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How to strip and re-blue

12K views 30 replies 9 participants last post by  hankroberts 
#1 ·
Hi, just aquired a Mossberg 472 (like Marlin 336) and it was not well stored and has corrosion on the receiver, lever and hammer and slight rust on the barrel. The barrel is still nice and black but the receiver has a purple/brown color to it. I am going to use Brownells Oxpho as I have heard lots of good reports on it. My question is do I need to remove ALL of the coloring from the receiver or just work the sections that are corroded? Only a smal portion has bad corrosion but there are very small dots of pitting in other areas. I think steel wool will remove them but probalby most of the blueing (purple browning really). Since the Oxpho is nice and black will it color equally if I don't remove all the old finish? Also, what type of draw file is best to start with? Are there special types or do I go to Home Depot and get a fine file and work with it? Birchwood Casey blue/rust remover any good? Do I need it?
Thanks!
9 fingers
 
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#2 ·
Just an opinion, 9, but rebluing in only a few places (unless they are very small) usually turns out looking cheap and patchy. My suggestion would be to do the whole rifle. I would use fine steel wool or emery paper. Start with 400 grit, perhaps a bit heavier for the really bad places. You might also add a little WD-40 applied first. You want to end up with as smooth a metal surface as you can manage. The cold blue will take much better that way. Be sure to remove ALL oil or grease residue from the metal before you actually apply the blue. Be patient. If you are cold bluing bare metal, don't expect it to come out dark enough after the first application. Be prepared to apply the blue as many times as needed, letting it dry thoroughly between applications, and going over the surface lightly with fine steel wool (800) between each application.
 
#3 ·
Thanks Pistolenshutze.
The corrosion is heavy enough in a few places that steel wool will not be enought to remove it. I will need to file along the top of the receiver and near the load port. Then I will hit it with variousl paper grits and maybe carefull a bit of wire wheel. Question: is Gunscrubber sufficient to degrease before I blue? Does it leave any residue? I may be able to get away with 220 grit instead of the file but I don't think so.
Thanks again.
9 fingers
 
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#4 ·
Thanks Pistolenshutze.
The corrosion is heavy enough in a few places that steel wool will not be enought to remove it. I will need to file along the top of the receiver and near the load port. Then I will hit it with variousl paper grits and maybe carefull a bit of wire wheel. Question: is Gunscrubber sufficient to degrease before I blue? Does it leave any residue? I may be able to get away with 220 grit instead of the file but I don't think so.
Thanks again.
9 fingers
I would suggest you use whatever is necessary to remove the corrosion, 9, but try and keep to the minimum abrasive power that will work effectively. If the corrosion is bad enough to require files, use them, but I would start with a very fine one and only work up to rougher ones if truly needed. One very effective type of file is the kind that uses various grits of diamond dust as the file medium. Remember, metal that is removed cannot be put back. ;) Work slowly and carefully, applying only the minimum pressure that gets the job done. Gunscrubber is a good product, I use it myself, but for this purpose, I would suggest you buy a can of degreaser. Birchwood Casey and several others make such a product and they are quite effective for that purpose. The cleaner and smoother the surface, the better the cold blue will take.
 
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#5 · (Edited)
I second Pistols suggestion to do the whole thing, if you dont it will end up patchy. Birchwood Caseys Blue and Rust remover is in my opinion fantastic. I have used in many times and have a bottle here as I write. Did a handgun slide recently to match the frame. Old gun so had to blend, be creative. The remover got me straight back to steel in double quick time. Just be sure to follow instructions.

Actually the original finish had developed into a fine dapple. I kept dipping wire wool into the blue creme and gently built the finish up until it matched. I love things like that. Never be afraid to try things out.
 
#8 ·
Ok, so I'll order some Oxpho, the blu and rust remover from Birchwood casey and some degreaser. I am waiting on a reprint for takedown as I can't get the lower receiver off to get at the hammer and the safety to remove them. Last thing is to remove the barrel. I am assuming it is threaded in. I am thinking I will put the barrel in a properly shaped holder of wood in a vice and turn the receiver clockwise. Is this the best way to do it or is there another approach? It appears to be a fairly nice gun, maybe not as nice as a good 336, but worth me bringing it back to a nice finish. I am going to tru oil the stock also, which I have done before. All the rest is new to me including the full takedown. Never had to do it before. Thanks for all the advice.
9 fingers
 
#10 ·
Well, you are probably right but I tend to do good work on anything I really put my mind and hands to (I drew, GC's and finished my own house and learned finish carpentry along the way) and I have seen the results of cold blue restorations elsewhere on the web and they look great so I am going to give it my best shot. If the Mossberg receiver is made of a metal blend that does not take the cold blu well then I will go the baked laquer approach. I will, no doubt, make it better than it is now and it will be a learning experience. I don't want to throw a lot of money at this gun as it is what my gunsmith calls "my commuter car". My pristine 1950's Marlin 336 SC Deluxe is my collector. I just don't want the Mossberg to look like a rust bucket. Thanks, 9 fingers
 
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#11 ·
Glad to read your thoughts 9 fingers (?). Billdeshivs is of course quite right, nothing beats a professional job, but on workaday firearms of less than high value, It can be fun to do it yourself. Dont knock it till you've tried it.
 
#12 ·
I really do not have anything to ad that has not been said. I did just refinish two old Winchesters that had been used, abused, and neglected for many years. I used the Oxpho-Blue after taking the metal down with 400 paper and 0000 wool. They both came out better than I had ever hoped for. I am really not ashamed to show them off now.
Neither of these guns had any real collector value but meant a lot to me as the model 12 was my dad's favorite gun and 69A I've had forever.:cool:
Since the model 12 stock was in bad shape I used Birchwood Casey Tru-Oil on the stock and am extremely pleased with the results there.
So, take your time and do it yourself unless you have a very valuable piece is my suggestion.
oldogy
 
#14 ·
Bill DeShivs, intereesting hobby and profession you have there and good website. Probably NONE of us here will ever approach your skill with metal but just the same I am going to give it my best go and see how it comes out. Again, it is ugly now and I will do a decent job (in my eyes) and it will undoubtedly be better than it is and I will most likely enjoy the process. And again, it is not a collector firearm. I think I am doing it more for fun and as a learning experience than any other reason. I can't wait to start!
Thanks to all for their input.
9 fingers (really 8 and one thumb)
 
#15 ·
Borwnell's tech guy got back to me and suggested that I use Aluma Hyde II paint rather than try to reblue the alloy used on the Mossberg and I jsut ordered it in Semi Gloss black, and since they nail you for $10.50 shipping (I hate when the shipping is as much as the thing you buy!) I also ordered the Oxpho blue creme and the Birchwood rust and blu remover. I no doubt will use the stuff eventually as I am always on the lookout for good old guns. Took pictures of the BEFORE gun and will post them when I am done. Incidentally, Brownells recommended against using one of their paints that require baking due to the "long length of the action". I am not sure what they mean but perhaps the action has too much mass to it and it takes too long to heat to the proper temperature. Or maybe warping becomes an issue at 350 degrees for a few hours. Anyway, paint it is. Thanks for the comments.
9 fingers
 
#16 ·
I've never reblued a gun but I have done a bit of metal polishing in mold shops. The fact that you ask what type file to use makes me wonder if this is something you are really ready for. I would never use a file to remove rust (not corrosion unless it's aluminum) from the surface of a firearm.

What you should use is a rotary tool or air motor with various grits of polishing discs. Actually the best would be to make a thing we used to call a butterfly using rolled crocus or emery cloth. It's about 1 1/2 " wide and you fold it in such a way as to produce an 8 sided pinwheel that looks somehing like a gift wrap bow. Then you drill a hole through the center and attach it to a spindle. I could show you but it's a little hard to describe here. These are very controllable and will enable you to remove a little to a lot of material uniformally leaving a nice polished surface.

The rolls of this cloth are a bit pricey but you might check your local phone book for a "mold and machine" shop and stop by one of those. They might give you enough to do the job. You only need about 3' .
 
#17 ·
There are two problem with using a file or even steel wool for removing large amounts rust on a firearm. The rust can be actualy be forced deeper into the pores of the metal. (It's not really pores like you have on your skin. Under a miscroscope, metal surfaces normally have valleys and mountains)
That rust can then "fester" there and then spread under the new finish if the finish is a plating or a paint type. The second problem is controlling the filing action to keep corners sharp, rounds round, angles angled, etc.

A much better way to remove a lot of rust from a firearm is abrasive blasting, sort of like sand blasting. (But NOT with silica sand!) Abrasive blasting will remove the rust without causing it to embed. Of course, the surface will be a matte and have no gloss. That's fine if it's a satin finish that you want but if you want a high gloss, you'll need it polished and that takes an real expert. Keep yer powder dry, Mac.
 
#18 ·
I spent a year and a half as an apprentice with one of the best, Jack Alexandria, The Shot Gun Specialist. 9 fingers, go for it! If it were a gun of value, leave it alone, don't touch that finish! An everyday shooter, hey, give it your best shot, what have you got to loose, a gun? No, you are not going to mess up the gun, you can blue, re-blue, paint, coat, or anything else you want to do at any time, and the gun will still shoot! I like your attitude!
 
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#19 · (Edited)
Tranter
I tried it for years, and came to the conclusion that, despite the fact that I have better tools and skills than most, it just doesn't work well.
Its interesting the way this thread has gone on. What you say above is absolutely correct. If you compare a hobby re blue or touch up with a pro job, it will not look as good. But as carver said, if its an everyday shooter, and of modest value, why not. I have been cold re bluing and touching up for years. Both in the gun trade and out, and surprisingly good results can be obtained with care and patience.

There is another thing to consider. While working in the trade I have cold paste blued both components and large parts to match the rest of the gun. A pro job would be out of place.

I recently refinished a WW2 German Hi Power. The frame was worn, non too bad but the slide was in a bad state. I reblued the slide to match the rest of the gun. To make the whole 'as new' would have looked wrong and been quite false. It needed it to look better, but still its age. A bench, some cloth, wire wool and blue creme was the best way to go.

Guns make a great hobby, and while no one should be messing with trigger pulls or the safety unless trained to do so, there are many other things we can do. From fitting accessories, scopes, grips etc, to re finishing wood and metal. I well remember as a teenager re finishing the three pieces of a Thompsons wood in the back garden, it was great fun and although the results may not have been perfect, they fitted the age of the gun. Plus 40 years later, its still a fond memory. Bill, you are clearly very skilled, but dont tell me you started that way !
 
#20 ·
i've had mixed results attempting to reblue but never just to patch up a worn spot. if i was cover up some holster wear on the end of a barrel and i tried to just cover the worn spot it always looked like crap. but if i stripped the entire barrel and reblued it it looked ok. the key being to remove all the old blue and using alot of elbow grease with some 000 or 0000 steel wool before trying to reblue. oh and the best result were with birchwood paste.
 
#21 · (Edited)
Wow, this has been a good thread! Carver and Tranter, thanks for the encouragement. I am not a believer in the "no can do" attitude. If we knew how hard half the things were to do we would never attempt them. RunningonMT, I intended to carefully draw file to remove some material to reduce the apparant pitting. I do not want to lose the edge shape of the metal. I have started to work on the gun and think I can probably get away with block sanding with 220/320/400 to remove just enough material that the pitting is a non issue. Probably 400 is finer than I need to go. The top of the receiver on this gun has some long grooves that also have corrosion and these I am going to hit with a wire wheel. Now that I am going to paint instead of blu (still might try the blu to see how it comes out!) I am not as concerned about minor imperfections as the paint will cover some of the flaws. And again, it is sort of a beater gun but I still want it to look nice. And if I don't try it I will never learn. I took pictures of the receiver before I went to work and will get some of completed task, when the gun is assembled. I think I mentioned that I am also doing the stock, which I am good at and look forward to the new look. I have attached a ink that has abolutely nothing to do with guns but is a couple of pictures of a motorcycle I modified/built/painted and a short article on it, form a web page in South East Wales. I am in NJ but apparantly the guys into my form of motorcycling think I did a world class job. I didn't know what I was doing when I started that project either! www.r2wtrials.co.uk/html_files/hondatlr200.html
9 fingers
 
#22 ·
Wow, this has been a good thread! Carver and Tranter, thanks for the encouragement. I am not a believer in the "no can do" attitude. If we knew how hard half the things were to do we would never attempt them. RunningonMT, I intended to carefully draw file to remove some material to reduce the apparant pitting. I do not want to lose the edge shape of the metal. I have started to work on the gun and think I can probably get away with block sanding with 220/320/400 to remove just enough material that the pitting is a non issue. Probably 400 is finer than I need to go. The top of the receiver on this gun has some long grooves that also have corrosion and these I am going to hit with a wire wheel. Now that I am going to paint instead of blu (still might try the blu to see how it comes out!) I am not as concerned about minor imperfections as the paint will cover some of the flaws. And again, it is sort of a beater gun but I still want it to look nice. And if I don't try it I will never learn. I took pictures of the receiver before I went to work and will get some of completed task, when the gun is assembled. I think I mentioned that I am also doing the stock, which I am good at and look forward to the new look. I have attached a ink that has abolutely nothing to do with guns but is a couple of pictures of a motorcycle I modified/built/painted and a short article on it, form a web page in South East Wales. I am in NJ but apparantly the guys into my form of motorcycling think I did a world class job. I didn't know what I was doing when I started that project either! www.r2wtrials.co.uk/html_files/hondatlr200.html
9 fingers
I think if you want to see it you need to copy and paste into your URL or for those that want if you go to Google Image Search and type in TLR200, the very first image that comes up is my bike, silver red and white. THE LINK actually WORKS.
I never meant to imply you couldn't or shouldn't take this on. My point was that a file is not the way to remove rust from a firearm if you want the completed job to have a nice smooth finish. Using files for fitting is fine, but for surface preparation polishing with a rotary tool with a fine abrasive is the way to go. You might also try soaking it in white vinegar prior to using steel wool. Good luck.
 
#23 ·
Thanks, the vinegar trick sounds like a good idea and I had not heard that one. Hopefully the file will not be needed as I really want to remove as little as possible. My order from Brownells is not going to make it to NJ till Monday, which is too bad but I can start the stock work at least. Thanks for comments.
9
 
#25 ·
Certainly playing with guns is a fun and gratifying experience. I simply wanted the OP to understand that his gun will come out looking "less than new." Just trying to keep him from going through some of the troubles that I had getting to where I am today!
BTW- if the receiver is aluminum, cold blue WON'T work. You will have to paint, anodize, or plate it. Another choice is to sand it bare and leave it silver.
 
#26 ·
No, it is steel, but it must be diferent than the barrel steel as that is still the deep rich blue like new, in most area, and the receiver turned plum. This gun was made in the mid 70's and I have not seen one turn so plum colored in only 40 years, but I am no expert. I may try the Oxpho and see how it turns out, I can always use the Aluma Hyde paint over what I do if it looks bad. Either way will be fine with me.
 
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