The case for the December 25th birthday of Jesus

Discussion in 'Religious Discussions' started by Dan Newberry, Dec 27, 2011.

  1. reynolds357

    reynolds357 Former Guest

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    The Church has never contended Jesus was born on December 25th. We have no clue when He was born. Most early Church fathers speculated between late Jan and early April. Constantine turned Mithras (a pagan holiday celebrated by most Romans) into Christmas when he declared Christianity the official religion of Rome. Constantine is how DEC 25th became Christmas.
  2. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    I look at Christmas sort of like I look at wedding anniversaries.

    Forgetting the date of your anniversary will probably be forgiven by your spouse.

    Forgetting you are married will probably not.
  3. reynolds357

    reynolds357 Former Guest

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    I will debate you to the bitter end on the subject of was Jesus born, but I could not care less about debating what day he was born on. We do not even know what year, much less what day he was born. There is a 14 year window that His birth could have occurred in.
  4. Dan Newberry

    Dan Newberry New Member

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    according to the sources I've found, at least three early church fathers did mention December 25th as Christ's birthday.

    Here are some links... http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Articles/Christmas/christmas.html

    http://www.bibleserralta.com/JesusbornDecember.html

    If there are some online sources showing early church fathers mentioned other dates for Christ's birth, please post them, as I don't want to advance false notions here. If you have that information in a book, just the book's title, publisher, edition and page number will be useful.

    I think the whole pagan connection has been pretty soundly and reasonably offset with the debunking of Alexander Hislop's "Two Babylons", a book that contains multiple errors and outright fabrications. Here is a link to help clear that matter up... http://newprotestants.com/2babylons.htm

    We've got to be careful criticizing what our brothers and sisters do for Christ in love and sincerity. Romans 14... Romans 14... ;)

    Dan
  5. reynolds357

    reynolds357 Former Guest

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    As I said earlier, it is not really worth debating. No great number of people literally took Dec. 25th as the literal day Christ was born until recently. The Church Fathers you mentioned were 100 and 400 years removed. I think if you will study Roman history closely, you will see that all our Western religious holidays myteriously had a pagan holiday celebrated on that day prior to Constantine.
  6. Dan Newberry

    Dan Newberry New Member

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    And even Hanukkah is a December 25th event as well, at it's roots, anyway...

    The festival of lights that Jesus attended in John 10 was, practically all scholars agree, Hanukkah.

    It was December 25th, 165 BC when the Macabees cleansed the temple and the jar of oil lasted 8 days.

    The pagans and other godless peoples of course understood that there was something unique about the winter solstice... the longest night of the year, the most dark time on the yearly calendar.... so they had their celebrations long about that time. Saturnalia was celebrated from December 17th to the 24th.

    But it's interesting that Hanukkah comes in at that same time, a festival of lights is called thereafter... lights during the darkest time of the year.

    What better time for the True Light of the World to come to us? :)

    One of the links I provided above points out that it has actually been in recent times that the December 25th date has come into question... that for centuries no one supposed any other date.

    The pages are worth at least a look. One of them actually is written by a guy who does not agree with the December 25th date, but he sets forth quite a good bit of evidence to support it anyway. :)

    So whether we believe it was December 25th or some other date, it doesn't matter. The Bible does not mention the date, and we of course should not part company over the matter. Both sides have their points worth considering...

    Dan

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