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I completely understand your comments ral357, and was hesitant to post my last. I'd prefer to give someone ample warning, as opposed to actually having to shoot someone. I want to give clear warning, "You've picked the Wrong House."

If someone is inside my House, uninvited and has broke in to get there - I'd venture to say his intent is pretty clear. It's not like I live in a City. Very rural Country. People who break in to Homes around here, get shot. Not very many Break ins around here at all. You call 911, After you've dealt with the situation at hand. Law Enforcement around here is very aware of that.

I will worry about defending my "Warning" later in Court. I do however give ample credence to being "The Grey Man," there is a great deal of merit to that. I will Definately give you that

If you are well on my Remote Country property with intent to break in - I figure I am giving fair warning, you might want to move on to another house. My bet is, that will dictate someone moving on to someone else's Property, at the very least give them second thoughts.

I do understand your train of thought though.
 
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There are a number of People in our extremely Rural County, (Johnson County, TN. "Copperhood Road," from the song up in the Mountains about 6 mi. from me.) that have just gone missing. That tends to happen where the rule is SSS. 🤔

One for shooting a neighbors dog as the root reason. (So the rumor goes.) Best mind your business. People don't tend to Play too much up around here.
 

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My place has 2 neighbors. 1 is 90yo lady, owns the other 1/2 mile, lives on far corner. 2 is across the road and 1/2 mile down.

Son kept loosing chickens. One day he sees neighbor 2 dog leave my barn and run home.
Talked to neighbor, he swore his dog never crossed the road and dig kill chickens.
I told him, " good to know, I see the "strange" dog, I will kill it. "

2 days later, son sees dog, with chicken in his mouth, in my pasture. He shot it.

Neighbor is driving home and sees dog. He calls Sheriff and files complaint.

Sheriff comes out. Show him dog, still has chicken in mouth, in direct line from chicken coop to home.

Sheriff goes to neighbor and reports, " don't believe that is your dog, it is across the road and has a dead chicken in his mouth. IF it is your dog, you owe for 36 dead chickens. "

Turned out, it wasn't his dog. But, we never his dog, again or lost any chickens.
 

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[QUOTE="KenK/84Bravo, post: ...various single shot shotguns w/ammo saddles stashed around the house. A Mossberg 500 (okay Western Field) [/QUOTE]


Yeah, on my wife’s side of the bed is the Savage 220 single 12...the one shotgun I know she knows how to use, with 5 rounds of birdshot in the stock sleeve...and my Mossberg is also actually a Western Field 550...the parts I fixed it with were stock 500 though...I agonize over shortening it to 18”, because it has that “select-choke” at the end...a little shorter than a plain barrel and in the dark it might just look like some sort of blunderbuss to a BG😎. I just keep it turned all the way down past “IC.”
 

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[QUOTE="ral357, post: 2261895, member: 70700"...Anyone who has been involved in civil litigation can tell you that emotion can and often does override facts or right in outcomes there.
We all gotta play the cards we are dealt as we see fit. As a younger man I was a bit more visible. The years have slowed my reflexes and diminished my strength but hopefully added to understanding...... I prefer to keep my hand very close to my vest.
[/QUOTE]

VERY good advice especially if you live in a city and/or your local prosecutor is not a good person. But the civil liability lawyers can and will go after you no matter where you live. Even in a “friendly” court the legal fees even if you win will cost you big time.

Which is ANOTHER reason to rethink buckshot in your home defense shotgun. Unless you can prove you routinely hunt coyotes or something and can plausibly claim you “just had some laying around,” it could looka helluva lot like you are some crazy Nut job just looking to “blow somebody away “ to an unknowing emotional jury of “women.”

I believe it’s MUCH better to use “common” hunting birdshot, common hunting bullets and even “target handloads” (those WC and SWC lead bullets that are INTENDED to just cut nice holes in paper, also make NICE defense loads...😉) than some “Hydro Shock Maximum Defense Blaster Knockdown Terminal Performance” or whatever high energy high pricedefensive ammo you buy, (unless you’re an LEO) to that same uninformed jury.

And you are NOT giving away a heckuva lot in performance😎

By the way, trying to be the “Gray Man” in any group is a great way to NOT be a target in the first place, and I think at least in the current political climate just might be a very smart thing for all of us to consider...
 

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Frank Powers - just me here and my dog Buddy. (4 yr. Old muscular Pit.) He is not going to wait for me to engage. I was merely stating a tactic that the OP may wish to think about, rather than negotiating narrow hallways in his house.

As seedycharacter alluded to, Different Occupant Dynamic = Different Plan.

(I edited my "Warning signage" Posts in order to not lead some astray.)

I also found it interesting some suggesting downloading from the most effective rounds available to Birdshot, in order to no be sued. Personally, if you break in to my house, you are going to face #4 Buck or 00 Buck.

I do appreciate the opposing viewpoint though.
 

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Frank Powers - just me here and my dog Buddy. (4 yr. Old muscular Pit.) He is not going to wait for me to engage. I was merely stating a tactic that the OP may wish to think about, rather than negotiating narrow hallways in his house.

As seedycharacter alluded to, Different Occupant Dynamic = Different Plan.

(I edited my "Warning signage" Posts in order to not lead some astray.)

I also found it interesting some suggesting downloading from the most effective rounds available to Birdshot, in order to no be sued. Personally, if you break in to my house, you are going to face #4 Buck or 00 Buck.

I do appreciate the opposing viewpoint though.
Yeah that's is all it was, just a different perspective, no harm intended, none taken.
 

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E30B2B78-11AB-46F7-AABB-2C1A431FB14A.jpeg

Me and my Mossberg loaded with #4 buck will make the BG rethink his life choices real fast!
 

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A 410 judge with a couple loadings of #4 shot and a few 45s would work inside small rooms and halls.

I dont have a judge though so just use a few 357 mags in a 5" revolver with #2 shot loaded to 950 fps for close protection and low light conditions. HPs in the last 4 revolver chambers if more is needed. Point and shoot w/ the 2 shot - if you aim in the general direction you dont miss.

That gets me to were my 12ga pump with 21" IC is stashed with various loadings stacked. 0 to 100 yrds = dead meat but I think its too much for inside of my house where people I dont want to shoot are located.

Not what you hear from the legal people but most of those people haven't actually been in a real life and death situation either.

I dont use flash lights or laser pointers on guns - thats like jumping up and down and yelling here I am shoot me. Kind of like a sniper smoking a cig at night or with an IR bulb strapped to his helmet.
 

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Frank Powers - just me here and my dog Buddy. (4 yr. Old muscular Pit.) He is not going to wait for me to engage. I was merely stating a tactic that the OP may wish to think about, rather than negotiating narrow hallways in his house.

As seedycharacter alluded to, Different Occupant Dynamic = Different Plan.

(I edited my "Warning signage" Posts in order to not lead some astray.)

I also found it interesting some suggesting downloading from the most effective rounds available to Birdshot, in order to no be sued. Personally, if you break in to my house, you are going to face #4 Buck or 00 Buck.

I do appreciate the opposing viewpoint though.
Opposing viewpoints is how we all learn!😉

But just consider, and maybe with some actual testing, that #4 Buck at 10 feet may NOT be your “most effective “ load😉

At 10 feet it gives you NOTHiNG over an ounce and a half of ANY load, and just possibly LESS...just saying...

But it does take testing to overcome the “counterintuitive.” And if Buckshot gives you extra confidence, even if not warranted, there’s some value in that too.

All I am saying, from my testing years ago, is at ranges less than say 20 feet, bird may be better, at up to about 30 feet it’s a wash (except for the overpenetration through walls with buck!) over 30 feet you may not drop the BG but you’ll probably at least hurt and blind him badly😉

...and the trump card (small “t”😉)...talk to any ER trauma doctor who has experience with gunshot wounds...to a person, they will say close range small shot wounds are the worst they ever see...

There’s physics involved too...I don’t pretend to be a physicist but it makes sense when I heard it explained by them...that 1.5 oz of lead of any size acts just like a solid projectile at the muzzle...then when the shot starts to expand it starts to assume the properties of a fluid, but for a short time it has the properties of both...at 9-10 feet it’s about 3” wide but still acting like a solid mass because so many pellets are concentrated in that 3”....but birdshot will all STOP in that 10 feet (fluid in fluid) while the buckshot continues on THOUGH ...(as 9 or 12 or how many individual SOLIDS) so the bird shot WILL transfer more energy at that range than any but low velocity buckshot...

We are talking VERY short range only, if you have a 40x40 “Great Room” it may not work as well...but in most homes...go with the bird.

And I defy anyone to say my 200 gr H&G 68 SWC “target loads” from my .45 at a little over 900 FPS would not be a good “home” load😉

And I know my wife loves shooting the “powder puff” target 148 gr HBWC loads through her Model 49 Bodyguard...😉. There is a reason the “Chief’s Load” developed a great reputation as a “fight stopper...” back then.... Even if they DIDNT load them “backwards...”😉
 

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But at the risk of being yelled at for “arguing” again😎 whatever you choose is your choice! And until any of us is in that situation (and I pray I never am!) we won’t REALLY know if our choice is the right one!

All we can do is listen to all advice, good or bad, test what we can, if and when we can, and while sorting through all the bull snort😎 decide for ourselves the path we take.

But one thing for sure that is pretty much a given for ANYONE who HAS been through it...there WILL be a cost! To you, and your family at the very least! Emotionally and financially.


We’ve all heard “Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6...” and that may be true somewhat ...

...but like anything else in life, the whole truth generally isn’t found on a bumper sticker...
 

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My home defense shotgun is an FNH SLP 12 gauge loaded with #1 buckshot. Try point shooting at in home distances with the shotgun held at the hip with half of the gun behind you and half in front.
 

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This is my home defense shotgun. Benelli Nova. Plastic fantastic. I got my son one for last Christmas. Under $400 and very accurate. My son took his to the trap range and got 17 out of 25 with it. He is an AA shooter and with his trap gun is a 25 25 shooter. 17 out of 25 with this shotgun is unheard of. 12 gauge open choke 18-inch barrel.

247365
 

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Just sold an identical Benelli Nova (unfired) on a unnamed Auction site a couple weeks ago. Went for $650.

I have a few Riot pumps, and that one was just sitting in the safe. I decided to make hay while the sun was shining.
 

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I actually thought it would bring more gvw3, based on what I have been observing Riot Pumps go for, especially "Tactical" Riot Pumps. Still $300 more than I paid for it. I was hoping for the $8-900 range.
 

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I paid $350 for my sons and $400 for mine. Mine has ghost ring sights and he has rifle sights. These are new in-the-box prices. I won't be selling mine as this is my only self-defense shotgun. I have 11 shotguns but this is the only one I could use to protect my home.
 
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I had 14 different shotguns gvw3, I collect Military Riot Pumps. (As well as others.) My Nova had the Wilson Combat Ghost Ring sites. As much as I liked the Nova, I knew if I had to choose one to use, it would be my High Standard K1200 18-7 or my Savage/Stevens 520-30, both Flaming Bomb Pumps.

Just parted with 3 via Auction site, to help offset the price of a New Radikal SA1 semi-auto I added to the collection.

Just a thought, and just me, but I've never seen a Shotgun I could not use to defend my house with. May not be ideal, but they all work. I keep multiple single shots with ammo bands on them stashed around the house, as well as a 20ga pump, and the SA1 in the bedroom.

Best to you Brother.
 
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