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where do most of you get your bullets ?

Discussion in 'The Ammo & Reloading Forum' started by Jay, Sep 19, 2007.

  1. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    inplanotx:

    My repsonse was for newer shooters than you. You obviously have taken the effort to learn how to get lead to not plate out on the bore. I think few here, especially someone new to shooting, will bother to follow the steps required to assure bore's don't lead. I have no interest in fire lapping the bores of my 25 handguns to shoot lead bullets that are only pennies less than plated (copper flashed or whatever) that don't stick lead to the bore. I also have done casting years ago and found it NOT enough rewarding either financially or to give me any sense of accomplishment that the rest of reloading does. So I will not cast myself and I think few other will when bulk cast bullets (copper flashed or not) are so inexpensive. There is also the lead fumes risk that I will not subject myself to.

    The fact is if you do not do what you suggest and what the book you sugested documents, you'll get lead in the bore and it's not that easy to get out. For me and the rest of us that haven't been shooting 40+ years we'll buy the copper plated bullet and minimise the rest of the work that casting bullets require.

    I'm sorry you don't agree with my viewpoint. You don't have to because all this is just my opinion. Others might, so I present my experiences. You are free to present yours too which you did. I do not doubt that what you say works. I and maybe others may like to find other easier ways to enjoy shooting.

    By the way I'm five years older than you and helped friends cast bullet in the early 1960's. So I've been there, done that! And I won't be doing it again! But you can! I would only ask that when you tell people lead is easy to get out of a barrel you give them the rest of the story about low velocities, fire lapping guns, and the handfull of other requirements that are not intuitively obvious, even to us older hands at reloaders.

    This is all my opinion and nothing more. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Those that visit here can take my infomation or leave it. Frankly, I don't care which. But it all works for me and it may work for others too.

    If you are so enthusiastic about your methods for no-leading of barrels, may I suggest you write a "How To" article and offer it whenever the subject comes up. I do that on several subjects that interest me. I make the articles detailed and complete and require Email delivery to those interested, because they are so long compared to what can be posted here. I personally would be interested in seeing your approach but not interested enough to chase down articles and read whole books on the subject. I think that might also be the view of others ... we need a condensed version. Please think about doing it.

    LDBennett
  2. inplanotx

    inplanotx New Member

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    Well, LD, I do not think I need to go through all that, because Veral Smith already did it. This is a booklet and is not a volume per se. Here is what is on the LBT page where the book can be bought and a description of what is covered. So anyone interested can go to the LBT web page and order it.

    JACKETED PERFORMANCE WITH CAST BULLETS
    By Veral Smith


    This illustrated booklet is recommended reading for all bullet casters, especially beginners, but even for those with 40 years experience. It has information about cast bullets which you won’t find anywhere else, and covers every important factor about making and shooting lead bullets. It explains how to do it, the scientific answer to things that can go wrong, why, and how to correct any problem. Has Veral's new formula on killing power which dispels the other theories and myths (unscientific and unprovable notions) relative to killing power, and explains what actually makes a bullet kill. You’ll know and can prove the whole book is fact, and learn that the author despises theory, on anything!


    PRICE $25.00 Shipping weight ½ lb

    Here is the url to go to to learn all about shooting lead bullets.

    http://www.lbtmoulds.com/

    You are correct,there are a lot of things I did to my handguns to make them shoot properly with cast lead bullets. However, as a shooting enthusiast I have always asked questions when I did not know what caused my problem. I guess that is the engineer in me. When something is wrong, such as leading occurs, I ask myself what caused it. I like to know why it went wrong and it lead me to learn the many things that I have encountered along the way.

    A lot of people just say "I tried it and it didn't work so I won't do it again". There is nothing wrong with this, and when I encounter it, I have a need to know why it happened.

    So the fact that you don't like it is fine anad not a problem with me. You don't like the fact that your gun leads up so you decided to switch to a plated bullet. Nothing wrong in that.

    Me, I need to know why it happened and need to find the root cause of why it happened. Just the engineer in me speaking. I love cast bullets! If I want a plated hunting type bullet, I'll buy them. However, I seldom use a jacketed bullet in my handguns.

    With my Blackhawk 7 1/2" .45 Colt, I shoot a 300 grain bullet at close to 1200 fps and lead does not play a factor in that gun. Yes, it has been modified, but minimally and it cleans up easily with a good dousing of Shooters Choice Lead Remover and Kroil penetraiting oil in a 50/50 mix, leave 10 minutes and run a couple of patches through it and its clean as a whistle.

    IPT
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2007
  3. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    inplanotx:

    I too am an engineer (10 years retired EE for Hughes Electronics on radar and sonar systems) but at the time (about 15 years ago) when I was having leading problems I could find no answers to leading in barrel (no Internet for me then). Every thing I read then said make them harder and they won't lead as bad or get used to it. When Rainier came along with plated bullets and my shooting range at the time was pushing for only jacketed bullets to minimise the lead dust hazards, I jumped on the Rainier plated bullets. When I had a feeding problem develop with a couple of my semi-autos I went for the Remington or Winchester bulk FMJ bullets, mostly because they feed flawlessly and are not that much more expensive than commercial cast bullets when I buy them wholesale. So its not that I did not try the engineering trouble shooting approach, I just gave up on it when it was not fruitful at the time.

    While reloading is not drudgery for me and often is rewarding when I push out a bunch of good ammo, I enjoy shooting and gunsmithing a lot more. So I develop loads to be just good enough to satisfy and spend more time shooting and working on guns. We all have our individual interest in the shooting sports game and that's just mine. Casting was pure drudgery for me in the 1960's and it would be worse today. So I have my work arounds for inexpensive ammo, which don't correspond to yours. Sorry, but that's the way it is.

    As for the book or booklet, it's still $25. I don't care $25 worth but I still would like to hear how you implemented it for your uses. I think other might too.

    LDBennett
  4. JLA

    JLA Well-Known Member

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    the lead i shoot doesnt leave any more lead residue in the bore than a jacketed bullet leaves copper residue. thats because i dont push them beyond thier limitations. since i pretty much only use lead for target practice, im not pushing them much beyond 800fps. even from my .44 mag. i do use lead occasionally for hunting with my .44 mag. and my .480 but the bullets are always gaschecked... when i first started out shooting lead, i was trying to push them as fast as the cartridges limitations would allow, which in turn, caused leading problems for me, especially in the .357 and .44 magnum velocitiy range. bevelbase designs also cause signifigant leading even at the lower velocity range. and i believe plano explained the reason for this above. my point is, no matter how you look at it, lead, cast or soft swaged is far more economical than any plated or jacketeted bullets out there. unless you are the type that five fingers you bulk bullets from your local supply house:)
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2007
  5. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    JLA:

    Two factors make plated bullets important to me:

    1). I buy them at the right price ... wholesale. Not all have this connection so I suppose for price you have to factor that in.

    2). Time is money and the older you get the less time you have. Spending hours digging lead out of bores is wasted time to me. I buy one Rainier bullet for 357, for example, and shoot it slow, fast and in between. I don't have stores of various type bullets for varoius levels of bullet performance. Just one bullet does it all. That works for 44 and 45 as well, if I choose.

    Yes, it is possible to use lead bullets. You can treat the bores so they are super shinny and minimise leading. You can formulate bullets of lead compounds that are very hard and minimise leading. You can limit the velocities and minimise leading. And I suppose there are other things like your choice of bore cleaners that help. But I do none of those because I prefer to shoot rather than invest time in all the things required to keep my guns from leading. I also do not like the concept of breathing lead while casting. Newbies can choose either path but the fact remains that plated bullets do not lead bores and the results from using plated bullets are guns that are easier to clean.

    That's my choice and others have theirs. We all do what we like when it comes to hobbies, usually regardless of the costs. That's what hobbies are about .... doing what you enjoy. I don't enjoy casting or cleaning lead out of bores so I design my processes to avoid what I don't like to do. I do not ever keep track of the costs. If I did I might quit shooting. But I try to shop smart.

    LDBennett
  6. JLA

    JLA Well-Known Member

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    LD:
    I feel like we are deviating from the subject, as is so common on this forum. one starts a thread looking for advice, and by the time 5 people post thier 'opinions' you have an argument that is so off subject that the original thread starter forgets why he even started the thread in the first place. i mean no offense to you, and i too occasionally use plated and jacketed bullets. however, the thread was originally posted so the original thread starter might obtain useful information in where we get our bullets and why. i post my replies, not to fuel the fires that grow within our forum, but to try to adhere to the original threads requests. see, for a new guy reading your posts about lead in the bore, may frighten him from using lead ever, when in fact if you do it right, it can be just as enjoyable as reloading and even shooting, and not to mention the most cost effective method of obtaining useful bullets. i understand that we all have our opinions about what we think is the right way to go, but i think we should leave it as just that, OPINIONS...
  7. Jay

    Jay New Member

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    I remember the original question, and I remember why I asked the question. I checked out the relevant responses, and found that many vendors are out of the more popular components. I eventually found what I wanted at a reasonable price, and that's what counts.

    Thanks, Jay
  8. LDBennett

    LDBennett Well-Known Member

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    JLA:

    Note that at response #6 I said "I buy on the internet if I can, mostly from a wholesaler (no retail sales!) and Midway."

    While I answered very early, some people took exception to my opinions about plated bullets and lead bullet. Some educated me about what causes leading and how to minimise it. That's how it got to here.

    I think a lot of information was released by this thread and it covered not only a source of lead bullets but brought up and discussed other options as well. While we had some debate on that issue, I learned that if you do the right things you can make lead bullets not lead the bore. I think others learned that you don't have to put up with leading with inexpensive lead bullets (use plated bullets). Some here are new and may not be as informed as you and welcome the information. But JAY not only got several sources but actually ordered bullets. So everybody should be happy and smarter.

    I think it is not enough to just do something, but I think it better to know how and why it works the way it does. I always try to educate visitor here as do others and the result is some deviation from the topic but this time we were all talking about the same subject ... lead bullets..... and JAY got his answers too.

    LDBennett
  9. bluesea112

    bluesea112 Active Member

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    Remember to play nice LD and Plano. It's all fun and games until somebody loses an eye.
  10. Bravo1

    Bravo1 New Member

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    I use Midway, and Cabelas alot since my fiancee works for Cabelas i get good discounts.
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