WWII Aviation Trivia....Radial or Inline

Discussion in 'General Military Arms & History Forum' started by Guest, Mar 3, 2003.

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    Xracer
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    (12/4/01 5:18:04 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del All WWII Aviation Trivia....Radial or Inline
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    WWII prop-driven aircraft had either radial or inline engines. A few, during their lifetimes, had both radial and inline engines. One even went from radial to inline, back to radial, and back to an inline.

    So, avaiation buffs.....how many WWII aircraft can you name that had both radial and inline engines in the same airframe?

    warpig883
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    (12/4/01 5:52:51 pm)
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    Better yet ,how about radial to turbine? I know of at least 3 in the 40's to present.
    Know what?

    Xracer
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    (12/5/01 9:10:03 am)
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    Not during WWII.

    warpig883
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    (12/5/01 10:21:47 am)
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    Nope but they are aircraft from the 40's and 50's and are still flying.
    Know what?

    Edited by: warpig883 at: 12/5/01 10:22:30 am

    obelix2
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    (12/5/01 3:55:47 pm)
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    I don't have any references handy, but I believe the Curtis P40 was the Allison version of the P36.

    Xracer
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    (12/5/01 4:43:21 pm)
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    Right. The Curtiss P-36 Mohawk had a Wright R-1820 Radial....they put an Allison V-1710 into the same airframe and it became the P-40.

    That's the only American one that I know of, but there are plenty more British, German, Italian, and Japanese examples.

    polishshooter
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    (12/5/01 9:44:15 pm)
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    I was just going to ask if it was just American, GREAT post X!

    And is it only limited to fighters?
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    polishshooter
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    (12/5/01 10:00:05 pm)
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    And can we use experimental versions?

    The easy one is the Zero...wasn't it the Hamp that was basically and in-line Zeke?

    I believe the EALIEST Bf 109 ws tested with a Radial, I think I saw a picture somewhere, it looked goofy, and the FW 190 had several experimental models with in-lines...

    The D4 Suisei (Judy) dive bomber had both variants...

    I know the Halifax had both at various time, didn't the Lancaster start out with Radials before the Merlins? Or was it the other way around?

    And I know there were more American ones, at least prototypes with one or the other, let me think about it some more...
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Edited by: polishshooter at: 12/5/01 10:25:27 pm

    polishshooter
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    (12/5/01 10:28:47 pm)
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    WOW, went to my Jane's, found a couple more, like the Wellington and Tempest, but the WIERDEST thing I learned, that I didn't know, is the original XP-47 was designed as a LIGHTWEIGHT high speed interceptor with an IN-LINE water cooled, and was to have ONE .50 and 3- .30s. "It was not developed."

    The XP-47B developed into the Jug we know and love...
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
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    (12/6/01 9:09:42 am)
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    Nope....experimental and prototype don't count....only production aircraft.

    Nope....Zeke was radial only, and the Hamp was a clipped-wing Zeke.

    Yep....Lancaster, Halifax, and Wellington all had both Bristol Radials and Merlin inlines.

    Gotta check on the D4Y Judy.

    There are lots more........keem 'em coming!

    Xracer
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    (12/6/01 10:01:47 am)
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    OK, nice goin' Polish. This is one I missed.

    The Yokosuka D4Y1&2 had a Aichi Atsuta 32 inverted vee (license built copy of the Diamler-Benz DB 601A). The D4Y3&4 had a Mitsubishi MK8P radial.

    Also, the only Griffon engined Tempest was a prototype, so that doesn't count. 36 were completed with the Bristol Centaurus....all the rest had Napier Sabres........so guess you're right (barely) on the Tempest. Another one I didn't have.

    OK.....lots more to go!



    obelix2
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    (12/6/01 11:32:30 am)
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    production models of the BF109 ever used radials; at least the ones used in Spain didn't, and that was quite early.

    Other hand: I recall seeing photos of the Bristol Beaufighter in both configurations.

    polishshooter
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    (12/6/01 4:20:49 pm)
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    OB, Jane's has the Beau always with radials, and I thought I saw pictures of Mosquitos with radials, but flipping through Janes, I think I was mistaken...there were TON'S of Mosquito look-a-likes made by numerous factories, Dehaviland, Bristol and others, for everything from High altitude fighters to light bombers to target tugs(!) that had both, and every one looks SOMETHING like a Mosquito...I'm wondering if I ever saw pictures of one misidentified as a Mosq.

    And OB, the 109 picture was like the very FIRST model/prototype, like 32-33 maybe? The plane was ready before the Jumo engine, they air tested the air frame with a radial, and I BELIEVE it may have been a US Wright Cyclone or Wasp...I wish I could remember where I saw it, I remember showing it to my son...


    HHmmm....more....let's see, you can pretty much eliminate Navy...

    And I haveta protest the P-40, it WAS a totally different model than the P-36/Hawk 75...

    Il-2 Sturmovik? How about the Yak, or Mig-3, somehow I think there was a transition fighter from the radial Mosca used in Spain to the later WWII in-lines...
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Edited by: polishshooter at: 12/6/01 4:29:59 pm

    polishshooter
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    (12/6/01 4:32:32 pm)
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    Nope, I was wrong...I found it, forgot I had a book on it...

    Not a Radial, but the first 109 prototype had a Rolls Royce Kestrel in-line, from England...before the Jumo was ready...I KNEW there was something ironic about it, but wrong with the memory...
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
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    (12/6/01 4:54:57 pm)
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    Fight nice, boys!

    Obelix, you're right. All Beaufighters had Hercules Radials EXCEPT for the Mk. IIF (nightfighter version) which had Merlins.

    Polish....protest disallowed! Rules are, radials and inlines in the same airframe. P-36 and P-40 had the same airframe. In fact, later, they tried to go back to a radial....a big P&W R2800 was tried and it was called the XP-60. Doesn't count though....not production.

    Not the Sturmovik....or the Mosca. Close though. The Lavochkin LaGG-3 had Kimov M-105PF V121...and was a dog. They put in a Shetsov M-82FN radial and it became the La-5....a pretty nice fighter. Later they upgraded the airframe, and it became the La-7....one of the best Soviet fighters.

    Neither the Mosquito or Bf-109 was ever a radial.....however, another very popular German fighter was both (hint, hint).

    Lots more guys.......keep those radails and inlines coming, folks!

    polishshooter
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    (12/6/01 9:28:36 pm)
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    Since I already mentioned the 190, what about the Bf110? Don't remember it with a radial though...

    Didn't the Do335 have one radial and one inline?

    How about the Ju88...

    Oh yeah! The DO217!!! I've seen it with both I'm sure...

    And it's funny, I'll have to check my Janes, but they didn't mention the radial Beau...I think...


    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
    Senior Chief Moderator Staff
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    (12/7/01 9:27:21 am)
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    Polish....you hadn't mentioned the FW-190 before. The 190A&B were powered by the BMW 801 radial, the 190D&F had the Junkers Jumo 213 inline, and the 190G went back to the BMW 801D2 radial.

    Yep....the Do 217 was built with the BMW801 (R), the Junkers Jumo 211A (I), and the DB603A (I).

    My info is that ALL the Beaufighters had various Hercules radials, EXCPT for the IIF version which had Merlins.

    "The Beaufighter IIF was, in fact, the only Merlin-engined version to be built, and the type served primarily as a home-defence night-fighter, but was also used by Nos 721, 723, 775, 779, and 789 Squadrons of the Fleet Air Arm." Complete Encyclopedia of World Aircraft, pp201-202.

    Plenty more, guys.....keep 'em coming!

    polishshooter
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    (12/7/01 10:19:16 pm)
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    Yes I did, check out above...NEENER NEENER NEENER!


    "I believe the EALIEST Bf 109 ws tested with a Radial, I think I saw a picture somewhere, it looked goofy, and the FW 190 had several experimental models with in-lines..."

    I think my SECOND post above... ...Just for the record...

    (I suppose you are now going to disqualify it for the one lousy word "experimental..." )(As well as because I was wrong about the Bf109...)

    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
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    (12/8/01 9:46:40 am)
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    Yeah.....I'm picky, picky, picky!

    Keep 'em comin....there are more British, German, Jap, Russian, and Italians.

    polishshooter
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    (12/9/01 8:00:27 pm)
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    How about the PO-15 or whatever the light bomber was the Russian women pilots flew night harassment missions against the Germans....

    How about the G4M Betty, or the Myrt?

    HHHmmmm....more, huh?

    The Kawanishi Emily?

    AHA, I think I saw the Gloster Gladiator with both types in pictures...

    And Italian don't count...

    The Savoia Marchetti ALWAYS had radials...it was one of the first models I put together as a kid...

    But there WAS an Eyetie fighter that I think had both...give me a minute......
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
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    (12/10/01 8:51:51 am)
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    I missed on you named....the Ju-88.

    No on the Gladiator.....they were all radial (even Faith, Hope, and Charity....remember those?).

    No on the Japs.....the one left was a fighter.

    Don't know of any Po-15....there is another Russian, though.

    Keep 'em coming.

    polishshooter
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    (12/12/01 1:26:30 am)
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    "Maltese Air Force"

    Maybe it was the PO-2...

    HHhmm...the Tony was in-line always, wasn't it?

    How about the Frank, (Shiden?)

    You KNOW, it wasn't WWII, but wasn't the P-12 Hawk series biplane fighter also both in different models?
    We must make war as we must; not as we would like. - Field Marshal Kitchener, 1915

    Xracer
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    (12/12/01 9:39:30 am)
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    I'll give you 1/2 credit for mentioning the Toni. The Kawasaki Ki-61 Hein (Tony) was powered by an inline Kawasaki Ha-40 (license-built DB 601A). Allied bombing destroyed the engine factory, and the Japs were left with a lot of Tony airframes with no engines to put in them. They adapted the airframe to accept the Mitsubishi HA-112 radial engine and it became the Ki-100 (Tony II).

    The "Frank" wasn't the Shinden.....it was the Nakajima Ki-84 Hayate and had a Nakajima Ha-45 radial only.

    The Shinden (lightning) was the Kawanishi N1K (George), powered by a Nakajima NK9H radial.

    There actually was another "Shinden" that only made it into prototype form. The Kyushu J7W Shinden was a canard-configuration rear (radial) engined pusher single seater with a 6 bladed pusher prop. (Imagine, a canard and Burt Rutan didn't design it! )

    There were a whole bunch of biplane Curtiss Hawks, with a whole bunch of engines, both radial and inline.

    There are more.....keep 'em flying!

    Edited by: Xracer at: 12/12/01 7:55:19 pm

    kdub01
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    (12/13/01 2:45:35 pm)
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    You guys have waaaaaaaay to much time on your hands!

    Xracer
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    (12/13/01 6:31:53 pm)
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    Nah.....just too many dusty recesses in our brains for useless trivia.

    Xracer
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    (12/19/01 8:02:56 pm)
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    OK....guess the string has about run out on this, so here are the rest that I have:

    Armstrong-Whitworth Whitley

    Avro York

    Dornier Do-17

    Junkers Ju-88 and Ju-188

    Tupelov Tu-2

    The Macchi M.C. 200 Saetta (Radial) became the M.C. 202 Folgore (Inline)

    And the CHAMPION! The Reggiane Re.2000 Falco I (radial) became the Re.2001 Falco II (inline) and then became the Re.2002 Ariete (back to a radial again) and went onto become the Re.2005 Sagittario (and on to another inline).

    The Italian Air Force may not have been very good in the air, but they sure were proficient in changing engines!

    Edited by: Xracer at: 12/19/01 8:05:27 pm

    jonkx
    Member
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    (2/2/02 1:46:44 pm)
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    The P-40 wasn't an inline engined P-36. The P-37 was an inline engined P-36. While the P-40 did share many design features with its earlier stablemate, it wa a new aircraft, more or less.

    Didn't anyone mention the FW-190?

    Xracer
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    (2/3/02 10:28:39 am)
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    There was no P-37. There was an XP-37 (experimental), and 13 YP-37s (prototype). These were built on stretched P-36 airframes, but no production versions were manufactured. A bit later, Curtiss took the 10th P-36A built, pulled the P&W R-1830-13 radial, and installed an Allison V-1710-19....... and this became the XP-40.

    Yeah.....the 190 was mentioned. The A & B were radial.....the C & D were inline. And, of course, a modified 190 airframe was used in the TA-152, which was also inline.
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