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Pietta 1851 Navy Confederate .44

19K views 40 replies 13 participants last post by  soundguy 
#1 ·
Well I think I got that all right. I've shot just a few, and that was a looooooong time ago and never owned one myself until today. One of my daughters was hitting garage sales when she sends me a picture of this pistol asking if it would be something I'd be interested in buying.

Firearm Gun Trigger Revolver Gun accessory


Like most I'm sure I've had that persistent itch to have a BP revolver but never got around to scratching it until today. They were right around the corner from my house so I stopped by to have a look see. Despite a few "idiot marks" which I probably would have done myself while learning so I figure he just saved me the trouble, despite these few blemished the gun is in great shape and I don't think it has been fired very much. Rustfree as far as I can tell anyway. I checked and Cabella's is selling them new for $199 so at $125 I'm pretty happy with the purchase. Now that I know pretty much ZERO about BP shooting looks like I have a ton to learn. So far on my shopping list I have:
.454 Lead Balls
3-5oz Flask with a 17 grain measurer on the end
FFFG
#11 Percussion Caps
Greased Wadds
Rod with .45 jag
Nipple Wrench
Moose Milk or TC #13 Cleaner
And Beeswax to be mixed with Crisco for topping off the cylinders

I found the manual online so I'll be reading through that and if you have anything you'd care to share please speak up as it where.

One question I have is regarding the charge amount of FFFG. The manual is generic for a number of their revolvers and on one chart it lists the Min/Max charge to be something like 12-15 grains and then on another chart it shows a Maximum charge around 30 grains. Say what??? Being a brass frame I believe I should keep the charge on the lower end. I'll have a zillion questions I'm sure but thought I'd letcha all know I'm a member of the club.

Here are a couple more pictures

Gun Firearm Trigger Revolver Gun accessory
Gun Firearm Trigger Revolver Starting pistol
 
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#3 ·
Nice score!

Yep, being a brass frame, stick to the lower charge published by the maker. The cylinders are big enough to hold a 30 grain charge and the steel cylinder and barrel are strong enough to handle the pressure but the brass frame isn't going to take kindly to those heavy loads.

Most cap n ball revolvers use the number 10 sized cap, most reproduction rifles use the number 11.

11s will work, I've used them, but you need to squeeze the skirt a little or they will fall off.

Get some lubed revolver wads and use them if you want to avoid the mess that greasing the mouth of the cylinder makes.

And as you probably already know, if those low grain loads are not filling the cylinder enough for the ball to contact the charge, you'll need to use a filler.

BTW, the Confederacy never made or used a .44 brass framed '51 based revolver, but you really don't need historical correctness to have fun shooting them. ;)

I've got a brass framed '58 Remington with a 12 inch "Buntline Special" barrel that never actually existed back then either and it's both fun to shoot and pretty darned accurate.
 
#15 ·
Most cap n ball revolvers use the number 10 sized cap, most reproduction rifles use the number 11.

11s will work, I've used them, but you need to squeeze the skirt a little or they will fall off.

Get some lubed revolver wads and use them if you want to avoid the mess that greasing the mouth of the cylinder makes.

And as you probably already know, if those low grain loads are not filling the cylinder enough for the ball to contact the charge, you'll need to use a filler.
I am having problems with quoting for some reason so I hope this works.

Bought some CCI #10's and also found these in my dad's old BP stuff. Stopped by his house and he fixed me up with all his old BP goodies.
Metal

Not sure what size they are but after testing them both I'm guessing they're #11's??
The #10's were very snug, in fact I messed the cap up a bit trying to get it off the nipple while the mystery cap was lose fitting. I was able to get lots of cool stuff from my father, most of which is well over 30 years old so I won't look like a newbie dork when I show up with all my shiny new equipment. Amongst the kit is a powder horn, copper flask, pound of Pyrodex P which I'm guessing should probably be replaced although it did POOF just fine when I touched off a small pile I made in the backyard :rolleyes:. He had a Ruger .44 and still has a Hawken .50 he built from a kit that is just beautiful. He's a perfectionist so believe me when I say it's just awesome. He even said I was welcome to the .50 anytime. I mention this only to say that in the shooting box were a number of various projectiles with a mix of .50 and .44 balls. This brings up a question. In the Pietta manual which I read it suggests using a .454 ball, I purchased a box this afternoon. Also, in separating out the lead balls from I got from my dad I discovered they range from .43-.46. I know that I want to have a small ring of lead shaved after seating the ball. How much over the .454 do you think I can safely go before having a problem?

What else? I learned that ALL of the local gun shops are woefully ill equipped when it comes to BP supplies. I looked everywhere and none of them had Wonder Wads so it looks like the internet is going to be my friend. As Grizz pointed out I may need to add a filler if the ball doesn't seat snug against the powder. I'm hoping that with the use of the wads it will eliminate the need for the filler....does that make sense to ya'll? That also makes me wonder how close to the end of the cylinder should do the ball rest? I'm guessing for my just getting started purposes it robably isn't such an exact science.

I have my kit pretty well complete less the Wonder Wads but I'll get those on order and in the meantime, should I get the itch I did grab a yellow tube of grease, the name escapes me, that I smear over the cylinder opening to prevent a dreaded chain fire. Only part of this equation that has me a bit concerned is giving my pistol a soak in the tub. I'm more than a little uptight that I'll somehow not get it completely dry and create a rusty mess. I do have an air compressor which I'm planning on using which I don't see as causing any problems.

Not sure why but I'm really getting kind of excited. :D
 
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#4 ·
I forgot to add, if you can't find genuine 3f black locally, Pyrodex P and 777 have worked well in my revolvers for me.

With all the government regulations regarding the storage of black, it's an explosive not a propellant, not many stores carry it these days.
 
#7 ·
Thanks for the info Grizz. Only reason I said #11 caps is that's what I read in an article. See, already getting bad information. Grrr:mad:

I can see I'm gonna need to take this slow and steady for sure. Lots and lots to learn.
 
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#8 ·
Yep, a nice find! As others have said, stay toward the light end loads for the brass-framed revolvers. Max loads are seldom the most accurate anyway.
I've always used beeswax to seal the chambers, I've never tried the lubed wads. Crisco will melt and run out on a hot day, (what a mess!) and why mess with trying to mix Crisco and beeswax? Just use beeswax. (I once won a revolver match at a winter shoot with my new Walker, and didn't realize until on the way home that one of the holes in the target was made by a wax plug, not a lead ball) I use cornmeal (with or without bugs) as filler, and with any inert filler, you may not need to seal the chambers at all. I still do, better safe, and all that. The ball will seat on the powder with a light load and no filler, but you want the ball as close as possible to the end of the chamber, and of course, tight against the powder charge/filler.
I've never found a reason to remove the nipples from any of my revolvers, so you can probably forget the nipple wrench. They are very tight in the cylinder, anyway.
Moose Milk and other black powder solvents are great for cleaning between events at the range, but at home nothing beats hot water and Dawn dish detergent.
Of nine BP handguns that I own, only one is a brass frame, an 1851 Navy that was my first. I still enjoy shooting it. BW
 
#16 ·
#10s are supposed to be tight on a revolver, you wouldn't want them coming off under recoil if you were charging them Damned Yankees on your faithful steed.

Lots of guys use the #11 and pinch the skirt a little to make 'em stay but then shooting from a bench at a gun range is a little less life threatening to you if a cap comes off and jams up the action. ;)

I wouldn't worry about trying to get the ball all the way out to the end of the cylinder for max accuracy, just settle for having fun safely for now.

And as long as you don't break the loading lever, slightly larger than .454 won't hurt your pistol. Whatever size it started your cylinder will size it to your pistol just like a sizing die on a loading bench for your cartridge guns.

In fact, a cap and ball revolver is a loading press and firearm all in one unit, all that's missing is the brass shell. And the convenience of just shoving six more taylor mades into the cylinder.
 
#17 ·
All Colt revolvers from that era and through the 1873 tear down quite easily, except for the Root Side Hammer of which I'm quite ignorant. Peel it down to its parts, wash it off good with hot water and if in doubt set your oven at 200 degrees, put the parts, except for the brass frame, on a cookie sheet and leave in the oven with the door cracked for 5-10 minutes. There will not be any moisture left. I no longer do that, too much trouble, but it works. Compressed air and a few shots of WD-40 or something similar should do just fine.

I'd hate to have to choose which is more unadulterated fun, a good muzzleloading double gun or a C&B revolver. Having just sold my 20 bore flint fowler I'm sort of in the market for a nice, original persuckshun double gun of 16 or 10 bore....and given what I see I might have to settle for a 12 bore.
 
#19 ·
The RWS 1075 are #11 caps. I have a couple of revolvers that do take #11 but most of them take #10. I rarely take a revolver all the way down to clean. I just remove the cylinder and grips and dunk all the metal in a sink full of hot soapy water. I don't use patches either, I use bore mops. I do use WD-40 to displace any excess water and follow up with Remoil in the action. Petroleum based lubes are fine where it doesn't interact with powder fouling but you want to keep it out of the bore and chambers. I don't like using lube over the balls because it's too messy and most people think they have to fill the void with it which just creates more mess. A little around the edge of the ball is all you need. You can use lubed wads or make lube cookies out of beeswax and olive oil (or several other formulas all of which work) to put under the ball. Balls don't need to be at the mouth of the chamber. Unless you bench rest every shot you wont see any difference and probably wont see much if any if you do.
 
#21 ·
And as you probably already know, if those low grain loads are not filling the cylinder enough for the ball to contact the charge, you'll need to use a filler.
Not sure if I'm doing this totally right but I think I'm going to be in good shape. I measured the cylinder bore which comes out to be 1.158" deep and the plunger protrudes .450" in to the cylinder. Add .454" for the ball and I'm left with .254" minimum to be taken up with powder and a wonder wad. Just eyeballing it, I'm pretty darn sure 12-15 grains of powder by itself is going to take up way more than 1/4 inch and by the time I add the wool wad I should be golden.

I also stopped by a local range, of which there are few, and learned they do allow Black Powder shooting and even have a 50 yard range. Sounds like a great day in the making. Only problem is it's $25 a head for the whole day. Not really all that bad but when you're used to $0.00 it sounds like a lot. I did notice that I can become a member and if this becomes more of a regular thing I'll be sure to look in to getting a membership. I assume there would be a savings if I used it enough.
 
#22 ·
Well Poop! Sorry if I'm being an old woman about this. I understand that there is a difference between rifle and pistol dimensions. Not sure which but I remember Alpo saying something recently about this. That said, would one of you kind gentlemen let me know which if any of these wads would be correct for my pistol? Your help is appreciated.

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#31 ·
O.K Buddy I bought it at cabelas got home to find the barrel was very thin in places. Cabelas has a no refund policy even on black powder fire arms. I contacted Pietta who referred me to EMF in California I sent it to them weeks later it returns with tool marks on the new? barrel and a rust ring half way down the barrel. I recontacted EMF and Pietta with no reply and have yet to be able to fire this gun. Is this a satisfactory decripition for you?
 
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