I'm new so I'll make a topic...

Discussion in 'Centerfire Pistols & Revolvers' started by Zigzag2, Feb 25, 2003.

  1. Zigzag2

    Zigzag2 Guest

    EvilAudio
    Member
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    (1/5/03 3:07:59 pm)
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    ...to get your ire up.
    Every notice how most popular foreign pistols are made by countries that got the crap kicked out of 'em in World War II?
    Walther & HK....yep we whooped Germany.
    Glock....Austria? were they even in that war?
    Beretta....Italy took what, a couple weeks to conquer? Even with Germany's help defending?

    I just hate supporting a country's economy that tried to kill my grandfather. It's a shame our police forces and military love these pistols made overseas. I won't get started on foreign cars...
    Sorry, I'm in a cynical mood today.
    "If a tie is like kissing your sister, losing is like kissing your grandmother with her teeth out." George Brett

    1952Sniper
    V.I.P. Member
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    (1/6/03 9:02:35 am)
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    So exactly how long do you think those countries should be punished? 100 years? 200?

    It does not do anyone any good to hold a grudge like that against those countries. If a German company makes a good product, then I see no reason why it should not be used on a worldwide scale. After all, the people who design and manufacture those firearms (or cars, or whatever) are not the same ones who "tried to kill your grandfather".

    I think when it comes to firearms, there are a lot of foreign companies that whip the pants off of the American companies in quality and price.
    Macht kaputt, was euch kaputt macht!

    Go Get Beer
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    (1/6/03 9:11:06 am)
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    Please, kind sirs, take pity on the country that took the first strike of the Nazi attack and buy a Radom VIS today.

    Seriously, though, all the arms carried by the US Forces have to be manufactured in the US, I think. AFAIK Belgian Minimi machinegun (M249 SAW), Beretta 92 (M9) and H&K USP (SoComm) as well as Rheinmetall 120 (main gun for the Abrams) are manufactured in US under license.

    Xracer
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 3450
    (1/6/03 11:53:59 am)
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    "Italy took what, a couple weeks to conquer? Even with Germany's help defending?"

    I wouldn't suggest you say this to anybody who fought in the Italian campaign.....you're likely to get your head handed to you on a plate.

    Anzio was no picnic.....nor crossing the Rapido numerous times, nor the battle for Monte Casino. In fact, at the time of Germany's surrender, we were still fighting German troops in the Italian Alps.

    I think you need a history lesson: members.aol.com/ItalyWW2/History.htm

    EvilAudio
    Member
    Posts: 10
    (1/6/03 7:02:12 pm)
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    You replies are great, and actually a bit like I was hoping for. Nothing wrong with stirring the pot every now and again.
    Anyhoo....here goes a quick re-reply.
    "So exactly how long do you think those countries should be punished? 100 years? 200?"
    I don't think it's a matter of punishing a country for past sins, although I did imply so. I beleive that there is no good reason for us to use foreign arms (local police, military, etc). It's seems counter productive. Here is the fact:
    The military is in place to protect American existence and interests.
    How does it serve in our best interest to send the profits of an arms contract to a foreign supplier? Regardless of where the arm is made or assembled, the dough goes to another country rather than in the pocket of an American company, which would in turn be redistributed throughout our economy. I understand perfectly well after WWII we wanted to help these countries rebuild thier economy. Guns and cars was a good way to do so in that age before the Information Boom. So we rebuilt factories that we bombed the crap out of and put them back on thier feet financially. So why still support them 50 years later? Maybe I'm just don't understand the theories of a global economy and such. That whole WTO/UN/Bilderberger stuff scares the bejesus out of me.
    What was wrong with the 1911 that made us want a Beretta? Why the 9mm NATO universal round? Why not just ask Colt to rechamber? Why not tell NATO to go to hell with their 9mm? Was the .45 to big for our soldiers? If a .45 is too much pistol for a soldier, I don't want THAT soldier protecting my freedom!
    Not that Beretta's are COMPLETE crap, but why an Italian pistol? Why did they even let foreign companies submit for the contract? No American company could meet the standard? Send the Americans back to the drawing board and tell them to come back with a design that works.
    As far as I know, the .45 worked just fine, thank you very much.
    If you want it to shoot 9mm so bad tell Colt so. If you want it to have a higher capacity tell Colt so. If you wanted a more reliable pistol I'm sure Colt would have been willing to do something, but considering the longevity of the 1911 design, there couldn't have been much wrong with it.
    That's enough for now. I'll touch on some other things later.
    Happy shooting.




    "If a tie is like kissing your sister, losing is like kissing your grandmother with her teeth out." George Brett

    1952Sniper
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    (1/7/03 8:23:38 am)
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    Well, apparently you have no experience in the "real" world of business contracts. No offense meant. But when it comes to contracting the manufacture of equipment (be it firearms or whatever), there are certain rules. You can't ask a company to place a bid, and when they win the bid, you tell them to go to hell. If a company places a competitive bid and they win, then you give them the contract. I can't say for certain, but I assume this is what's going on.

    I also tend to disagree with the notion that we should strictly buy American just for the sake of buying American, when it comes to military/police. If we are asking a police officer to risk his life in the line of duty, we should allow him to choose which weapon he wants to use. If he likes a Glock, give him a Glock.

    But I do agree with what you said about Colt and other American companies needing to improve on the quality and reduce the cost of their firearms. I don't own one single American-made firearm (although I have in the past). They are cost-prohibitive. As I've pointed out in other discussions, I'm a cheap bastard. I can usually find a better gun from a foreign source. I'm not saying that there are no good American firearms, or that I'll never own one. And then again, I collect historic military firearms, most of which are European.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Oh, and it's great that you stirred the pot a little. I could kinda tell that that's what you were doing. It keeps the board interesting.
    Macht kaputt, was euch kaputt macht!

    Edited by: 1952Sniper at: 1/7/03 8:24:51 am

    IShootBack
    Member
    Posts: 48
    (1/7/03 7:46:05 pm)
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    EA:
    I think your'e looking for the BBS at gunbroker (Brand X) They cater to your mindset.
    ISB
    Guns cause crime, like spoons made Rosie fat