What Would Jesus Shoot ..... ?

Discussion in 'Religious Discussions' started by JohnHenry, Nov 25, 2012.

  1. JohnHenry

    JohnHenry Well-Known Member

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    http://www.thedaily.com/article/2012/11/11/news-concealed-carry-church/



    MARENGO, Ohio — Salvation isn’t automatic — but it might be semiautomatic.

    In an effort to increase membership, a number of U.S. churches — including the Church of Christ congregation in this rural village 30 miles north of Columbus — are offering an unconventional public service: Concealed weapons training.

    “Church has done a good job with coffee klatsches or whatever, but we haven’t really reached out to guys,” said Jeff Copley, a preacher at the church. “And guys in Morrow Country, they shoot and they hunt.”

    Hundreds of students have enrolled in the 10-hour course, which meets the state requirements for earning a concealed weapons permit. The training includes two hours on a church member’s private shooting range.

    “I grew up going to church, but hadn’t attended in a number of years,” said David Freeman, 52, a local engineering manager who attended a firearm safety class at the church. “Always considered myself a Christian. I came for the gun classes and have been coming back for two years.”

    The Marengo church launched its program several years ago and was likely among the first in the country to offer concealed weapons training. But from Texas to North Carolina, a smattering of congregations have recently followed suit, as ministers seek to capitalize on local enthusiasm for gun culture and demand for carry permit classes to expand their flocks.

    Central Baptist Church in Lexington, N.C., held its first concealed weapons classes in March, in what the Rev. Ryan Bennett described as just “another avenue to reach people.”

    “We want to draw people in to our campus,” Bennett told a local newspaper at the time. “And we’re going to try anything that we can to do that.”

    While conceding that he carries a 9mm pistol with him at all times, he said he doesn’t want his congregation to be labeled “gun-toting.”

    “We promote responsibility. We don’t endorse violence,” he said. “It’s just another way to draw people in.”

    In Texas, where it’s legal to carry guns into any church without a specific no-firearms policy, Heights Baptist in remote San Angelo began offering concealed carry classes in June. The class was a response to security concerns among congregants.

    “We’re about 150 miles from the border with Mexico and we’re very unsure about our insecure borders — about what’s coming into our cities,” Pastor James Miller told NRA News. “Personally, I feel more secure that should our worship time be interrupted by a life-threatening intrusion, that we would at least stand some kind of a chance in stopping either a mass killing or terrorizing experience.”

    Preacher Jeff, as Marengo Christian’s Copley is called by his flock, likewise emphasizes the spiritual importance of being able to defend oneself.

    “Jesus advises his disciples to sell their cloak and buy a sword,” he told The Daily. “He instructed his people to be prepared to defend themselves. It’s really hard to find someone in our congregation that doesn’t shoot somehow.”

    In part, the new offerings represent a response to broadly declining religious enthusiasm. Across the country, about 20 percent of Americans identify themselves as unaffiliated with any church, up from 15 percent five years ago, according to a study released this month by the Pew Research Center.

    Against that backdrop, the classes “may reflect the desperation of some churches to attract members in a time of decline,” said Bill Leonard, a professor of church history at Wake Forest University.

    But gun training remains out of step with mainstream doctrine. For example, the National Council of Churches of Christ, which represents about 100,000 Protestant, Anglican, Orthodox and Evangelical churches comprising 45 million members nationwide, endorsed strict gun control in a 2010 position paper.

    Conceding the need for an armed police force, the council wrote that “to allow assault weapons in the hands of the general public can scarcely be justified on Christian grounds. The stark reality is that such weapons end up taking more lives than they defend, and the reckless sale or use of these weapons refutes the gospel’s prohibition against violence.”

    But advocates of gun ownership rights cast the new classes as a reflection of widespread public support for gun rights.

    “The Ohio church’s classes are an example of the general cultural shift in the United States over the last two decades, in which people who support responsible gun ownership have become less timid about speaking up in public,” said David Kopel, a policy analyst at the conservative Cato Institute.

    Concealed carry licenses have seen a boom in demand in recent years. In Ohio, for example, county sheriffs issued 49,828 new licenses last year, compared to 22,103 in 2007.

    But judging from a sign posted in the yard next door to the Church of Christ property, not everyone in Marengo agrees that houses of worship should be offering gun training.

    “Some think the Bible is a hunter’s guide,” the sign says. “They are lost.”

    For his part, Copley was unfazed by the criticism.
  2. JohnHenry

    JohnHenry Well-Known Member

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    :D
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2012
  3. ozo

    ozo Active Member

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    HaySuice er, uh, Jesus
    would most surely shoot a revolver
    chambered in .327 FederalMagnum......
    Because it is definitely the
    most GOD-ly round.
    Simply heavenly...angelic....and will
    part the Red Sea !
    And very concealable beneath his robes.
    As he would also require his disciples to follow suit.
  4. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Jesus told his disciples to have a sword, and if they did not have one, sell their clothes to buy one.

    There were many weapons in that day; bow and arrow, spear, etc.
    But the sword was worn on their side, easy to conceal and quick to bring into action.

    Due to this, I believe he would want us to carry a hand gun.

    What would HE carry?
    Shoot; does Chuck Norris need brass nuckles?
    Jesus don't need no gun -
    But we do -
  5. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    I believe he carries a Beretta. At least that's what it looks like to me.

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  6. jbrescue

    jbrescue New Member

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    My wife's church has had three classes already and more are planned.
  7. cycloneman

    cycloneman Active Member

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    I am guessing he would carry an H&K. No compromise. :D:D:D:D
  8. 45nut

    45nut Active Member

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    What a group of ninnies. Don't these morons know Jesus was a revolutionary? He was not a pacifist, he was a big strong carpenter with calloused hands used to hard work. He didn't wear silk underthings and prance in the lilies.

    How about Jesus' quote "the kingdom of God suffers violence and the violent take it by force"? Oh and when he asked the 70 did they have any swords and if not, to sell their cloak and buy one?

    These panty-waist pacifist peaceniks make me ill. Jesus clearly defines when to use violence and when to turn the other cheek. If you are preaching or witnessing and someone slaps you, you don't throw down on them and kill them. You are Christ's representative then and you turn the other cheek.

    If you and your wife are walking to your car after a movie and a thug jumps out and throws your wife to the ground and tries to steel her purse or cut her or you, YOU DON"T TURN THE OTHER CHEEK, YOU PULL YOUR PIECE AND SHOOT HIM SO HE CAN MEET JESUS.

    Pretty simple really. All you have to do is think logically...........oh wait, we're talking about libs and no logic defines them, aside from ill logic. :eek: :D
  9. GunHugger

    GunHugger Well-Known Member

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  10. jbmid1

    jbmid1 Active Member

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    .338 Lapua, of course.
  11. RunningOnMT

    RunningOnMT New Member

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    Some of the opinions expressed here about the Lord astound me. I realize it's a popular concept, but Jesus Christ was not a revolutionary. He did not teach the violent overthrow of authority, though that was what the people hoped for. Rather, He was meek and kind; the Prince Of Peace, preaching submission to those in authority. He never committed an act of violence against anyone. Even when He drove the money changers from the temple with a quickly fashioned whip, it was not so much to do injury as it was a demonstration of His authority and righteous indignation. If He did wish to do injury, He wouldn't have needed any weapon. At His second coming however, things will be different. But Jesus would not have carried any weapon and silly discussions like this are not worthy of the Son of God.
  12. GunHugger

    GunHugger Well-Known Member

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    Then Jesus asked them, "When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?" "Nothing," they answered. He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. It is written: `And he was numbered with the transgressors' ; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment." The disciples said, "See, Lord, here are two swords." "That is enough," he replied. (Luke 22:35-38, NIV)
  13. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    It was not the right time for a Jewish revolution against Rome, so Christ did not preach that to them.

    But a pacifist?

    Telling his disciples that he took care of them while he walked with them, but now it was time for them to buy weapons?
    Making a whip before driving the money changers from the temple, after he had upset the tables they had set up there?
    Cursing a fig tree so that it died?
    Calling the Pharisees snakes?
    And those are merely his NT actions.
    Remember Jesus said "I and the Father are one".
    So every action taken by God in the OT was taken by Jesus, including the eradication of Sodom and Gomorrah.
    ROMT is right in that Christ came to earth in 1 AD for the specific purpose of being a sacrificial lamb, and he perfectly fulfilled that purpose. But God is much more than a sacrificial lamb; Jesus is also the Lion of Judah. When he returns to fight the battle of Armageddon, he will slay millions who are opposed to him.

    Pacifist?

    No way.
  14. ka64

    ka64 Active Member

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    Time to move south..........
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2012
  15. cycloneman

    cycloneman Active Member

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    hk91

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  16. MSGT-R

    MSGT-R Active Member

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    Preach peace, prepare for war. Hope for the first, fall back on the second if the first fails. To lie down and give up is un-natural. Everyone defends themselves when their backs are against the wall, it's human nature. You don't have to be a bad guy nor the agressor to carry a gun, but you do need to know how to use it. The same goes for any other sort of weapon or it can easily be taken away from you.
  17. Grizz

    Grizz Member

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    I like this verse here, Jesus literally told them to sell the clothes off their back and buy a sword. But I think today he would duel wield full auto .338 lapua's with 100 round drum mags each.
  18. BlackEagle

    BlackEagle Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    An account of armed Christians being attacked during their church service and defending themselves successfully against a superior number of trained enemies.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Drumclog

    Jesus constantly said His Kingdom is not of this world, but He has left us in the world. He did not defend Himself with violence; he didn't need to. At His word the storm stopped. The crowd was fed. Those who wanted to stone Him let Him walk through their ranks because "His time was not yet come".

    As Terry said, He does not need weapons. But I don't think He always wants us to go without. He told us to be harmless as doves but wise as serpants--Matt. 10:16.
  19. Fast Forward

    Fast Forward Member

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    C,mon He would carry a M1 Garand and a 1911 for a side arm,,,,Jesus would only shoot the best
  20. twobit

    twobit Member

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    I think he would be partial to a Peacemaker
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