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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Sorry for the overly long post, but this is really bugging me.

My Hornady LNL AP press is not functioning like it should. When priming the shell holder plate will stop just short of being centered over the primer by maybe 1/16". Then just a small movement of the handle will cause it to click into place. It appears the primer is rising up and contacting the bottom of the case before it is centered causing the plate to stop rotation before the case is exactly centered and the primer will not seat. Stopping the ram before it bottoms out then completing the stroke after a short pause will cause the shell holder plate to move the last little bit and the primer will seat most of the time, but not always. The press should seat the primer with one smooth down stroke.

The fault only happens when there is a case in the shell holder plate and a primer in the primer slide. All other times it functions perfectly. With just a case in the shell holder and no primer in the slide it indexes exactly where it should every time.

The effect of the problem is that priming is not 100% reliable. Most of the time I can feel the primer being seated, but not always and at least 3 to as many as 10 cases out of every hundred do not get primed. This results in getting powder all over the press and floor and I don't like the safety hazard it creates.

This is the second press I've had. Hornady replaced the first press because it would maintain an accurate indexing. It could be adjusted correctly then five or ten strokes later it would be off again. This one maintains accurate indexing except when priming. All other times it works great.

I've worked around the problem by breaking the reloading process into two parts. The first is resizing, priming, and case mouth expansion. The second is dropping powder, seating, and crimping in a separate operation. This actually works very well, but it defeats the purpose of a progressive press and means more time spent reloading.

I have replaced several parts on the press and spent several hours on the phone with Hornady CS. They have tried but are unable to diagnose and correct problem and have sent me a second shipping label the return the press so they can try to find out what is wrong.

I am torn between returning the press and just forgetting the problem and continue to load in two stages. The two stage process works very well and I kind of like doing it that way because it effectively gives me ten reloading stages. In two phases I can resize, prime, expand, drop powder, run the RCBS lock out die, use the RCBS manual bullet feeder, seat, and crimp. That is seven reloading stages and there are three unused.

It just bothers me to have spent a good sum of money on equipment that will not work as it should. While there are other people that have had problems with the LNL there are a lot more that have not had problems and love the machine. So it is a quandary for me.

I don't want to be without the press for three or more weeks, but I also want it to work like it should. Any opinions or words of wisdom?
 

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Mine did the same thing most likey the indexing claws need adjustments 1/8 of a turn at a time took me for ever hope this helps

Ps if you have had to really force your press you might have damaged that ninja star looking thing on the bottom of the press
 

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OK, let me throw some ideas at you. My first press was a failure so Hornady sent me another one. It worked good but it would begin having issues like what you are having. I was frustrated with it and when it would have the problem I would begin pulling it apart piece by piecs and this is what I found.

The shell plate has a flat washer and a bolt, and that is all that keeps it attached. I thought about it long and hard and it dawned on me while at work one day. When the brass is going upward and they begin going into the dies it puts stress on the plate, and it is just enough to begin working the bolt loose and then the shell plate will shift. So I went home and carefully and slowly began cycling through the rotation and after about 25 rounds I could see the shell plate moving. Ah-HA!!! I took it apart and installed a 3/8" lock washer on top of the flat washer and I have successfully completed 1300 rounds without any issues.

If you think about it, if the shell plate can shift even a little, that will make the indexing pawls grind into the rotating arms and that will cause the timing to fall out.

Now for the primers.

First of all, the priming tubes have a straight cut end and a machined end that has a lip on it. The end with the lip needs to be down. If not, primer failure is certain.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Mine did the same thing most likey the indexing claws need adjustments 1/8 of a turn at a time took me for ever hope this helps

Ps if you have had to really force your press you might have damaged that ninja star looking thing on the bottom of the press
I have adjusted the indexing pawls all the way in and all the way out 1/16" turn at a time. The pawls have been replaced twice. They have been adjusted so much that the threads are almost worn out. The pawl screws and springs have also been replaced. The drive hub has been replaced. The spent primer tube spring has been replaced. About the only thing that has not been replaced is the primer seater punch assembly. Think I'll ask them to send me one of those before I send the press back.

I have learned to never force anything on the press. If it does not operate smoothly something is binding and I stop and correct the problem.
 

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More on the primer issues. With the primer tube removed and the spring removed from the primer shuttle, look into the primer hole and pull the shuttle back. Is the shuttle coming back far enough to allow a primer to fall. It should be coming back so that is just perfect. No further back or forward.

When I pull the handle down and the brass engages into the dies and the primer shuttle goes under the primer feeder, at that exact moment I stop,,, reach over and grab my next piece or brass, and then I begin bringing my handle up, and then I place the brass into the shell plate for the next stroke. In another words, I know that some guys fight with their presses because they go down fast and hard and then pull the handle back up quick. So, if you do that then the primer shuttle will not pause long enough for the primer to drop. By pausing for a moment, the powder drops properly and does not spill over the brass case, and the primer drops. The pause does not have to be long, but it needs to be there.

I have watched a lot of you tube videos on several progressive brand presses and I see a lot of guys making a race out of it. I can do about 300+ rounds an hour and for me I am happy with that. And most of the time, I really just kind of truck along and I suppose I do about 200+ rounds an hour because I tend to check brass quality and thing of that nature.

I will watch this thread. If you have any more problems I will try to help. There is no reason your press should not fun a full five at once.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
OK, let me throw some ideas at you. My first press was a failure so Hornady sent me another one. It worked good but it would begin having issues like what you are having. I was frustrated with it and when it would have the problem I would begin pulling it apart piece by piecs and this is what I found.

The shell plate has a flat washer and a bolt, and that is all that keeps it attached. I thought about it long and hard and it dawned on me while at work one day. When the brass is going upward and they begin going into the dies it puts stress on the plate, and it is just enough to begin working the bolt loose and then the shell plate will shift. So I went home and carefully and slowly began cycling through the rotation and after about 25 rounds I could see the shell plate moving. Ah-HA!!! I took it apart and installed a 3/8" lock washer on top of the flat washer and I have successfully completed 1300 rounds without any issues.

If you think about it, if the shell plate can shift even a little, that will make the indexing pawls grind into the rotating arms and that will cause the timing to fall out.

Now for the primers.

First of all, the priming tubes have a straight cut end and a machined end that has a lip on it. The end with the lip needs to be down. If not, primer failure is certain.
I don't have any problem with the primers feeding down the tube or into the primer slide. That has always worked without a hitch.

As for the shell holder plate - if it came loose (and it does) the plate would rise up when it rotates. That would seem to me to allow the shell holder plate with a case to pass over the elevated primer and land where it should.

However, the plate does come loose frequently and I have some lock washers on hand so I'll give that a try.
 

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One more thing. Until you get it tuned, only run one at a time and watch each step. Then once it is placing the primer every time and it is a smooth process then do all five. Each time I set a new caliber up, I run ane at a time through for a few and if I have dialed it in right then I go for five.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I resized, primed, and expanded 1,000 9mm cases in about 1.5 hours. The most time consuming part is loading the primer tube with 100 primers at a time. The actual press time is very fast, but the problem is that no matter how closely I think I watch the priming there are always 3 - 10 cases/100 that do not get primed. So I inspect each and every one before I place it in the "ready to be loaded bin".

When I start loading pre-primed cases I remove the primer cam wire so the slide does not move when the ram moves. This eliminates a lot of problems with powder getting under the slide and locking up the press. When loading pre-primed cases I can produce 100 rounds in about 15 minutes. The slowest part is loading the bullet feeder 25 at a time and checking the powder weights.

I had to slow myself down by limiting the bullet feed tube to 25. I then do a check weight, clean the shell holder plate, measure the OAL on three or four rounds, and move the loaded rounds to a box. Then start on the next 25.
 

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I resized, primed, and expanded 1,000 9mm cases in about 1.5 hours. The most time consuming part is loading the primer tube with 100 primers at a time. The actual press time is very fast, but the problem is that no matter how closely I think I watch the priming there are always 3 - 10 cases/100 that do not get primed. So I inspect each and every one before I place it in the "ready to be loaded bin".

When I start loading pre-primed cases I remove the primer cam wire so the slide does not move when the ram moves. This eliminates a lot of problems with powder getting under the slide and locking up the press. When loading pre-primed cases I can produce 100 rounds in about 15 minutes. The slowest part is loading the bullet feeder 25 at a time and checking the powder weights.

I had to slow myself down by limiting the bullet feed tube to 25. I then do a check weight, clean the shell holder plate, measure the OAL on three or four rounds, and move the loaded rounds to a box. Then start on the next 25.
I rarely get powder on my press. The two things that cause that are when the primer does not get put into the brass, and then it goes through to completion. Then you have powder flowing out of the primer hole. The other reason is if you go up and down too fast the powder misses the brass and you get a sloppy fill. The math on 1000brass/90min comes out to be 11 rounds a minute. That is quite fast, and that comes out to a piece of brass every 5.45 sec (60sec/11.11 brass). At that speed the two problems you would create are primers not falling into the primer shuttle and powder falling sloppy into the brass. Both of those issues are what contribute to your primer problem. I know on your initial step you are not powdering, but what I am getting at is when you are running the powder throw, how fast are you going?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I rarely get powder on my press. The two things that cause that are when the primer does not get put into the brass, and then it goes through to completion. Then you have powder flowing out of the primer hole. The other reason is if you go up and down too fast the powder misses the brass and you get a sloppy fill. The math on 1000brass/90min comes out to be 11 rounds a minute. That is quite fast, and that comes out to a piece of brass every 5.45 sec (60sec/11.11 brass). At that speed the two problems you would create are primers not falling into the primer shuttle and powder falling sloppy into the brass. Both of those issues are what contribute to your primer problem. I know on your initial step you are not powdering, but what I am getting at is when you are running the powder throw, how fast are you going?
Yeah, 11 rounds per minute may sound fast, but when the primer tube is loaded the rate is about 3 -4 seconds per round - add one case and one pull of the handle. The rest of the time is spent loading the primer tube.

Adding powder, bullets, seating, and crimping is about the same. One pull of the handle and everything happens at once. So loading 25 pre-primed rounds is VERY fast. That assumes that everything works as it should every time the handle is pulled and usually it does.

I get powder spills because my work table is not stable enough. I'm working on a fix but not there yet.
 

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Yeah, 11 rounds per minute may sound fast, but when the primer tube is loaded the rate is about 3 -4 seconds per round - add one case and one pull of the handle. The rest of the time is spent loading the primer tube.

Adding powder, bullets, seating, and crimping is about the same. One pull of the handle and everything happens at once. So loading 25 pre-primed rounds is VERY fast. That assumes that everything works as it should every time the handle is pulled and usually it does.

I get powder spills because my work table is not stable enough. I'm working on a fix but not there yet.
I hope you can get to where you can run all five. If not, it's pretty fast the way it is. :D
 

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I have adjusted the indexing pawls all the way in and all the way out 1/16" turn at a time. The pawls have been replaced twice. They have been adjusted so much that the threads are almost worn out. The pawl screws and springs have also been replaced. The drive hub has been replaced. The spent primer tube spring has been replaced. About the only thing that has not been replaced is the primer seater punch assembly. Think I'll ask them to send me one of those before I send the press back.

I have learned to never force anything on the press. If it does not operate smoothly something is binding and I stop and correct the problem.
The way I did it was got it close and the had to move the left claw in a bit more but if you have done all that I don't know sorry I know horady has been out standing when I needed help or parts
 

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After 5 months of TOTAL frustration with a new Hornady LNL progressive press and dozens of calls to the rude representatives at Hornady customer service, I finally gave up and bought a Dillon 550. The Dillon has run almost flawlessly for many thousands of rounds with several calibers. I don't miss the auto indexing at all.

If this is your second Hornady LNL progressive press and it will not run, you probably have little confidence in the set up and this is critical to successful reloading.

Please take my advice - Dump the Hornady LNL and move on to something that runs reliably. There is a reason that 95% of professional competitive shooters use Dillon presses.

Unfortunately, I learned this the hard way.

Cut your losses and run from the LNL.
 

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Put a very very little dab of white lithium grease under the shell plate on them 2 little balls each time you change the plate. There are 2 screws under the sub plate (one on each side) on the ram. Pull handle down and you will see them. Take them out and just put 2 drops of oil in the screw holes up next to the rotation assmbly. Replace screws run the ram a few times and repeat. I had the same problem. Now this does not fix it right away but as you use the press it will start do go away, it will take a few hundred rds to work the oil in but it will help.One thing that i have found is that on the primer slide there are a few burrs. Take some emery cloth and remove them this will also polish the surface and allow it to slide freely. From time to time there will be a build up of crud that will not let the primer slide all the way up into place. i use a can of compressed air (for electronics) and before i fill the primer tube each time, i pull the primer slide back so i can blow just a small blast of air down in there. This blows that crud out.( brass shavings and burnt powder coming out of the primer pocket) This is in the spot where the primer button is in the sub plate. I hope this helps ya out!
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Put a very very little dab of white lithium grease under the shell plate on them 2 little balls each time you change the plate. There are 2 screws under the sub plate (one on each side) on the ram. Pull handle down and you will see them. Take them out and just put 2 drops of oil in the screw holes up next to the rotation assmbly. Replace screws run the ram a few times and repeat. I had the same problem. Now this does not fix it right away but as you use the press it will start do go away, it will take a few hundred rds to work the oil in but it will help.One thing that i have found is that on the primer slide there are a few burrs. Take some emery cloth and remove them this will also polish the surface and allow it to slide freely. From time to time there will be a build up of crud that will not let the primer slide all the way up into place. i use a can of compressed air (for electronics) and before i fill the primer tube each time, i pull the primer slide back so i can blow just a small blast of air down in there. This blows that crud out.( brass shavings and burnt powder coming out of the primer pocket) This is in the spot where the primer button is in the sub plate. I hope this helps ya out!
If you are talking about the pawl adjustment screws I have done that and a little more. I removed the pawl screws, pawls, and the pawl springs. Then used CRC and a Q-tip to clean and degrease the holes and the parts. Then used a dry lube in the holes and on the pawls. I also replaced the pawl screws with stainless steel screws. Could not really tell any difference in the indexing.

I started out using white lithium grease on shell plate detent bearings, but it was resulting in a build up of crud. So I degreased the sub-plate, shell plate and used a dry lube on both. That seems to keep everything cleaner.

I don't have any problems with the primer slide or tube. I used 600 then 2000 grit emory cloth to deburr and polish both sides of the slide, the bottom of the primer tube housing, and the slide channel. Then used dry lube on all the parts. I also cleaned up and polished the primer seater punch. So the primer delivery and seating works well when the shell holder plate lines up like it should. The problem is the shell plate will never line up with out a (for lack of a better term) "studder step". I have to bring the ram down, stop, then move the ram just a little in either direction and the shell holder will snap into position. It only does that when there is a primer in the primer punch and a case in the shell plate. All other times it lines up perfectly on every stroke.

I've asked Hornady to send a new primer seater punch. That is about the only thing I have not replaced. If the punch itself or the punch spring is too long by just a little it might be causing the problem.
 

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Generally, I've been pleased with my LNL. I did have some issues with reliability of the small primer mechanism and did some polishing with emery cloth on the parts. In the interim, since I have a good RCBS universal priming tool, I just primed cases with that in a separate operation. I then do all the rest of the steps in the LNL and it has been flawless.

Since I rarely load more than about 200 rounds per week, I have been OK with my process of priming with the RCBS tool. I just sit and prime cases then set them aside for loading whenever I get to it.
 

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i'm sorry you are having problems.. but boy am I glad I use single stage press setups.

have read so many ( have to send it back / get something else ) horror stories in the last few months about progressives .. yikes.

I i got 3 singles that work flawlesly... guess it's gonna stay that way for some time... :)
 

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I find the odds of recieving two presses misbehaving as described over the past few months highly unlikely. If indeed the Hornady LNL AP systems have been manufactured this poorly and so frequently acting up on customers ( I cannot find such horror stories as this anywhere on the internet) I for one, would be dismounting the LNL AP from my bench and listing it for sale in short order. Sorry to hear the frustration once again.
 

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If you are talking about the pawl adjustment screws I have done that and a little more. I removed the pawl screws, pawls, and the pawl springs. Then used CRC and a Q-tip to clean and degrease the holes and the parts. Then used a dry lube in the holes and on the pawls. I also replaced the pawl screws with stainless steel screws. Could not really tell any difference in the indexing.

I started out using white lithium grease on shell plate detent bearings, but it was resulting in a build up of crud. So I degreased the sub-plate, shell plate and used a dry lube on both. That seems to keep everything cleaner.

I don't have any problems with the primer slide or tube. I used 600 then 2000 grit emory cloth to deburr and polish both sides of the slide, the bottom of the primer tube housing, and the slide channel. Then used dry lube on all the parts. I also cleaned up and polished the primer seater punch. So the primer delivery and seating works well when the shell holder plate lines up like it should. The problem is the shell plate will never line up with out a (for lack of a better term) "studder step". I have to bring the ram down, stop, then move the ram just a little in either direction and the shell holder will snap into position. It only does that when there is a primer in the primer punch and a case in the shell plate. All other times it lines up perfectly on every stroke.

I've asked Hornady to send a new primer seater punch. That is about the only thing I have not replaced. If the punch itself or the punch spring is too long by just a little it might be causing the problem.
Here is a pick of the two screws. The other one is on the other side. It will be an alen wench. They are tight.
 

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First off I am using the pre LNL Hornady progressive press. I have 2 mounted to my bench and purchased them new.
When setting a press up or if there is a timing issue I have found that inserting one case only is helpful as described earlier. Also, moving the handle slow and smoothly. This way you can detect exactly where in the ram stroke the issue is.
I hate to hear others say that they have gotten rude customer service from Hornady as this is opposite from all of my experiences. At the SHOT show Hornady has some of the nicest people in the industry in their booth, cant comment on this year as I am not alloud to attend... thanks to my wife :)
 
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