Thoughts On Small Caliber Handguns

Discussion in 'Self Defense Tactics & Weapons' started by kilogulf59, Aug 18, 2008.

  1. oscarmayer

    oscarmayer New Member

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    i read it correctly. his normal every day carry gun is a ruger sp in 357. ok so be it. he can handle and carry a larger caliber and better suted gun for personal protection , but he goes on to say that he while running/walking he packs a nna 22 mag. that is my point. these smaller " mouseguns" have their place and shouldn't be shunned as useless. i agree carry what you can have something, and carry something that will do the job. my normal carry gun is a browning hp but there are times i slip a beretta 950 25 acp in my pocket. it depends on circumstances weather and location of mt venture. do i feel undergunned.....? nope but i do realize it's limitations. and beats a rock or a pointy stick. which has been my stance from the start of this thread.
  2. TranterUK

    TranterUK Guest

    If I used either a rock or pointy stick to defend myself in this country, someone is going to call for them to be banned or licenced. :mad:
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 22, 2008
  3. oscarmayer

    oscarmayer New Member

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    lol tranter and here if the dems' have there way thats all we'll be left with. and as long as we're on the subject, please educate me . what is the process for owning a handgun in the UK ?
  4. oscarmayer

    oscarmayer New Member

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    oh great now we're receiving junk mail here too "generic viagra" i get those junk e-mail at home on my personal e-mail account those and do you want a "larger penis" i suspected my wife complained to someone vis the internet and got me put on a mailing list
  5. carver

    carver Moderator

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    Like you I sometimes carry a NAA in .22 mag. I usually am carring either my 1911A or a Bull Dog. Sometimes when I am just making a fast trip to the store, I have my .45 on the seat beside me. Rather than try and put it back in the holster, I sometimes put the NAA in my pocket instead. The NAA .22 mag. will place all five shots in the torso at fifteen feet; not necessarly where I want them, but in the torso. I also load it up with Winchester Dyanpoints (45 gr. hollow points). If I ever had to use it I will fire untill the gun runs dry, the perp falls down, or I do! That applies to either the 1911A or the Bull Dog! I agree with you on this one. My problem is that most of the folks I know that carry concealed couldn't hit anything with the weapon they carry, and don't have a clue about what a gun fight involves. I'm sure that most of the folks here on this forum don't fall into that catagory, so, please, I'm not aiming this at anyone here. But, I'm sure that most of you know someone like these folks I know. If you can't hit what you shoot at, no gun will do you any good, and if you're affraid that you might stop (Kill) someone, then don't carry! My brother is a Baptist Preacher. When he found out that I was carring a gun, he was surprised! Then after thinking about it a while, he thought that he might get a CCW and carry one himself. Then he started talking about shooting the prep in the arm or leg. I had to set him straight right away. Both he and I grew up hunting, and both of us can shoot straight. I explained to him that in a gun fight you don't have that much time to aim, that you should be moving as you shoot, and so you shoot for the largest target presented to you, the torso. I told him that if you can't live with having to stop (Kill) someone, then don't carry! But if you do decide to carry, get someone to teach you the proper way to draw from concealment, and get into action. I reload my own, and practice all the time here at home. I hope I will never have use my gun against anyone, but if that time does come, well, I want to be the one that goes home.

    Y'all be safe now, ya hear!
  6. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    "...the most definitive one-shot stop I ever saw was a subject found seriously dead with a single, small hole in the middle of his sternum. You could plainly see the position of his heels in the dirt and he had simply fallen over backwards. His feet never moved. The weapon: a cheap .25 pistol loaded with 50-grain ball ammo." Charles E. Petty, Feb 2007

    My grandfather had not one, but two .25 ACP pistols, among his handgun inventory. If he was in a suit, it was one of those little .25's in his pocket. Now let me say those tiny little roscoes functioned without fail. Knowing him he had them polished up real good inside.

    When I was old enough to get into serious handgun shooting, and be exposed to those shooters who pronounced absolutely that anything besides a .45 or a .357 or a 90mm recoiless or something was inadequate, I questioned him about those little .25 ACP pea-shooters.

    He explained to me by telling me in detail how before I was born, at a job he had there was a guy who came to confront thise dude for sleeping around with his wife. They fought a minute and at some point the hubby decided he wasn't getting beaten by a guy doing his ol' lady. So he pulls a .25 ACP and point blank pops him 6 times in the chest and walks away.

    As my grandfather told it, the guy shot crumbled to the ground. He couldn't move. The last minute of his life was spent begging my grandfather to not let him die. This was while he and another guy there was trying to load the late homewrecker into the backseat of a vehicle.

    So as he put it kinda like this, which I reckon is true, deadly shots through the vitals with a .25 is just as effective as anything else if you do your part. He was a WWII vet, '41 to '45 in North Africa and Europe as a rifleman, so he was no stranger to gunshots either.

    And my experiences lend me the same opinion. A large handgun bullet may allow you a bit more margin of error in shot placement, but if you do your part the caliber is really secondary.

    I have seen with my own eyes that 9mm ball or .45acp ball aren't vastly different upon hitting center mass on a man. That stuff about a .45 hitting a knee cap and exiting the kneck was never witnessed by me. But I seen a pair of 9mm from ten feet into sternum make a man drop to his knees. I believe the .45 is more effective, but not enough more so that other calibers are obselete.

    I saw a documentary with some medical insight into handgun gunshot wounds. Using the same formula to determine the kenetic energy in foot-pounds of a .45 ACP 230 grain bullet at 850 fps, a frozen turkey falling off a kitchen countertop actually hit the floor with more kenetic force over all. No reasonable CCW handgun has enough power to justify poor shot placement.

    On head shots....they are hard to achieve...and a man's skull is often known to deflect every caliber including .357 magnums. An eye socket is a damn small target when you are being killed.

    Caliber size...some people like to point out that .380acp/9mm kurtz used to be a police cartridge in Europe...and every time this is mentioned ten people will point out that European police rarely need much firepower etc etc. But did you know that .380 ACP has been an authorized cartridge choice for duty carry by the Texas Rangers for over 100 years and counting?

    Lastly, there is a statistic saying that every year, 80% of handgun shootings are not even fatal. How much do we actually know...or how much do we think we know?

    All those guys who say, "A .25 ACP would just piss me off". Hey bro...go stand in front of one then:D:D:D
  7. JeffWard

    JeffWard New Member

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    I carry a KelTec P-3AT almost daily. I carry an XD9SC or an XD45 when I can.

    I don't know WHY anyone would choose to carry a 22, or even a 32 for that matter, when for $250, you can carry a P-3AT. It's tiny, it packs ENOUGH punch to mushroom a JHP pretty regularly, and mine is 101% reliable on hundreds of rounds of ball and JHPs.

    Yes... More people have been killed with a 22, than most any other caliber... But I'd consider MOST of theose OFFENSIVE kills (Mossad), not DEFENSIVE.

    You give me the time and suprise advantage to ambush a target, and my Buckmark with a Tactical Solutions barrel and a 4 MOA Red Dot scope will shoot finger nail accuracy out to 50+feet. I can CHOOSE which eye ball to take you through. No doubt a one-shot-stop.

    But in a defensive scenario??? Give me a 380 at arms length, or one of my XDs out to 15 yards. I can dump 11 rounds of 9mm into a pie plate at 15 yards, in about 3 seconds...

    Inside my house??? I can dump eight 9mm pellets into you in a flash with my 870 12 gauge... With 6 more shells behind that.

    I see no sense in carrying a 22, 25, or 32, when a KelTec, or Ruger LCP is an option...

    JeffWard
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