Wolf And ?

Discussion in 'The Ammo & Reloading Forum' started by 25yretcoastie, Mar 17, 2012.

  1. 25yretcoastie

    25yretcoastie Member

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    Is it possiable to reload Wolf and other steel cases?
  2. gdmoody

    gdmoody Moderator Supporting Member

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    In a word: NO - the Russian ammo is usually Berdan primed so it has two small offset flash holes instead of one in the center.
  3. Bobitis

    Bobitis Guest

    I'm not a reloader, but I'm curious as to why that makes a difference.
    Does the powder care?
  4. JLA

    JLA Well-Known Member

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    No but the dies do. Reloading dies are designed to decap boxer primed cases. That said there is a guy on youtube that does reload the steel wolf cases with LEE dies. He claims the decapper pin simply punches a 3rd hole between the 2 berdan holes. Hes loading .223.

    I aint doin it, theres no reason to. reloadable brass cases are readily available.
  5. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    Is it possible? Yes. Is is a pain in the ass? Also yes. As JLA said, boxer primed brass is available for just about everything. There is no sense in screwing with Berden steel.
  6. Alpo

    Alpo Well-Known Member

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    Pay attention Bob. I’m about to give my nickel lecture on primers. A primer on primers, if you will.

    A centerfire priming system consists of a cup of brass, a pellet of percussion-sensitive explosive, and an anvil. The pellet sits in the cup and sits on the anvil. Firing pin strikes the outside of the cuup which crushes the pellet between the inside of the cup and the anvil, making the pellet explode and shooting flame through the flash hole(s) into the body of the case where it sets the powder on fire.

    The primer sits in a depression in the back of the case called the “primer pocket”.

    Mr. Berden invented a primer where the anvil was a permanent part of the pocket. The primer is only the cup and the explosive. And when the pellet explodes, fire goes through two small holes offset from the center of the primer pocket.

    Mr. Boxer invented a primer where the anvil is part of the primer. When the pellet explodes the flame goes down one large hole in the center of the pocket.

    As far as making the gun fire, either system works great. The problem is when you go to reload.

    With a boxer primer, the “decapping die” has a pin in the center of it, that goes down that large, centered hole in the primer pocket, and pushes out the old primer. No muss, no fuss.

    With berden primers, the holes are not centered, so you must use a different method. There are two that I am aware of. You can either pry the old primer out, using either a special tool made for that (looks kinda like an old-fashioned can opener) or a screwdriver or ice pick. Either way, a bit of a pain in the butt. Or you can use hydraulics. You put water in the case and using a snug-fitting plunger, hit the plunger with a hammer. Since water cannot compress, as the plunger goes down the water has to go somewhere. It goes out the flashholes, pushing the old primer out. Messy.

    Now you have to reprime. You can’t use boxer primers in berden cases as they are. The boxer primer has the anvil built into it, and the berdan primer pocket has an anvil built into it. There ain’t room. So you gotta get rid of the anvil in the pocket. This means either grinding it out of swaging it down. More unnecessary work.

    Then (and this is hearsay – I have never tried) boxer primers and berdan primers are not the same size. You go trying to put a (making up numbers here) .220” diameter primer in a .225” diameter hole, and it tends to fall out.

    You could, of course, use berden primers. If you could find any. Since all American ammo is boxer primed, and all American reloading dies are designed to work with boxer primed ammo, the primers that are sold are boxer. Every once in a great while some berdens will show up.
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2012
  7. Bobitis

    Bobitis Guest

    So it all comes down to the size (OD) of the primer?
  8. cpttango30

    cpttango30 Guest

    No it comes down to one primer for each way. I have never seen berdan primers for sale. First why are you shooting crap ammo to begin with. Then why would you want to reuse said crap ammo?
  9. 25yretcoastie

    25yretcoastie Member

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    Some on here say Wolf is ok and others say its not. Just wondered if I bought some pf it if it was worth reloading it. From the replys oh here sounds like its just not worth fooling with. By the way cpttango30 I once was told that the only stupid question was the question that you didn't ask so why don't u lighten up. Not all of us are as smart as u are
  10. 76Highboy

    76Highboy Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Hey 25, good question.
  11. gdmoody

    gdmoody Moderator Supporting Member

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    I ain't going to outright call the guy a liar, but I have picked up and tried to reload berdan primed brass by accident. The inability of the pin to "make a third hole" has broken the de-capping pin and bend the rod, more than once, on my RCBS dies. I have done the same thing with Lee dies. If you use Lee, you know they are designed so that the de-capping pin and rod will push out of the top to keep them from breaking. THEY ARE NOT GOING TO MAKE A THIRD HOLE!!
  12. TheGunClinger

    TheGunClinger Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I mistakenly tried to load some .308 brass that I picked up at the range. When I tried to de-prime, the pin kept pushing up and the brass crushed. Thats when I learned about berdan primers. BTW, I was picking up my own brass and got a few milsurps mixed in.
  13. RandyP

    RandyP Member

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    And oddly enough (history is sometimes funny that way) and if my aging memory serves me this sunny Sunday, Berdan was invented in America and Boxer across the pond. As time rolled on the location of standardized use did a 180.
  14. JLA

    JLA Well-Known Member

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    I cant find the vid george. maybe youtube removed it. I aint gonna try it either. Dont care enough too. Ill keep reloading boxer brass cases.
  15. 76Highboy

    76Highboy Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    I tried it years ago and it broke my decappeing pin on the first try (RCBS if I remember right).
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