Syracuse Arms Damascus Double Barrel?

Discussion in 'The Ask the Pros & What's It Worth? Forum' started by Robert, Sep 1, 2003.

  1. Robert

    Robert New Member

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    First, my name is Robert. This is my first post here, I am glad to have found this site, looks like a good campfire. I found the site when I was doing a search for info about an 1893 Syracuse Arms Double Shotgun. It is also marked 'New Era Nitro Hammerless.' Someone had posted some info about L.C.Smith, and aparently he was involved with Syracuse Arms, but I havent been able to find any info on this specific gun. I sure would appreciate any help. Thanks.
  2. Xracer

    Xracer *TFF Admin Staff Mediator*

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    Hi Robert......welcome to TFF.

    I've checked thru my reference materials and can't find anything on the Syracuse Arms company.

    I know there was such a company, because every once in a while I see their shotguns up for sale.....

    http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976318026.htm

    I've also heard that L.C. Smith worked for, or was involved with, another gunmaker in Syracuse, NY, before he started his own company, but whether or not that was Syracuse Arms, I don't know.

    L.C. Smith made shotguns under his own name in Syracuse from 1880 until 1888.....so even if he had been associated with Syracuse Arms earlier in has career, he wasn't there when your shotgun was made.

    Let me do some more checking around and I'll see if I can come up with something.
  3. Xracer

    Xracer *TFF Admin Staff Mediator*

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    Minn-eeee-sota, ya, sure, you bet!
  4. warpig

    warpig Guest

    I am on the trail as well.

    So far I have found

    The Syracuse Arms Company was a gunmaker located in Syracuse New York from 1888 to 1908.
  5. warpig

    warpig Guest

    Here is more from shotgun expert Russ Ruppel.

    I would believe these dates over the ones I posted above, as the website I found the others on had a bnch of information that is screwed up.

    Russ is a double shotgun historian and generally knows his stuff.


  6. Smokin Guns

    Smokin Guns New Member

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    Welcome Robert! Looks like these fella's are on the trail for ya. I'll take a peek around too!...;)
  7. Robert

    Robert New Member

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    Thanks Warpig and Xtrtacer

    Some interesting data there, especially the aricle by Russ Rupel. I looked further and found mine is marked '0' grade. dosent sound like it could be worth more than a few hundered bucks. It is in pretty decent condition though. A freind of mine is interested in it for his hunter safety course to demonstrate the Damascus barrel, and I will probably make a good deal to him for it. I sure am glad I found this website, I posted a link on my favorite forum for the rest of the guys that I usually yak with. www.flyinglead.info
    Feel free to drop on in sometime. It is a great bunch over there too.
  8. warpig

    warpig Guest

    I am glad we could help. Don't be a stranger:)
  9. rick morris

    rick morris New Member

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    My syracuse is a 00 model 70% stock still in good shape some bluing gone I talked with a dealer at the last charlotte gun show aboutthe syracuse He said the market for these old guns is on the rise due to so few manafactured and so few left in functioning condition becareful when you sale they will not be making any more of these fine guns and the ones left will only go up in value if taken care of and not messed with just thought i would relay this info rick morris
  10. briandowalter

    briandowalter New Member

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    i also have just purchased a damascuss syracuse double barrel shotgun the only markings i can find on the outside of the barrel are syracuse company syracuse, ny. On the opposite side "new twist". Are you aware of other characteristic markings anywhere on this particular shotgun? Is it authentic and if so, how much do you think it's worth? Hammerless, black powder shotgun. Thanks for any help or info you could offer.
  11. rick morris

    rick morris New Member

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    Take off the forarm and look under at the receiver it might be marked there
  12. Dan Boone

    Dan Boone New Member

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    I have a Syracuse Arms Company double barrel that has been in the family a very long time. It says " The Hollenbeck" made by Syracuse Arms Company It has serial ##4671 and has a Damascus Barrell. It is in very good condition and I believe it is a 12 gauge but can't be sure. We can not find any other markings but would like to know it's value approximately. I would appreciate your help, Dan
  13. Anchor Clanker

    Anchor Clanker Member

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    Good Morning Robert. (good name, same as my sons)
    I have four listings for guns with some form of the name NEW ERA. Two of them are
    New Era Gun Works, New York Nitro Hammerless and New Era Gun Works New York Hammerless Pat. August 12 1884. These guns are hammerless models (of course) and were made by the Baker Gun & Forging Co. The third name is New Era Gun Works New York Hammerless Pat. August 12 1884 with 2 Quail in a Circle. This gubn was made in Belgium by Simonnis, Janssen & Dumoulin of Leige Belgium. Look for a Belgian proof mark consisting of the letters "ELG" in an oval stamped on the bottom of the barrels under the forearm. The fourth name is just New Era Gun Works and the reference says that this name was possibly used by Baker Gun & Forging on some shotguns.
  14. chopper2534

    chopper2534 New Member

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    I am currently doing a restoration on a Syracuse Arms Triplet Steel double barrel and I am trying to locate a Schematic for this firearm, does anyone know where I might locate this item.
    Thanks
  15. Bob Mc

    Bob Mc New Member

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    I have found in my father's safety deposit box, after his death, a US Revolver Co. .32 caliber revolver with serial number, 12706. It is in excellent condition. What is it worth?
  16. RJay

    RJay Well-Known Member

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    Bob, with a question about a complely different type of firearm it would be best to strat a new post. You should also read the posst availabe in refence to US Arms ( Iver Johnson) Mr Goforth, who wrote the book on Iver Johnsons will need a little mor information.
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2009
  17. kris

    kris New Member

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    I have reciently come into possesion of a double barrel, "Syracuse Arms Co." Serial number 19793 with an engraving of "J2" and "Modified Barrel" it's in good condition with a full grain wood stock. How can I find out it's worth and weather I should do anything to other than clean and test it?
  18. Chendo

    Chendo New Member

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    Question on your posting. I have a letter T stamped on the bottom of the barrels under the forearm. New Era Gun Works New York Hammerless , with the Pat. August 12 1884 with 2 Quail in a Circle. Do you have any info on these gun?

    Thank you,

    Rosendo
  19. reb87

    reb87 New Member

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    If you email me pics of your guns I can give an approximate value and identification of them. Ross
    ross@berck.org
  20. Winchester 71

    Winchester 71 New Member

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    I have one of these that fits your first description: "New Era Gun Works New York Nitro Hammerless" is on the barrel rib just forward of the breech. The only thing on the barrel lug (underside) is a serial number, 516xx on the right barrel flat and a letter "T" on the lug behind the screw. On the receiver, the same serial number is on the flat for the left barrel. In front of the trigger guard is a circular engraving that reads Patented August 12, 1884 with a lovely engraving of a duck in the middle. The barrels are chocked extra full. A full choke guage will not slide in. One barrel is about .686-.688" the other .688-.692" measured with a digital caliper. Chambers are at least 2 3/4.

    I have three questions:

    Will you share your source on the Baker Gun and Forging Company listings regarding New Era?

    I heard New Era was a "house brand" for a hardware store or something. Is there any information on that?

    One gun smith was looking in his reference regarding Baker before they were bought by L.C. Smith, and he had no mention of New Era at all. Baker Gun and Forging was around for a discrete number of years and that would help date the gun.

    The barrels have the appearance of damascus. I was told by the gunsmith I purchased the gun from that they were NOT damascus, but were made to look like them as that was very popular at the time. The barrels are quite thick and heavy and I'd think it would be safe to shoot modern "classic double" ammunition in those places where you can't shoot lead. It's also my understanding that damascus got it's bad reputation from inferior quality Belgian barrels that would definitely fail and that there are several grades of British damascus barrels, made in the day, that are supposedly quite safe to shoot.

    Part of his reasoning that my barrels are not damascus is that the same figuring is on the flats on the bottom, and each barrel has a small area just aft of the fore end keeper where the barrels have been scraped and there is no sign of the damascus figuring once you get down to white metal.

    I just got the gun this year, it's in great shape and I've had it out for pheasant once just last Saturday.

    Thank you!
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