the Winchester semi-auto. Shooting at water filled bottles and a paper target at 8 yards and 30 yards I done did it again. 5 good shots with my pump in the time it took me to get 3 good shots with the semi. In fairness it must be revealed that I was shooting 2 3/4" 1 oz. #4 in the pump gun. Load for the semi was 3", 1 1/4 oz. #3 and the semi has an 18" barrel. Recovery time between shots was a wee bit longer, go figure. Both worked very well but I actually had better patterns with the #4.
  12. Hunting Man

    Hunting Man New Member

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    Shouldn't need a second shot, however, if needed, I would opt for the semi-auto. I also don't put much faith in the pump sound as a deterrent. If the intruder is in my home then I don't want him to know my position. At that point I move to the offensive position and hopefully I win.
  13. jim brady

    jim brady Active Member

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    Either way, unless you keep one in the chamber, you're going to have to cycle the action to load it. Now if you have anyone in the house other than you - say your wife or kids - keeping a gun with a loaded chamber is not a very good idea. That's a bad newspaper story waiting for a date on it.

    I've got an old 97 Winchester pump that COULD be kept loaded FAIRLY safely. If the mag tube is loaded and the hammer cocked to the first 'safety' notch, the action locks up - and cannot be racked until the hammer is first let down. But still, I would'nt keep even that one loaded if I had kids or grandkids around.

    Thing about a shotgun is you should'nt need more than one shot to do the job......

    Actually did have the sound of a round chambering keep me from needing to use a gun. That was a .45 I had when I came back from overseas. Worked the late shift - odd hours. A potential burgler attempted to open my apartment door late one night. I was on the other side of the door(I heard the guy sneaking outside my balcony), and I released the slide/chambered a round. All I heard was "patter-patter" of footsteps running away.
    Last edited: May 12, 2010
  14. old semperfi

    old semperfi New Member

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    i live in southern indiana,old country boy at hear
    my opinion is that the sound of a pump gun being racked would tell an intruder that you are very serious about your home and property and are willing to defend it.i think that most times when it is some punk it would serve to keep you from killing a 15-16 year old kid.i would prefere to scare someone away long before killing them.once youve taken a life it is something,no matter how justified you can never forget. old semperfi
  15. AngelDeville

    AngelDeville New Member

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    I don't have the time or inclination to pump a damn shotgun.
  16. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    I am a firm believer in making a loud noise that will let the criminal intruder know that you are serious and prepared to defend you life and property. I think the noise should be "BANG", though, and not "rack-rack".

    I do see where you are coming from, with the "scare the 17-year-old punk away, instead of killing him". His death isn't on your conscience.

    But, let's just hypothesize, for a moment. David Berkowitz, between July '76 and August '77, did eight shootings, shooting 13 people, and killing six of them. So, let's say (hypothetical) that between shooting #3 and shooting #4, he was trying another one, and was scared off, for some reason. Cop car came along, there were too many people with the intended victim, whatever. Something scared him off, so that victim did not get killed. He went on, however, to kill five more people and wound four others. If, instead of scaring him away at intended shooting #4, he had been killed, then nine people would not have been shot.

    Just something to think about, when someone suggests that it's better to scare the burglar off. He's got the balls to break into my house in the middle of the night. Now, maybe he ain't got the balls to stand up to me and my dog and my 12 gauge, but what if he had broke into the house across the street, with the 80-year-old lady that lives alone?
  17. lucky-gunner

    lucky-gunner New Member

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    Alpo,

    Good point never thought about it like that.

    Regards
  18. bcj1755

    bcj1755 New Member

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    Semi-auto shotgun? One word...Saiga;):p:D Man, I need to get me one of those:D:D:D
  19. bikeryoda

    bikeryoda New Member

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    I also don't want the intruder knowing where I am... And personally I believe that everyone has to eat the consequences of their actions. If someone has the nerve to break into my house then they better have the nerve to meet their end. I have a Saiga-12 for my HD and keep it loaded with 00 buck... I would choose a semi auto over a pump any day simply because of the speed at which you can fire, and with the Saiga reloading is just as fast.

    And call me a mall ninja but I've also got a Chaos PorkyPine bayonette in case the intruder miraculously makes it past the lead hahaha...
  20. pickenup

    pickenup Active Member

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    I don't think you would be unhappy with a Saiga.
    That is what my house shotgun is.

    When I said I would take that bet, it is because I have shot the Saiga in competition. We have some guys that are pretty darn good/fast with their pump shotguns. But when put up against a Saiga for speed of both shooting and reloading, pumps tend to fall short.

    If comparing two men, both having equal experience with their shotguns. I would like to see the one using a pump, that can load 12 - 20 rounds, quicker than the one inserting a single magazine or drum.

    There is a reason that IPSC classified the Saiga as an "open" class shotgun.
    Even for going up against other semi-autos. ;)
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