What is it with California Dealers?

Discussion in 'Curio & Relics Forum' started by cointoss2, Mar 4, 2003.

  1. cointoss2

    cointoss2 Guest

    Bob In St Louis
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    (2/6/02 9:29:58 pm)
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    Well, yesterday I won an auction on a Victoria Arms Model 1913, 25ACP pistol. This is one of the arms made by Esperanza y Unceta prior to WWI, and prior to their becoming "Astra". This pistol was manufactured sometime between 1913 and 1915. I e-mailed the dealer, told him I was a C&R license, and to let me know his address so I could send a copy of my license and a money order. He e-mails me back that he could not find "Victoria Arms" specifically listed on the C&R list, therefore it would have to be transfered on a regular FFL. I e-mailed back that the firearm is older than the 1945 (or 50 years, whichever way you interpret it) BATF standard for C&R definition, but I haven't heard back yet.

    Is it something in the water out there?
    Crusty Cruffler of Fine Spanish Pistols - Eibar Rules!

    kdub01
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    (2/6/02 10:35:30 pm)
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    "Fornies" are strange people, Crusty - take it from a "Zonie" that sees them constantly as they bail out of that state and go off to pollute the surrounding states with their personalities!

    WyomingSwede
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    (2/6/02 11:29:42 pm)
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    Amen to what Ken said...They as a rule are the most anti-cruffler group to deal with... the majority are educated beyond their intelligence. swede
    Wyoming Swede

    polishshooter
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    (2/7/02 12:13:27 am)
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    Last time on another board in a discussion about their energy debacle and the fact their own state government was lying to them I also made some kinda comment about the fact they have exactly the Communist Socialist Pinko Sleazy Corrupt government out there that they deserve for being so ignorant to elect them and I got jumped all over by people that lived there for being insensitive or something and a bunch of Kalifornians got their panties in a wad and a couple of them left the board and never posted any more so I'll just keep my mouth shut this time so it doesn't happen again....
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Edited by: polishshooter at: 2/7/02 12:15:17 am

    Flhunter
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    (2/7/02 3:20:07 pm)
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    ezSupporter
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    I would'nt worry about it none Polish. I guess the truth must of hurt them and/or they did not want to face the truth. Until they wake up and do something about it, it's only gonna get worse.








    The Curio and Relic Firearms Forum

    AntiqueDr
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    (2/7/02 3:32:05 pm)
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    ezSupporter
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    Bob,

    If they end up stonewalling you let me know and we'll get it done.

    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    Bob In St Louis
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    (2/7/02 4:40:37 pm)
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    AntiqueDr. - thanks. I will check my e-mail when I get home, and see if I have another response yet.
    Crusty Cruffler of Fine Spanish Pistols - Eibar Rules!

    polishshooter
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    (2/7/02 10:25:27 pm)
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    Of course, I also got them PO'ed at me when they were singing the blues, saying they were good people trying their hardest to vote out the jerks in Sacramento, what else could they do.

    All I said was one word......









    MOVE.




    They didn't want to hear it, thought I was being flippant,talked about not wanting to leave their homes and family and stuff...but I didn't want to hear it.

    I was born and grew up in rural Western New York....

    ...and the best thing I EVER did, for my family, much less me, was move. Yeah it's tough living 400 miles from the rest of your family, and not having the kids even KNOW their cousins, but Indiana is NIGHT and DAY compared to that OTHER overtaxed Socialist Hillary loving state...and it IS a shame, lots of good people in New York, and it was a good place to grow up,....

    But you wouldn't want to live there....trust me.
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    kdub01
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    (2/7/02 11:41:04 pm)
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    Right on, Mike!

    When talking to "Fornies" about the anti-gun bias in that state, they all disclaim voting for any of the legislators that are making and passing these laws.

    Sorta reminds me of trying to find someone that voted for Clinton/Gore - sumbudy did, but it 'twern't them!

    Rich in Lincoln
    Member
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    (2/20/02 4:05:28 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Doesn't anyone have a pair of brass round ones!
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    Yes, I live in the "Peoples Republic of CA" and yes the politicians suck, but that's not what California is all about! Most, if not all the "Pinko’s" live in just a few areas (San Francisco Bay Area & LA Basin) of CA. Unfortunately they make policy for the rest of California. A surprisingly large part of the state is rural (with rural views. I just moved from San Jose to the Sacramento area and the views about hunting and gun ownership is like night and day). Sacramento might be full of bad politicians but no one near here voted them in. No better way to get your car vandalized than to go to the national forest or the Delta with a "Vote for Gore" or Feinstein & Boxer bumper sticker on your car!
    California has a great amount of public and privet land to hunt on and see. Great hunting, fishing, and good hometown people. Don't judge us on the opinions of the sheep in the big cities, besides it looks like after 9/11 we are going to get a Republican Governor, and people’s views are changing about gun ownership. We in CA have the best of the best and the worst of the worst.
    As far as leaving, I DON'T BELIVE IN A COWEREDLY RETREET! I believe in changing the political seen one voter at a time through my good deeds and values. REMBER, WHAT HAPPENS HEAR CAN HAPPEN IN YOUR STATE TOO! Don’t be an Osterage and stick your head in the sand and think this can never happen in my state.
    DON'T RUN, STAND AND FIGHT, OR WE WILL FIND OURSELVES WITHOUT ANY " GUN FREINDLY STATES"!
    -Rich
    United we stand, divided we fall.


    Tac401
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    (2/20/02 5:59:28 pm)
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    ezSupporter
    Re: Doesn't anyone have a pair of brass round ones!
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    Rich,

    I agree with you 100%, NY is the same way, the
    folks in the country are mostly good folk but as
    in CA's case the city controls the votes and
    everyone else gets screwed, I left many years
    ago as it became more and more difficult even
    in the mountains to run my gun business.

    There are good folks & bad folks in every state
    and all we can do is hope to seek out the good
    ones, educate the rest and vote out the rotten
    apples.

    Welcome Aboard Rich!
    The Firearms Forum Vietnam Memories Bulletin Board Contact Administrator

    Bob In St Louis
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    (2/20/02 8:06:12 pm)
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    Missouri still does not have concealed carry due to the Democratically controlled St. Louis and Kansas City areas. Last year it was put up to a referendum vote and was defeated 52% to 48% - most of that 52% came from within the city limits of St. Louis and Kansas City. - You know, St. Louis, where the Democrats got a court order to hold the polls open for an extra two hours, then went out to the street corners and handed out packs of cigarettes to the homeless to go vote Democratic? Yeah, great political machine. May their chads hang and dangle for ever -----
    Crusty Cruffler of Fine Spanish Pistols - Eibar Rules!

    Rich in Lincoln
    Member
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    (2/20/02 10:10:50 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del I wish we could change the way we vote
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    Amen to that! If you can't win.... cheat! They aren’t interested in democracy.

    Hey what happened to our republic anyway? Aren't the few supposed to be protected as well as the many? Is it mob rules? For instance in California hunting Mountain Lion was voted down by people who unless one got out of the zoo, wouldn’t ever come in contact with one. The people who go jogging (a lady jogger got eaten in El Dorado Hills) in the country or have their livestock destroyed don't have their voices (votes) herd. Why should the sheep in the city have the right to dictate the law when it doesn't even pertain to them.
    We, the gun owning (and carrying) public now all to well that gun laws only effect legal ownership and gives the criminals an unfair advantage. How can the mob (city dwellers) tell us we don't have the right to protect ourselves.

    Sorry if I went off on a tangent, but man it pisses me off!

    It's just as simple as the quote "If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns".

    We can't let these issues be settled by the mob because ignorant will prevail every time!

    Back to the subject, it’s not California, it's the uninformed liberal masses that screw it up for everyone.
    As metropolitan populations go up, this will become the norm.

    SPRED THE TRUTH! LETS WIN THE FIGHT!




    Tac401
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    (2/21/02 9:24:34 am)
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    ezSupporter
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    Let's hope things change for the better after 9/11!
    The Firearms Forum Vietnam Memories Bulletin Board Contact Administrator

    polishshooter
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    (2/25/02 6:35:23 pm)
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    How long can you beat your head against the law AND not enjoy your freedoms? I used to think that way too, but there comes a time...

    And as long as there ARE places to live just as nice (don't kid yourself, where ANYBODY lives is not THAT nice, that there is NO PLACE at least the same, if not better... what you think so highly of is not the place you live, but the "Home," which CAN be anywhere!))AND are still free, why not live there? And if you look at the map of the past election, there still IS a helluva lot more "red" than "blue" on the map. I say, give it to them, and move to the other "Real world".

    Let them create their own "perfect" Socialist State "sooner" rather than "later," and when it falls on it's face, which it will, you can move back and pick up the pieces. You are NOT going to stop it, and in the process, more and more voters will "get used" to the new restirctions and not worry about "a few more." It WILL only get worse until you take it back. And just like NY, where the upstate is BEAUTIFUL and rural, and "real," with GREAT people, it will NEVER have any political power as long as 7 million voters in NY City have the power, and the vote...even when they DO get mad and vote out the Dems, they only go so far as a Guiliani, or a Rockefeller, which is only SLIGHTLY better, actually Democrats that are slightly more fiscally responsible than the norm...

    You can only take it so long. I have a friend that posts here sometimes, I met when I sold him something on an auction. We got to talking, he applied for his CR, it finally came, then we talked about SOME of his California restrictions...not the least was the inspection and registration fee...and some others he is just now butting up against.

    He then said something that FLOORED me...something like, "Oh well, accidental shootings are down, so I can live with it..."

    I went through the ROOF! THAT is the attitude that will tear ALL our freedoms down.

    "Oh well, terrorism is down, I can put up with a few illegal searches and invasions of privacy..."

    "Oh well, the radio sounds better now, I can put up with a little censorship..."

    Oh well, there does seem to be a few more spotted owls, I can put up with all the environmental regulations..."

    "Oh well, at least no more Jehovah's are bothering me. I can put up with outlawing some religions..."

    And on and ON it goes...it ISN'T the non-gunowners that will 'Take" our rights, it will be GUNOWNERS "giving" them away, and then bitching when they are GONE.

    My Dad, in NY, never owned a handgun, only shot a handgun to qualify in the Army, just KNEW nobody could hit anything with them anyway, so who needs them?

    So handgun controls NEVER bothered him, he only cared about his shotgun, and they would NEVER take that, right?

    So gun control was not an issue with him, he used to say. And thought he was making a difference going to the polls and voting straight rebublican every election, but it NEVER changed, the Dems won in the Cities, and had the POWER.

    And yeah the "taxes are high, but they aren't THAT bad, could be worse"..while he paid almost $5000 PROPERTY taxes ALONE every year! On a fixed income, modest house...in the COUNTRY. Where he lived ALL his life.

    If he was still alive, MAYBE with Hillary as his Senator now, he finally WOULD have MOVED.

    And he was as WRONG as you are...


    If ALL the good people were to leave, the system would THEN have to change, if only to get you back...or only because it went broke financially.
    A tiger never changes his spots.

    AntiqueDr
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    (2/25/02 6:44:00 pm)
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    ezSupporter
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    Spotted Owl.... It's What's For Dinner.
    We Buy Guns! 1 - 100, Antique or Modern!
    www.apaxenterprises.com

    polishshooter
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    (2/25/02 11:47:57 pm)
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    I am probably going to get a job offer soon, and it would mean a move to Gary, Detroit, or Peoria, Ill.

    My wife says no Gary or Detroit, possibly Peoria...

    Me? Illinois has almost as goofy gun laws as NY and CA I think...I'd have to think long and hard over THAT move...

    I'm even thinking of applying tomorrow for a road deputy's position at the local Sheriffs office...at about half the pay, just to stay here....Indiana is still pretty sensible...
    A tiger never changes his spots.

    walter in florida
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    (2/26/02 2:30:33 am)
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    I guess I am going to brag, but I am sure glad I live in Seminole County. I got pull over for rolling through a stop sign, going about one half mile per hour. The police man wanted to see all papers on the car, so I told him they were in the trunk and I had a gun in there. HE said OK but I need to see the papers. He gave me warning and said the next, it would be a ticket. All county officials are republicans and last election the sheriff won with 82% of the vote. He is very by the book man. People who tried to get Class "C" firearm permit, must have a perfect record with no arrest of any kind. By the book law and order rules here.

    Rich in Lincoln
    Member
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    (2/26/02 2:06:04 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Retreat is only a temporary answer!
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    Wow! I guess I started a sh*t storm but I have to disagree with polishshooter on leaving the state. If we keep on retreating and never turn and fight then it won't be long before we are cornered. I think it will only be a few generations before ALL the states have large enough population centers to dictate policy for the rest of the states. If enough states turn into liberal centers like NY & CA they may make the policy for the rest of the country. I don't think in 30 years there will be a place that we can say is "gun friendly" if we don't do some thing now (what that thing is, is the million dollar question).
    Now some of you might say, " my state will never change, the people wouldn’t stand for it!" Well, that's what the people of Lincoln said about population expansion in their town. The population WAS 8k 3 years ago, NOW it's 14k and growing. Money talks and B S walks! The population went up because HP could manufacture cheaper here and could attract workers with affordable NEW homes.
    As long as people are breeding the population WILL grow and SPREAD!
    I completely agree with polishshooter on his attitude with gun owners who compromise with the labials, it's not going to make them go away it's only going to make them think we will give a little more. It's like when you feed an animal that's begging for food. Do you think a dog is going to be satisfied and walk away if you give him a hunk of steak off your plate? Little by little they will nibble at the edges of our freedoms.
    In summary;
    If we don't turn and fight, we will eventually loose, for sure. I don't think they will give us our own country to be happy with our thoughts and freedoms. All the truly free country’s I know of were fought fiercely for.What would have happened if our ancestors said, “ I don’t like how the English are suppressing us… let’s move west.”?
    -Rich


    polishshooter
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    (2/26/02 7:06:19 pm)
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    Alot of them DID. And the Revolution REALLY wasn't won until those mountain men got involved...keep in mind only 30% of Americans wanted independence, about the same amount wanted to STAY British subjects, the other 40% really didn't give a damn until it affected THEM. And if the British COULD have gotten their support, there would have BEEN no US. PERIOD.

    How did they lose that "indifference" and turn them mountain boys into rebels? By just about the same heavy handed, "we know best," "you don't know what's best for you" attitude the socialists are using TODAY.

    The good news I think is that the percentages are about the same today...where this battle will be won or lost is NOT fighting the Libs directly...but by fighting FOR the 40% in the middle who don't give a damn.

    And the other good news is our side is backed by solid unemotional irrefutable facts, logic, and common sense, and appeals to the freedom and power of the "common man." The libs have nothing but emotion, lies, and the sure knowledge that THEIR way is the best for everybody, "we" are just too stupid to see it yet...

    Our position IS stronger...But...

    The old saying is..."Pick Your Battlefields..."

    And California is lost.

    Think about it, what if EVERY California gunowner was to move to Nevada, and make a stand THERE?

    Nevada would then have the power to NOT go bad, and the PRK could go quickly to it's logical total goal, which is total socialism. And the people that are LEFT would wise up...and QUICKLY. By fighting it, we only let them blame US for not letting them do EVERYTHING needed to achieve socialist nirvana.

    I'm saying lots of people in history have "fought to the death" in hopeless causes, when it would have been better to strategically retreat to a better held position.

    If we GIVE the Libs California, New York, Chicago...and move to where your vote COUNTS and defend the NEW place, we might succeed. And let them have the unimpeded "Utopia" after which, when it falls on it's face like England, Canada and Australia is starting to now, they can't say "we need MORE gun control, the NRA stopped EFFECTIVE laws..."

    Let them have EVERYTHING they want there, it WILL prove our point, and shake up the nation to "not let it happen HERE."

    I am ALSO confident that all socialism will fail, end up in the "Dustbin of History" just like Communism...let them HAVE areas where they CAN have their "Perfect Socialist State..." It WILL fail stupendously.


    Don't get me wrong, I would LOVE for you to prove me wrong, and I will do whatever I can to support you....(FROM HERE. ) I cheered today when I saw the Conservative Republican Gubernatorial candidate was picking up in the polls...

    It's a damn SHAME that the State of Ronald Reagan is such a cesspool now because of Sacramento/Berkely/SF et al....
    A tiger never changes his spots.

    warpig883
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    (2/26/02 7:24:54 pm)
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    Not trying to make you mad Rich but the rest of the country is tied of Californians moving out of the state and trying to smother the rest of us with theri "good" ideas.

    You sound like the good kind of neighbor but keep the rest of them penned up in California.
    We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans... -- Bill Clinton, US President (USA Today, 11 Mar 1993, page 2a)

    Rich in Lincoln
    Member
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    (2/27/02 2:25:05 pm)
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    No, I'm not mad at the comments, and I don't blame you guys for not wanting an invasion of Californians to your state, but (for now) I'm staying.
    Think of me as the French Resistance (Maybe that’s a bad example...).
    I'm taking one of the liberal’s tactics and recruiting the young and impressionable. I have turned on a dozen kids to hunting and guns. I tell them to get their friends into it and tell them how much fun hunting really is. It can be infectious! I am surprised how many parents are pleased that I am showing them something that their fathers use to do but didn’t pass down to them.
    Yes, I have guns in other states with friends and family that are no nos here, and when I save up (and see if I can relocate my business), I might just go visit them permanently.
    Thanks for the conversation!
    -Rich
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