Your precious NRA

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by pickenup, May 31, 2008.

  1. pickenup

    pickenup Active Member

    Joined:
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    First
    Do not confuse the NRA-ILA…..the subject of this post……
    ((National Rifle Association, Institute of Legislative Action))

    With the “Friends of the NRA” which does a TON of good.
    “All net proceeds (from the Friends of the NRA) benefit The NRA Foundation, with half allocated to fund projects within the state where the money was raised. The NRA Foundation uses the other half to fund similar projects with a national scope.”

    The following is posted for informational purposes only.
    So often, you hear someone say, “Do a little research, then make up your own mind”
    Well, I am ALL FOR letting people make up their own mind.
    But to be fair, one does need to see BOTH sides.....right?

    Second,
    I am an NRA member (so far) and a gun owner. I firmly believe in the 2nd Amendment,
    AS IT WAS WRITTEN.

    What part of….
    SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED
    or
    The right to keep and BEAR arms….
    is hard to understand???

    Third,
    THE WHOLE TRUTH,
    If an organization claims to SPEAK FOR ME, then I WANT TO KNOW what they are doing / saying. If they make the claim that they champion MY RIGHTS, then I want them to DO IT, NOT compromise MY RIGHTS away.

    Or are some so “afraid” of the “WHOLE” truth? Only wanting to hear ONE SIDE of the story. Is the NRA supposed to be placed on a pedestal, given FREE REIGN, where NO ONE is supposed to question their actions? Are they NOT to be held accountable for their actions? Why not?

    It is SO much easier to attack any person who has the unmitigated gall to say ANYTHING negative about the NRA. Calling them a backstabber, an anti-gunner, an advocate for the “other side” than it is to admit that your precious organization advocates laws that are UNconstitutional, and NEEDS to have members WORKING TO CHANGE which laws they support. Ya, lets KILL the messenger.

    Fourth,
    Have they done some good? OF COURSE. They have to win “some” if they didn’t, that 3-4 million membership number would fade rather quickly. We have had almost 2 terms of a republican president. How many gun laws has the NRA even TRIED to have repealed? How many states have they fought for a “Vermont/Alaska style” CCW law in? You can not say it is impossible, Alaska just passed such a law, a few years ago.

    The NRA has been hard at work, over the last few years, turning a CONSTITUTIONALLY GUARANTEED RIGHT (to bear arms) into a REVOCABLE PRIVILEGE (CCW) with the government making the decision on who is, and who is not, PERMITTED to bear arms.
    (once the - fee - is paid, of course)
    Many pro-gun people commend the NRA for this.
    Others see it for what it REALLY is.

    The second amendment states. “The right of the people to keep and BEAR arms” It doesn’t say “to keep and display arms” or “to keep and hide arms” or “to keep and lock up your arms” or “to keep and use arms” it says “to keep and BEAR arms” Look it up in the dictionary. To “bear something” means to CARRY it. Any attempt at “interpreting” the meaning of this, is clearly an anti-gun tactic.

    I for one, will NO LONGER put the NRA on a pedestal. I will NOT turn a blind eye to their actions. I WILL be watching. It’s YOUR rights as well, shouldn’t you be watching TOO?

    *****

    Compromise = A settlement of differences in which each side makes concessions.
    What concessions has the other side made? Our side has to agree to incremental infringements of our constitutional rights now, rather than loosing them one all at once??? Where is the “compromise” in this?

    *****

    This next part is for that lame argument heard ALL THE TIME;
    “If you don’t like it, change it, or start your own organization.”

    The “idea” of changing from within, or starting your own group, is nothing new. The following BOARD MEMBERS spent YEARS trying for change from within, and for various reasons, they COULD NOT! They left the NRA to start their own PRO-gun organizations. But then, sadly, they will be labeled as fanatics as well…..by some.

    Now, a few lowly PEON members are expected to be able to walk in off the street, and in no time, effect change? Do we even have the time left, to re-invent the wheel?

    Lets start with H. L. Richardson. He was a board member of the NRA for 10 years. Did he see a problem with their policies? When he found he could NOT change it from within, he left and started the Gun Owners Of America. (GOA) What is now (arguably) the largest REAL PROgun rights activist organization in the country. Which is also known by MOST as the “NO COMPROMISE” gun lobby. What have they done? Looks it up yourself, it might surprise you.

    Then we can turn out attention to Neal Knox, a career gun rights activist. A board member, as well as serving four years for the NRA, as the Executive Director of the Institute For Legislative Action. Which is the lobbying arm of the NRA. He too must have had a problem with the policies of the NRA, found it impossible to change from within, as he went on to found the Firearms Coalition. Another well known “NO COMPROMISE” PRO-GUN organization.

    When Neal Knox was on the board, there was a vote to see if Executive Vice President (LaPierre) should be suspended or removed from office. It was supported by a solid 39-30 majority, but short of the two-thirds which was required for passage. At that time, what the Board majority didn't know, was that the previous week LaPierre and his supporters had secretly ordered the placement of a full page ad in the ballot issue of the NRA magazines-six weeks after the published deadline for election ads. Political subterfuge at it’s best. Give the members ONLY the information you WANT them to have. The ad worked. five of the nine were defeated, tipping the balance of power on the Board back into LaPierre‘s favor.

    Nancyann Rutledge, who was the President of the Santa Barbara NRA Members Council, later to become the Citizens Gun Rights Alliance. What happened to her? After refusing to support the NRA’s gun control positions, and anti-gun candidates, she was decertified by the NRA.

    Dave Edmondson, a 2-term NRA Director. Another in a long line of past Directors, board members, etc. which are vocal critics of the NRA's leadership and direction. Dave went on to be founder of the “State Association Coordinating Committee.”

    Neil Smith, a life member of the NRA, is an outspoken gun rights activist who is NOT happy with the NRA. He is founder of International Coordinator of the Libertarian Second Amendment Caucus.

    A few other facts.

    Lets talk about Clarence Lovell, an ex-member of the NRA Board of Directors for 14 years. He left because, “he could no longer stomach the falsity of those heading the NRA.”

    Albert Ross, former NRA Directors, and second Vice President. Who is now Texas State Rifle Association Director, strongly CONDEMNS the NRA’s very own program, Project Exile. Sighting Project Exile as laws that are unconstitutional violations of the Second Amendment.

    Other Board Directors, board members, life members, endowment members, etc that condemned the NRA for Project Exile. Former Chairman, NRA High-power Committee, David Gross, Larry R. Rankin, Arthur Nichols, H.S. "Gunnie" Reagan, Chris BeHanna, Robert T Fanning, Jr., Don Loucks, Jim Ramm, Anthony Brian, Jack H. Stuart, Arnold Gaunt, Clarence Lovell, Richard L. Carone, and more.

    Some of the comments C. Russell Howard made when he resigned from the NRA board.
    “The unholy alliance of NRA leaders, vendors, and Republican elements is the reason why NRA is declining in stature.

    (Addressing LaPierre)
    Compared to Mr. Knox's influence, you run the Board like a concentration camp commandant

    The struggle for the right of the people to keep and bear arms is at the core of a fundamental struggle for freedom……..In any conflict, if those on the front lines cannot trust and rely on the honor of their comrades, the cause is doomed. While there are many good and honorable people on the Board with various stands on the current power struggle, there are some who cannot be trusted and are without honor.”

    *****

    Lets take just a moment to talk about the financial side of things. NO ONE is arguing that any origination NEEDS funding.

    The NRA saw this, and long ago entrenched themselves into gun ranges. The range needs insurance, the NRA provides it, the range REQUIRES membership in the NRA to be a member of the range. MANY can relate to this. A number of ranges have done some research, in the last few years, and there ARE other insurance programs available. LESS COSTLY than the NRA. Imagine that.

    The next financial topic…certification to be an NRA instructor.
    Why do certified instructors have to be RE-certified EVERY YEAR?
    Did the three rules of gun safety change?
    Exactly what DID change to require a re-certification YEARLY??
    Oh wait, you have to PAY the NRA……again, and again, AND AGAIN.
    And for every discipline. Pistol, rifle, shotgun, etc.
    The more disciplines, the more you pay.

    Now lets look again at the CCW laws, supported by the NRA.
    Oh surprise, many states require a NRA CERTIFIED firearms instructor, to give the REQUIRED classes, to get your government sponsored PERMIT.

    With a yearly salary of $895,897 in 2004 we won’t even mention that LaPierre probably has gone over a one MILLION $$$$ salary today. The president of the United States only gets $400,000.
    (OK, LaPierre’s salary (for today) is speculation, why are there no financial records available since 2004?)
    Has anyone received a renewal form from the NRA 8-10 MONTHS before it is due?
    That just irks me, that’s all.

    Some say, concerning the NRA, it’s ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.

    *****

    Now lets talk about what HARM can they do / have they done?

    Let us first consider the “Uniform Machinegun Act of 1932” which provided for the registration of machine guns, that was adopted in a few states (Conn., Va., Md., Ark., and Montana and possibly others) which was developed with the support of the NRA, BEFORE the feds adopted the “National Firearms Act” in 1934.

    The reason this stands out, is that MANY people believe that the “National Firearms Act of 1934 was the pivotal law, the first of the UNconstitutional laws. Thereby “starting” an ever widening path, allowing for further infringements. Not so, the NRA was first in 1932.

    "The NRA supported The Federal Firearms Act of 1938, which regulates interstate
    and foreign commerce in firearms and pistol, revolver ammunition.

    The NRA supported legislation to amend the “Federal Firearms Act” in regard to handguns when it was introduced in August, 1963.

    In 1965, the NRA continued its support of an expansion of the above legislation to include rifles and shotguns, as well as handguns.
    Additionally the NRA supported the regulation of the movement of handguns in interstate and foreign commerce by:
    1. Requiring a sworn statement, containing certain information, from the purchaser to the seller for the receipt of a handgun in interstate commerce;
    2. Providing for notification of local police of prospective sales;
    3. Requiring an additional 7-day waiting period by the seller after receipt of acknowledgement of notification to local police;
    4. Prescribing a minimum age of 21 for obtaining a license to sell firearms and increasing the license fees;
    5. Providing for written notification by manufacturer or dealer to carrier that a firearm is being shipped in interstate commerce, and;
    6. Increasing penalties for violation.

    NRA HELPED WRITE the 1986 federal law prohibiting the manufacture and importation of "armor piercing ammunition" adopted standards.

    *****

    “Project EXILE” IS the NRA’s very own project.
    NRA'S project (EXILE) supports ALL UNconstitutional gun laws. Handgun Control Inc. supports it TOO. NRA-ILA Executive Director James Jay Baker commented, "I'm glad that the president has finally agreed with the NRA that enforcing federal firearms laws makes sense. We've been pushing for more enforcement of existing laws.
    Did anyone tell them that ALL of the 20,000 gun laws are UNCONSTITUTIONAL???
    OF COURSE Handgun Control Inc. supports this NRA project.


    *****

    Schools
    Then NRA Executive Vice President Wayne R. LaPierre, Jr., made these damaging statements during his nationally televised speech at the Denver NRA Members Meeting May 1, 1999. "First, we believe in absolutely gun-free, zero-tolerance, totally safe schools. That means no guns in America's schools, period ... with the rare exception of law enforcement officers or trained security personnel.”

    All across the country, school boards and state legislators started doing precisely what LaPierre suggested: shutting down school riflery programs, prohibiting historical firearms displays, forbidding hunter safety training with unloaded guns, and banning gun possession by teachers and other adults with carry licenses. A good example of the long range implications of what LaPierre endorsed back then, is the recent tragedy at Virginia Tech.

    Making schools a “gun free zone” where lunatics can murder with impunity, was his response to the Columbine shootings? What happened to advocating responsible carry, by responsible citizens???

    *****

    LaPierre also blessed gun show background checks by saying: "We will consider instant checks at gun shows when, and only when, this Administration stops (charging for NICS checks) and stops illegally compiling the records of millions of lawful gun buyers."

    The next day President Charlton Heston flatly said on ABC "This Week" that he was "in favor of" gun show background checks. Within weeks, bills for gun show background checks - and "youth gun access" bans - had been submitted in both houses of Congress!

    *****

    First amendment rights?
    Was it the National Rifle Association that had ONE OF IT’S OWN MEMBERS, a pro-gun activist, ARRESTED at its national convention on, April 27, 2003 in Orlando, Florida for handing out PRO-gun freedom literature from an organization known as the Free State Project, Inc. The unlucky NRA member was Timothy Condon, a Marine Corps Vietnam veteran and Director of Member Services for the rapidly growing Free State Project.

    *****

    It was NRA PRESIDENT Dr. C.R. (Pink) Gutermuth, who saw "no problem with gun registration," and was head of the Wildlife Management Institute, who became NRA President in 1973.

    Part of the problem began during the unlamented regime of former Executive Vice President Warren Cassidy. NRA lobbyists under Cassidy stopped opposing gun control bills and started offering NRA-approved versions of the same legislation. The NRA started WRITING ANTI-GUN LEGISLATION.

    Politicians were lobbying their colleagues for the so-called "instant check?" These pro-gunners were pushing a gun control bill that the NRA was strongly supporting.

    Jim Baker of the NRA was quoted by USA Today on October 26, 1993 as saying: "We already support 65% of the Brady bill, because it moves to an instant check, which is WHAT WE WANT."

    NRA spokesman Bill McIntrye said that the instant background check also in the bill "will be a victory for gun owners.

    From NRA Board member Tanya Metaksa.
    I think this agreement was a victory for those who see flaws in the current bill. This is a much different Brady bill. This bill sunsets into what we've been supporting for several years [the instant check]. If you look at it in the long range, IT‘S OUR BILL in five years.

    *****

    Recently the NRA tried to derail a case in Washington DC. The “Parker v. District of Columbia” case. First by trying to have the case consolidated with NRA controlled litigation, which would have drug this case out for YEARS. When that failed, the NRA got behind, and was pushing for the “DC Personal Protection Act” bill, which would, in effect, remove the law that the “Parker v. District of Columbia” case was based upon. Thereby preventing the “Parker v. District of Columbia” case from going before the supreme court.

    Why would they try to derail a case that ultimately DID overturned a gun ban, and potentially will settle the long disputed “individual right v. the right of the militia” to keep and bear arms? Because they said it was “too good” and might actually make it before the supreme court? Which it HAS. A supreme court (considering the make up of it at present) where we have the best chance of them handing down a favorable ruling, than we have had in decades. With the very real potential, of the democrats gaining control in the next election (thereby giving them the opportunity to choose the next judges) if not now, WHEN?

    And when was the NRA fighting for our rights in this way? Oh ya…..2007.

    *****

    Lets look at ANOTHER bill backed by the NRA. H.R. 2640, the "NICS Improvement Amendments Act” Later to be designated “The Veterans Disarmament Act” To see the first red flags thrown up, one need only look at who is sponsoring/co-sponsoring this bill. Carolyn McCarthy, Chuck Schumer, Barbara Boxer, and the Brady bunch.

    There were MANY veterans organizations, along with NRA members that were against this bill. When they questioned the NRA as to why they were supporting it, the answer was………..well, they didn’t get an answer. Silence was all they received.

    Nevermind the far reaching implications (which may take YEARS, for them all to surface) the potential of opening a Pandora’s box, concerning the mental health issue regarding veterans, as well as anyone else that has “potentially” ANY kind of mental issue. (children diagnosed with ADD? etc).

    Right or Wrong, the UNconstitutional NICS check should not be EXPANDED upon, in the first place.

    Oh, and this again IS happening in …..2007.

    *****

    Lets not forget the NRA BOARD MEMBER (Joaquin Jackson) who “indicated” that “assault rifles” should only be in the hands of the military and/or law enforcement. But since they ARE legal for civilians to own, then civilians should be limited to 5 round magazines.

    (quote)I think these assault weapons basically need to be in the hands of the military and they need to be in the hands of the police, but uh, as far as assault weapons to a civilian, if you… if you… it's alright if you got that magazine capacity down to five…(/quote)


    *****

    While reading the following, keep in mind that former NRA board member Russ Howard, RESIGNED from the board. His words, “In the past 5 years I've become increasingly concerned over NRA's penchant for giving UNDESERVED grades to politicians who TRAMPLE on the 2nd Amendment.”


    In California JOAN MILKE FLORES VS JANE HARMAN. 36TH CONGRESSIONAL
    Flores is an anti-gun Republican who voted FOR the Los Angeles Assault Rifle Ban. Harman is an anti- gun Democrat who got an “A” rating from the NRA. Why an “A” rating? She was ANTI-GUN!!! Who later said that she supports the assault weapon ban.

    CHRISTINE REED VS TERRY FREIDMAN (State Assembly)
    Reed was an anti-gun C-rated Republican Handgun Control Inc. member who had been mayor of Santa Monica. Reed who should have been an “F”. Freidman was an F-rated incumbent Democrat who authored many anti-gun bills

    TRICIA HUNTER: Hunter was state senator whose bid to retain office was based on high-profile attacks on "killer assault rifles". She was rated "A-" by the NRA.

    Howard Dean got an A+ from the NRA while governor, he supported the assault weapons ban and Brady bill.

    Senator Arlen Specter (R-PA). Did not vote when needed, but was helped by the NRA come re-election.

    Rep. Elton Gallegly (R-CA) voted FOR the brady bill (3 times) then was helped by the NRA come re-election.

    Congressman Elton Gallegly -- voted FOR the Brady bill and the assault weapon ban and got an A-, and an endorsement. NRA’s Terry O'Grady said, 'Gallegly voted against us on Brady and the Crime Bill, but he's always been with us before. We've decided to forgive him, give him an A- and endorse him. SAY WHAT?

    In Virginia, 15 legislators were given A ratings after they voted FOR both the one-gun-a-month ban AND the shotgun ban. 41 legislators who voted for either or both bans got A ratings. 7 got exceptional, "above the call of duty" ratings.

    In North Carolina, some districts have two senators. In the '94 elections, District 20 was represented by Ted Kaplan and Marvin Ward. Both favored assault weapon bans, handgun registration, and a one-gun-a-month ban. Their challengers were solid pro-gunners Ham Horton and Mark McDaniels (who fought tooth and nail for CCW). Nevertheless, ILA upgraded both anti-gun incumbents to "A" (one was initially a C), endorsed them, and supported them by mailing orange alert cards to NRA members in their district. Kaplan and Ward lost anyway, as incensed local groups like Grass Roots NC broke ranks with ILA and helped elect the pro-gun challengers.

    In NC in 1995, Senator Fountain Odom betrayed the 2nd Amendment by gutting the CCW bill in his subcommittee. The bill had come over in more or less tolerable format from the house. Odom fixed it so that only a few police instructors could give the mandatory training. NRA instructors were prohibited. He also worked to move un-permitted CCW from a misdemeanor to a felony, prohibit CCW with any alcohol "remaining" in the body, prohibit CCW in financial institutions, mandate that all training be fully repeated for each renewal, and gut statewide preemption. Limited preemption was restored in the full judiciary committee, but Odom betrayed us again, fixing it so CCW could be prohibited in any "park". Later on the floor, to give ILA cover, Odom amended the training section to allow NRA instructors to do the training. In 1996, Tanya Metaksa gave Odom an A, an endorsement, and an orange ALERT postcard mailing telling NRA members, "Senator Odom has demonstrated his commitment to our right to self-defense...Here's how you can help re-elect Fountain Odom -- a dedicated supporter of your Second Amendment rights. Help the campaign...make a contribution...spread the word to family, friends, and fellow gun owners... Sincerely, Tanya K. Metaksa." Odom's still trampling on our rights. Now he's pushing for a CCW liability law.


    In Virginia in 1996, extreme “F” rated gun grabber Congressman Jim Moran faced “A” rated, NRA life member John Otey. The American Rifleman carried the following message: "THIS IS YOUR OFFICIAL PRO-GUN BALLOT FOR THE FOLLOWING DISTRICT: VIRGINIA 8, US CONGRESS…..NO ENDORSEMENT"
    NO endorsement for an A rated NRA life member challenging an F- rated gun grabber???

    In Virginia, 3 congressmen who voted many times against gun rights and supported the Lautenberg ban, kept their A+ ratings (part of a large club of turncoat A and A+ politicians). Tom Davis got an A after voicing support for Brady and the assault weapon ban and orchestrating a unanimous vote of support for the one-gun-a-month ban as a Fairfax County Supervisor. ·

    In Pennsylvania (1993), then Republican Minority Whip Matt Ryan INTRODUCED an assault rifle ban. In 1994, he kept his A+ rating.

    In 2006, the NRA rated Ron Paul (arguably the MOST constitutional representative we have in office) with a “B” because he did not follow along in lock step, when the NRA endorsed (what Ron Paul saw) as an UNconstitutional bill. One that the NRA supported. Instead, they endorsed his UNproved, UNtested, DEMOCRATIC opponent.

    *******

    John Dingell?
    The NRA’s Golden Boy? The former NRA Director? The same guy who voted in favor of the 1994 “Assault” weapons ban and then resigned from the Board of Directors the day after the vote? The same Dingell who received the NRA’s Harlon B. Carter Award, despite voting FOR an outright gun BAN? The same Dingell that coined the term "jack-booted thugs" when referring to the BATF? THAT Dingell?

    NRA Board of Directors member Larry Craig, was one of the co-sponsors of this bill, “Our Lady of Peace Act” Which was introduced by Caroline McCarthy, and supported by Chuck Schumer along with the usual band of anti Second Amendment slime like, Ted Kennedy, Blanche Lincoln and Richard Durbin.
    Don’t know what it is/was? Look it up.

    Can’t forget the “help” we got from the NRA. In the “Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act.” Not debating, if setting this kind of precedent with legislation, protecting industries, is right. Not debating whether the industry needed this protection. The point here is, that there was a CLEAN bill (800) on the floor, AT THE SAME TIME. Everyone agrees that either bill (397 or 800) would pass through the senate, with no problem. So it depended on the house. There are always more votes than there are co-sponsors of a bill. S. Bill 800 had over 250 signed on as co-sponsors. MORE than enough to pass it, CLEAN. Why did the NRA CHOOSE to back the anti-gun laden bill, when there was a CLEAN alternative? For a true PRO-gun advocate, this was a no brainer.



    The NRA awarded Assemblyman Rod Wright its “Defender of Freedom” Award. This is the same Rod Wright who supported UNconstitutional limits on firearms purchases and background checks. This is the same Rod Wright who authored a bill to increase licensing fees from $3 to up to $100. Never mind the absurdity of bilking peaceable citizens of hundreds of dollars for making a constitutionally protected purchase. This champion of “freedom” apparently thinks it’s perfectly acceptable to license and charge Americans for exercising their rights. The NRA’s “Defender of Freedom” in 2001 voted against gun owners 62 percent of the time

    Deborah Danuski, a Democrat from Lisbon, was endorsed by the anti-handgun group, while also receiving an "A-" from the NRA on its report card of candidates. As a matter of fact, in Maine, both the NRA and Maine Citizens Against Handgun Violence supported 18 of the same candidates!

    In Colorado, where the NRA supported Senator Wayne Allard for office, and even boosted his pro-gun lobby contributions to $37,000 since 1990, Allard stated flatly that he would support federal legislation requiring gun registration for private gun sales at gun shows. Is a legislator who wants to expand gun registration someone who stands up for the rights of gun owners?

    From Virginia, where the NRA Political Victory Fund touted the pro-gun “accomplishments” of Delegate Jack Rollison. This is the same Rollison who in a press release had the unmitigated gall to paint Gun Owners of America and the Virginia Citizens Defense League, who have endorsed his opponent Jeff Frederick, as extremists and “milita-esque” organizations. This is the same Jack Rollison who wants to ban your right to self-defense in any restaurant that happens to sell liquor. And this is the same Jack Rollison who voted correctly on only two out of eight issues important to Virginia gun owners.

    The NRA also gave their "Defender of Freedom Award" to one Kevin Mannix, who ran for governor here in 2002. In 1999 Mannix was the architect of the worst piece of gun control legislation in 10 years, in the Oregon House.

    *****

    Admittedly, some of this information is “historical” in nature. The present administration had nothing to do with it. On the same note, some of this information is CURRENT. (as in 2007) Does this information show a distinct pattern? An agenda? If so, it’s one that I’m not happy with at all.


    Is this the kind of “representation” that YOU want/expect? There are more anti 2nd amendment bills that the NRA HELPED WRITE, or WROTE themselves. Other ANTI_GUN candidates that they endorsed. But why, if this doesn’t open your eyes, nothing will.

    Why is it, that some NRA supporters will not accept the truth (even when presented with facts) about how the NRA has been selling our gun rights down the river for a VERY long time. This post is not for the ardent followers of the NRA. The ones that will NEVER change. It is for those looking for an education.

    I believe that everyone would agree, that the NRA is recognized as the 800 lb. Gorilla, in the fight for our gun rights. This is the very same organization that the NRA supporters have been paying money to for YEARS. Paying big bucks to be a “Life Member” Signing up their children/grand-children, almost as soon as they are born. Everyone KNOWS who the NRA is.

    They are relying on the NRA to be supportive in the fight for our gun rights. They consider the NRA to be the last bastion of hope. If they find that the NRA is NOT actually on our side, then is there really…any hope? No wonder some refuse to see.
  2. Mjolnir

    Mjolnir New Member

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    Great post, very informative. I will deffinately look into becoming a member of other orgainzations.
  3. berto64

    berto64 Active Member

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    I went with GOA. Always been leery of LaPierre.
  4. Haligan

    Haligan Active Member

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    Pickenup

    Your point is well taken, alittle long, but well taken.

    Here's the thing, this is a very tough topic for me to wrap my head around. I see the points you make and cannot disagree, however we must make the NRA our main voice. If we need to write letters, elect our board members more carefully, then so be it. I don't like compromise, or the idea of compromise on our RIGHTS, but the NRA IS the pro gun voice in this country. It started just after our civil war and has been their tring to get the political victorys ever since. Sometimes we've won, sometimes we've lost, and sometimes we've gotten a tie. My only advise is that we must Hold Ranks, Stand Together, make our pro gun voices as strong as we can. Wrong or right we must stick together.

    P.S. Proud member of NRA, GOA, CRKBA, ANJRPC(association of New Jersey rifle and pistol clubs), CJRPC(Central Jersey rifle and pistol club)

    A HOUSE DIVIDED AGAINST ITSELF CANNOT STAND.
  5. briank

    briank New Member

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    LaPierre's compensation (both up-front and deferred, which most NRA supporters seem to deny is "compensation") can be found on their IRS Form 990's. You can look at the NRA 990's here:

    http://foundationcenter.org/findfunders/990finder/

    (Use the NRA EIN of 530116130)
  6. guntech59

    guntech59 New Member

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    Pickenup (the same on GB, I presume), I agree wholeheartedly. That is why I let my NRA membership lapse in '94 and am now a GOA member. The NRA has incrementally given our gun rights away. Compromise is a dirty word.
  7. RunningOnMT

    RunningOnMT New Member

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    Dittos
  8. ampaterry

    ampaterry *TFF Admin Staff Chaplain* Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Over two million bucks every three years.
    Nice gig.

    Makes me glad I lat my membership lapse back in the New Mexico mess -
  9. GMFWoodchuck

    GMFWoodchuck New Member

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    That's why I quit the NRA 10+ years ago. Good post. I wish I had the patience to write something this long. Unfortunately I like to read more than I like to write.
  10. Tom Militano

    Tom Militano New Member

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    I've been a NRA Life Member about forty years, back when it was $75.00. I've shot for a lot of military rifle and pistol teams and you had to be a member of the NRA to shoot. Uncle Sam didn't pick up the tab for membership either. As I said, I've been a member for about forty years and I still get calls and mail wanting me to join or renew my membership. My big problem with the NRA is ted nugent. Google him and see what the loudmouth phony did when he was drafted during Vietnam. He crapped and pi**ed in his clothes in his clothes for a week and showed up at the draft board like that. They didn't except him of course. He's a damn coward and oxygen thief.
  11. Bobitis

    Bobitis Guest

    Ted has an ego the size of another individual I can think of.
    They both serve the same purpose.

    Stroke it.:rolleyes:
  12. RunningOnMT

    RunningOnMT New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2008
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    4,720
    Location:
    Akron, Ohio
    Which leaves us with the same question. Is it counterproductive to the gun rights movement to continue to support the NRA while being a member of other groups like the GOA?

    I belong to both but in light of all the information contained in your post it would seem like our dues would be put to better use solely with the GOA. Some people seem tobelieve that compromise is the hallmark of reasonableness. I see no room for compromise on issues of God given rights.

    It would seem that by continuing to support the NRA it helps maintain their credibility and influence with the public and with legislators, giving them the ability to negotiate our rights away.
  13. Rocket J Squirl

    Rocket J Squirl New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2009
    Messages:
    418
    Not my NRA, I bailed on them years ago.

    As far as rights. I know ,mine, and no legal skullduggery is EVER going to change what I know.

    They can manbe panbe around laws all they want to.

    Those who come to take mine, best have thier wills made
  14. Insulation Tim

    Insulation Tim Active Member

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    Ohio
    My feelings about most organizations (charities fall under this) are that they begin in their infancy as small, uncomplicated, manned by earnest volunteers for a common goal. Then they morph over any number of years into
    Cash Eating Bureaucracies whose main mission is collecting money.

    How large is the Red Cross, American Cancer Foundation, Susan G. Komen,ad nauseum? Bloated budgets and salaries and a disproportionate of the monies raised used to feed the organization and solicit more money. I am a NRA member and enjoy their American Rifleman Magazine and TV show. Other than that, I don't expect much from them and their cadre of "slick" guys.

    Frankly, from everything that I've studied about charities.......my funds go strictly to the Salvation Army. I haven't contributed a penny to the extortionist United Way in 30 years.
  15. Nighthawk

    Nighthawk New Member

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    South Central Texas
    There is no such thing as compromise when you loss ground and your enemy gains ground. I am a lifer and
    have not receive any request for donations since I became a life member. When I was year to year I
    received request every month.
  16. Marlin

    Marlin *TFF Admin Staff Chief Counselor*

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    At SouthernMoss' side forever!
    I remain in the NRA only due to being, like Tom, a life member, in my case, for about fifty years. Since it doesn't cost me anything I can remain "inside" keeping an eye on the fox in the hen-house.

    All of my efforts so far in the twenty-first century have been through GOA, JPFO, CCRKBA and the 2nd Amendment Foundation. They are each NO COMPROMISE outfits.
  17. the morning light

    the morning light New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2009
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    288
    The NRA usually compromises on congressional bills and takes our gun rights away 1 slice at a time. I like Larry Pratt and GOA, no compromise!
  18. bcj1755

    bcj1755 New Member

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    A wretched hive of scum and villiany
    That's why I joined GOA. The NRA has done a lot of good in the past, and they continue to do some good and yes they have the clout and notoriety. But it looks to me like they got them by being willing to lay down with the DC scumbags and by showing themselves willing to compromise in favor of acceptence. Well, everytime they compromise, they compromise away MY RIGHTS! We have given up MORE THAN ENOUGH!! Why do these bozos, including the ones in the NRA that are so eager to compromise with the liberals, have such a hard damn time understanding the meaning of SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED?! Seems pretty simple to me.
  19. bcj1755

    bcj1755 New Member

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    A wretched hive of scum and villiany
    After I typed my previous post, I thought of something else.

    Why is it that we, as conservatives and/or gun owners, are expected to compromise away our rights while the liberals aren't? Why are we forced to slowly compromise away our 2nd Amendment rights but the liberals don't have to slowly compromise away ANY of their rights? I don't see the left compromising away their right to free speech or right to vote or any other rights, but we're expected to joyfully allow the feds to take more and more of our GOD GIVEN right to self-defense just because the NRA was allowed to help the antis write some steaming corn-filled pile of unconstitutional anti-gun legislation BS:mad:

    How about NO COMPROMISES!!!!!! SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!! Seems clear and simple to anyone that thinks about it logically.
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2009
  20. Double D

    Double D Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
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    North Florida
    NRA life member and will stay that way.....................
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