Can I use Pistol primers for rifles??
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As far as diameter goes, yes they are the same between srp/spp and lpp/lrp. There is a height difference between lrp and lpp, this would make for a VERY VERY bad situation if you ever tried to shoot a lrp in a lpp or somehow loaded these up and put them into a lever action rifle, ie 44mag.
The latest issue that came out last month of Shooting Times had a great article on primers that you should locate and read, it explains everything you need to understand about primers.
My .02 on primers is to ALWAYS use the primer for it's intended purpose, never swap rifle and pistol primers. The only time I change from the primer directed is when using mag primers in loads that I know NEED it and have the workups to prove it.
The latest issue that came out last month of Shooting Times had a great article on primers that you should locate and read, it explains everything you need to understand about primers.
My .02 on primers is to ALWAYS use the primer for it's intended purpose, never swap rifle and pistol primers. The only time I change from the primer directed is when using mag primers in loads that I know NEED it and have the workups to prove it.
OK, I would like to use a large pistol primer in a 243 remington 770 and/or 243 savage, both are bolt action. The reason for this is I have lots of pistol primers and only small rifle primers. And we all know about the primer shortage. I have plenty of ammo to burn but, I might get in a tight place in the near future.. I really do appreciate your information.
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
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Pistol primers have a thinner cup than rifle primers. Using rifle primers in a pistol might mean misfires, as the pistol hammer spring is not strong enough to set it off. Using pistol primers in a rifle might mean pierced primers, as the hammer spring/firing pin spring is too strong. Also, pistol primers don't have as much fire as rifle primers, so in a rifle cartridge they might not ignite the powder the same, giving strange burns.
Rifles that are designed to fire pistol ammo (357 and 44 magnum lever carbines, submachine guns and 45 acp and 9mm carbines) should be loaded with pistol primers, but rifles designed for rifle cartridges should use rifle primers.
Will it physically work? Probably. Should you do it? I wouldn't.
Rifles that are designed to fire pistol ammo (357 and 44 magnum lever carbines, submachine guns and 45 acp and 9mm carbines) should be loaded with pistol primers, but rifles designed for rifle cartridges should use rifle primers.
Will it physically work? Probably. Should you do it? I wouldn't.
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One other thought. LP are shorter than LR. If you set it to the same depth-below-rim as LR, the firing pin blow will finish seating the primer, and you will probably get a misfire. I you seat it fully in the primer pocket, it might be so low that the firing pin doesn't hit it, and you get a misfire.
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Should never substitute pistol primers for rifle primers and vice versa. Nothing good can come from it. You could hurt yourself and others, maybe even fatally. Its just not safe to do so. Just keep looking, every day and you will find primers in stock eventually. Thats what I have been doing. I just book marked all the websites I know that sell primers and I check them every day to see if they have any in stock. Midway and Natchez allow you to be put on an notify list of when they receive any primers in stock. I figure its better to be patient than possibly hurt or dead from an accident caused from mixing componets.
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+1 Thanks for getting this info out there Alpo, I was coming back to add this after mulling the question around over dinner.
THERE IS NO SAFE SUBSTITUE BETWEEN RIFLE AND PISTOL PRIMERS, EVER !
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Bad idea, dangerous. As mentioned above pistol primers are made of thinner brass and intended for lower pressure.
ALPO You're scaring me. For years I have been using large pistol primers in 375 Win. and 7x57 mauser, sometimes altering the primer pocket of some old 7x57. As a rule I always load 2 or 3 grains below the manuals suggested starting loads. I have never noticed any signs of excessive pressure, extraction difficulty or pierced primers. The 375 Win is the BB lever action, the mauser is the 98K and sometimes the bolt needs some pressure down to the right position a problem I think that the large pistol primers are a bit too long. My main concern is safety because if it is so dasngerous to use pistol primers in rifles I have to bury my guns due to the impossibility to find reloading components in the place where I live.
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Just to clarify - i think we've all pretty much agreed that it is not the safest thing to do , but the
HUGE NO-NO is to use LR in place of LP; in your case, you're using LP in place of LR, which may result in the primer not being seated all the way down, but still below surface; you won't run into the problem of a primer sitting too high.
I would HIGHLY recommend paying heed to that advice, NEVER EVER sub LR into a LP cartridge.
But, as far as being scared goes....... one can only get away with playing out of bounds for so long, sometimes its longer than others, but an oops is bound to happen at some point.
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Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but if you want to hear what an expert says, I'd say, take the time to get the proper components. It's not that difficult...
http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunit...909/index.html
just in case you don't read fine print..... He's also the author of a few well known reloading manuals; so if you trust what he puts in the manuals, you may want to heed his advice.
I think it's irresponsible to spout off about KNOWN UNSAFE PRACTICES, it sets a very poor example for new reloaders. Yes, Fergie, this may work for you, I'm happy for you, just stay at least 100' away from where I'm shooting.
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Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but if you want to hear what an expert says, I'd say, take the time to get the proper components. It's not that difficult...
http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunit...909/index.html
just in case you don't read fine print..... He's also the author of a few well known reloading manuals; so if you trust what he puts in the manuals, you may want to heed his advice.
I think it's irresponsible to spout off about KNOWN UNSAFE PRACTICES, it sets a very poor example for new reloaders. Yes, Fergie, this may work for you, I'm happy for you, just stay at least 100' away from where I'm shooting.
+1, I have done it but do not recommend it. Had a near mis with some .30 carbine loads in my M1 carbine that were loaded with spm primers. I thought I could get away with it but quickly decided against it when the rifle went rampant on me slamfired a couple rounds and jammed. Thank god it jammed... Bout scared the crap plum outta me!
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The original .357 load used a large pistol primer, then changed to small in the mid to late 1950's if my memory is not gone.
Prior to so called magnum small pistol primers some handloaders substituted small rifle primers to try to get a better powder burn and more velocity using Hercules 2400. I can not remember if if anyone like Elmer Keith or Phil Sharp ever recommended doing this or not.
While I would not expect any significant problems (other than misfires) I do not recommend straying from the actual loads published in a respected manual. Such is especially true when loading max loads. It has been reported that changing just the primer brand can change breech pressure by 4000 psi in some cases.
Better safe; than sorry.
Prior to so called magnum small pistol primers some handloaders substituted small rifle primers to try to get a better powder burn and more velocity using Hercules 2400. I can not remember if if anyone like Elmer Keith or Phil Sharp ever recommended doing this or not.
While I would not expect any significant problems (other than misfires) I do not recommend straying from the actual loads published in a respected manual. Such is especially true when loading max loads. It has been reported that changing just the primer brand can change breech pressure by 4000 psi in some cases.
Better safe; than sorry.
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There are plenty of cross primer loads that will make an effective BOOM.... it's just russian roulette without load data and workups within a Proper environment.
Funny, this is the info DIRECTLY from Remington.......
Question Can primers be used interchangeably?
Answer Generally, no. The 97* and 209P (Premier) are interchangeable in Alliant powder shotshell data. The 57* and the 209 (non-Premier) were both different from the 209P (Premier). The 57* was smaller in diameter, and the 209 (non-Premier) was slightly hotter. The new 209 STS primer is interchangeable with the 209P (Premier) primer in most recipes. It is always best to check with the powder manufacturer when you have a question about a specific recipe. The 209-4 is a primer specifically made for use in .410 shotshell loads although there are no current recipes listed by the powder manufacturers using it. The 209-4 should not be used in gauges other than the .410 due to its lower energy level.
In pistol cartridges, the 1-1/2 small pistol primer should not be used in the 357 Magnum, 357 SIG or the 40 S&W. The 5-1/2 small pistol primer is the proper selection for these rounds.
In rifle cartridges, the 6-1/2 small rifle primer should not be used in the 17 Remington, 222 Remington or the 223 Remington. The 7-1/2 BR is the proper small rifle primer for these rounds.
Warning: When primers are selected incorrectly, misfires, damage to your firearm, and/or personal injury may occur. Visit the ballistics tables on our website. Recommended primers for each rifle and pistol cartridge are listed in these tables.
http://remington.custhelp.com/cgi-b...nBfc2VhcmNoX3RleHQ9cHJpbWVy&p_li=&p_topview=1
Kinda blows that "written in stone" article away........
Don't believe everything you read in "some magazine".It appears that you've not read the article by Mr Jones or really done any bit of research on primers, seems like it's just not a really big deal, just a primer.
Read and believe whatever you'd like to, there's just no sensible reason or excuse to swap primers for the 357, SMPP's are available, DESIGNED and have VERIFYABLE load data for the .357. If you chose to follow down a path that I deem illogical, then so be it. I look at it this way, it MAY work, it may work for many many years, but what if something does happen...... you've got no recourse, you're S.O.L., no manufacturer is going to take responsibility if you're loading non standard loads, even if it was a component issue. ( granted, if you're doing some wildcat loads, you're in the same boat, but most wildcatters build up and progress their loads, they didn't just haphazard "try it out" from hearsay or a whim)
It's not hard to get the correct primer, there are NO issues with a SMPP in 357, so WHY CHANGE??
Ok, I'll give this a permanent rest, if you still want to use rifle primers, your choice, we'll just chose to disagree, but I do hope you'll read Manufacturers recommended data and the research of those "in the know".
you can lead a horse to water, but............
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If a 460 S&W magnum revolver can handle 6000 psi then there's definitely nothing wrong with using them in a rifle. Some shooters actually prefer them due to the higher flash (depending on load). I would not hesitate to use them in a rifle until I exceeded 6,000 psi. They are virtually the same size but if you want to split hairs, get an adjustable hand primer tool.
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