The Firearms Forum banner

1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,036 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
finally dug the garand out of the same and pulled the sock off it the other day.

I had had it out back when i started relaoding to look at.. and forgot about it for a while.


commercial 3006 ok in this.. or will there be gas issues?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
111 Posts
Soundguy,
I have been told that any commercial ammo not stating it is for a Garand can cause over pressure and damage the op rod. I reload my own at pressures designed for the Garand and have had no problem. I have heard claims from some shooters that they shoot all types fo commercial 30-06 and have had no problems, but I would rather be safe then sorry. Hope this helps.
Chuck
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
208 Posts
I have also been told that it is wise be a bit conservative and keep things in the range the Garand was designed for. Cleaning the gas tube and port is not difficult.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,036 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Federal makes 150gr ammo marked M1Garand
yeah, and that stuff is all over the shelves everywhere right now.. :(

I'll have to look thru my milsurp stuff.. I have some on garand clips i THINK.. that is probably a no brainer.

I also have some greek stuff from? 60's maybee.. anybody know about it.. application?
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
41,403 Posts
The CMP sold Greek ammo for years, the last I bought from them was Greek, already in 8 round clips. The head stamp on it is HXP and it is made for the M1.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,241 Posts
As far as I've been told, using anything but 30.06 Springfield ammo, or ammo with same pressures, may cause damage to the opt rod in a Garand. Always been a no-no in my circles.
Plus you ,must be wary of foreign made ammo. Some of it may be machine gun ammo and too hot for a Garand.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,066 Posts
In the last few months I bought a few cans of the CMP Greek 30-06 ammo made for the Garand. It no longer is in clips but loose in a metal can. But that was before the election and it may (???) be a problem getting it now.

It is excellent boxer primed, military cased ammo with a crimped in primer. It is excellent for a source of reloading ammo after the first firing. I have reloaded it without a problem after removing the primer pocket crimp. it is actually good brass.

I would be hesitant to use regular commercial ammo in a Garand. The ammo we buy today is not the same as 30-06 ammo from the 1930's when the Garand was designed. The gas pressure curves and pressures (??) are different in today's ammo and the Garand has no gas pressure adjustment valve unless you add one (Brownells). Several reloading manuals include a Garand reloading page that is safe for use in a Garand.

Just a heads up for Garand owners. The operating rod piston diameter and the inside diameter of the gas chamber are big wear items on a Garand. When the clearances are too much, the gun will short cycle. Nothing short of replacement of both items with good parts will cure the problem (don't ask how I know all of this!).

LDBennett
 

·
Garandaholic
Joined
·
9,515 Posts
I tried to start a new thread on this but I get an error everytime I try (some code error where line 329 wanted more memory).
Is the CMP the best place to get Garand-safe 3006 these days? I used to see it everywhere, but now not even CTD has anything at all. Any suggestions?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,066 Posts
CMP is an excellent source of good military 30-06 ammo made for the Garand.

Is it better than new commercial ammo also made expressly for the Garand? I don't know the answer to that because I reload my own.

I got the Greek brass to reload from my son-in-law who buys lots of surplus military ammo (for various military guns he shoots ...he is a collector) rather than reloading so he gives me the reloadable brass. We have a deal for some of it in that I buy it, he shoots it, and he gives me the brass, and we barter something for the difference. It works for us.

The problem with most foreign brass is that it is Berdan primed which is basically not reloadable without great difficulty that I choose not to partake in. But the Greek 30-06 brass as sold by CMP is Boxer primed and good tough military brass. My son-in-law recommends it for shooting and I recommend it for reloading. That is at least the case with that which we have received in the past but as with anything else things can change (??).

LDBennett
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,241 Posts
CMP is an excellent source of good military 30-06 ammo made for the Garand.

Is it better than new commercial ammo also made expressly for the Garand? I don't know the answer to that because I reload my own.

I got the Greek brass to reload from my son-in-law who buys lots of surplus military ammo (for various military guns he shoots ...he is a collector) rather than reloading so he gives me the reloadable brass. We have a deal for some of it in that I buy it, he shoots it, and he gives me the brass, and we barter something for the difference. It works for us.

The problem with most foreign brass is that it is Berdan primed which is basically not reloadable without great difficulty that I choose not to partake in. But the Greek 30-06 brass as sold by CMP is Boxer primed and good tough military brass. My son-in-law recommends it for shooting and I recommend it for reloading. That is at least the case with that which we have received in the past but as with anything else things can change (??).

LDBennett
I bought some foreign made 30.06 ammo several years ago. (Don't recall origin now). Upon investigation, I learned it was machine gun ammo that was too hot for a Garand. Gunboards.com is a good place to find out this kind of info.
 

·
Garandaholic
Joined
·
9,515 Posts
CMP is an excellent source of good military 30-06 ammo made for the Garand.

Is it better than new commercial ammo also made expressly for the Garand? I don't know the answer to that because I reload my own.

I got the Greek brass to reload from my son-in-law who buys lots of surplus military ammo (for various military guns he shoots ...he is a collector) rather than reloading so he gives me the reloadable brass. We have a deal for some of it in that I buy it, he shoots it, and he gives me the brass, and we barter something for the difference. It works for us.

The problem with most foreign brass is that it is Berdan primed which is basically not reloadable without great difficulty that I choose not to partake in. But the Greek 30-06 brass as sold by CMP is Boxer primed and good tough military brass. My son-in-law recommends it for shooting and I recommend it for reloading. That is at least the case with that which we have received in the past but as with anything else things can change (??).

LDBennett
Well, I'd like to buy ammo from the CMP. Does the "club membership" requirement still have to be met to buy ammo? I was thinking that was only for guns?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,066 Posts
Fatstrat:

Remember, CMP sells several different grades of M1 Garands. In no way would they do their position any good if they sold the wrong ammo for it. Here is their description:

"M2 Ball Greek HXP (Pyrkal) manufacture, Packaged loose in 30 cal ammo can.
Total 200 rounds. Boxer primed, non-corrosive. Headstamp varies."


Here is Wikipedia description of M2 Ball ammo:

"A new cartridge was developed in 1938 that was essentially a duplicate of the old M1906 round, but loaded with IMR 4895 propellant and a new flat-based bullet that had gilding metal jacket and a different lead alloy and weighed 152 grains (9.8 g) instead of 150 grains (9.7 g). This 1938 pattern cartridge, the Cartridge .30 M2 Ball achieved a muzzle velocity of 2,805 ft/s (855 m/s) and muzzle energy of 2,655 ft·lbf (3,600 J)."

I believe the correct ammo for the Garand to be M2 Ball but I'll leave further research to those that care. If CMP sells the Greek M2 Ball ammo for the Garands that they supply then that is good enough for me as to whether it is the correct ammo for use in any M1 Garand.

LDBennett
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
M2 would be correct, according to TM 43-3001-27 "Army Ammunition Data Sheets Small Caliber Ammunition" the M2 ball was loaded with 50 gr. 4895. They show pressure right at 50,000, but many things have changed since then, powders and especially the accuracy of pressure testing. I believe current data puts that load a little hot, we use 48 gr. 4895 with Sierra 150 bullets and they work beautifully. I only use this at ranges that use the 100 yard course (reduced targets of course), when I shoot the other ranges, (200 to 600 yards) I use 47gr, 4895 with 168 HPBT bullets. I've used Hornady and Sierra HPBT match and can see no difference. By the way, this is the NRA approved (max) load for the M1 Garand, (46.5 gives about the same results). A note, this load through my 1903A3 shoots groups smaller than a dime, the rifle has absolutely no modifications.
I would recommend getting a copy of the manual, I got mine while in the service and do not know if there is one available electronically.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,189 Posts
IMR or H4895 is about the best powder if there ever was such thing. No idea what some of the commercial stuff uses, I would reload or use known milsurp if it was mine. All I've ever shot in mine is Lake City and reloaded LC.

A few rounds isn't going to damage anything but over time it can screw up the gun. IMR 4064 is also a good powder on the fast end as is the 4895. It's pretty much identical to reloading for the M1A/M14 just in 30-06.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
H4895 is a different powder, very close, but does require a different load. I haven't used it for a while, but it will need backed off a bit, I'd say 1 gr.
I believe Hodgdon even owns/ operates IMR now, but they have kept the 4895 powders in two separate lines.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,207 Posts
commercial oughtsix ammo will damage the op rod of an unmodified garand. They do sell adjustable gas plugs for the Garand that will enable them to safely utilize any .30-06 ammo. But unmodified they need ammo that runs about 55K psi chamber and 5K psi at the gas port. Powders between H4895 and IMR4064 will give you those loads. IMR4895 is ideal at about 49 gr under a 150-155 g bullet. I have also had excellent results with 48 gr Varget under 155 gr Amaxes. The 03A3 also loves them..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,189 Posts
yeppers. And hodgon did buy out IMR but have kept all their powders separate that I'm aware of. IMR/Hodgon 4895 is very close to each other for load data but they are still to be treated as different powders.

I didn't know that there were replacement gas mods for the garand, very cool!

I know some of the match M1A's/M14's out there that are dedicated 1000yd guns have had the system 'tweaked' for 190gn bullets...

that's the other deal, I know the M1A it is not wise to shoot much more than 175gn bullets without modification, any idea what the max recommended is for the garand? I would imagine it's similar?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,036 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Back right after 08 I bought a couple hundred rounds of the greek.. just located it. or located the rest of it. i've shot about 100 rounds of it thru my rem700 boltgun, and have subsequently reloaded it a few times. yep.. did have a crimped primer, etc.

I had heard stories of some korean 3006 that was devastating.. case failures.. hot.. etc.


In the last few months I bought a few cans of the CMP Greek 30-06 ammo made for the Garand. It no longer is in clips but loose in a metal can. But that was before the election and it may (???) be a problem getting it now.

It is excellent boxer primed, military cased ammo with a crimped in primer. It is excellent for a source of reloading ammo after the first firing. I have reloaded it without a problem after removing the primer pocket crimp. it is actually good brass.

I would be hesitant to use regular commercial ammo in a Garand. The ammo we buy today is not the same as 30-06 ammo from the 1930's when the Garand was designed. The gas pressure curves and pressures (??) are different in today's ammo and the Garand has no gas pressure adjustment valve unless you add one (Brownells). Several reloading manuals include a Garand reloading page that is safe for use in a Garand.

Just a heads up for Garand owners. The operating rod piston diameter and the inside diameter of the gas chamber are big wear items on a Garand. When the clearances are too much, the gun will short cycle. Nothing short of replacement of both items with good parts will cure the problem (don't ask how I know all of this!).

LDBennett
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top