Issue with AR feeding

Discussion in 'Large-Bore/Small-Bore Rifle/Shotgun' started by mjforster, Apr 12, 2009.

  1. mjforster

    mjforster New Member

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    I just got back from the range and I had some issues with my AR. It's a bushmaster M4. I loaded up the first mag and had no problems at all with it feeding. When I switched to the next mag it would fire and eject the brass but not load another round. I tried about 4 other mags and had the exact same problem. A few times it just jammed up but for the most part it never even tried to feed. So I took it apart and it was pretty dirty. When I put it back together it worked good again and then the mag after that one started failing to feed again. Just curious if anyone has ever had this problem and do you think it's that the gun is dirty, the magazines or maybe even the ammo? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
     
  2. LurpyGeek

    LurpyGeek Active Member

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    A few questions...

    How old is your M4? How many rounds through it?

    What kind of ammo? What brand / capacity magazines?

    What kind of cleaning / lubrication do you normally do?
     

  3. mjforster

    mjforster New Member

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    The gun is less than a year old. I have a total of maybe 500 rounds through it. I typically clean it after I shoot it everytime. I took it out a couple times this week without time to clean it yet so im thinking its just dirty but not really sure. I was shooting wolf 55 grain fmj since that is the only stuff I can find around here. I have shot it in the past and have never had any problems what so ever. Also the magazines are all 30 rounders and I have a few AR-Stoner mags, a bushmaster mag and a few cheap used ones I picked up at a gun show. I have never had any problems with any of the mags before and I tried some of each kind. Im really thinking the gun is just dirty but I just get worried that maybe there is something I am doing wrong.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2009
  4. LurpyGeek

    LurpyGeek Active Member

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    Wolf is very dirty and the steel case doesn't expand and create a good seal between the case and the barrel, so you get some carbon blown back into the chamber. This is especially bad in an AR because the direct impingement system will send junk back into your action. You can shoot wolf in an AR, you just need to make sure you give it an extra good cleaning after.

    The other thing that might also be giving you some trouble is that wolf is usually a bit underpowered. This might cause it to fire and eject the casing but not strip a new round.
     
  5. mjforster

    mjforster New Member

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    ok. I will try really scrubbing it and take it back out later this week to make sure that was it. Thanks for your help.
     
  6. LurpyGeek

    LurpyGeek Active Member

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    I hope it was actually helpful and makes a difference. There are people on here who are much more knowledgeable than I, but I like to provide aid where I can.
     
  7. cycloneman

    cycloneman Well-Known Member

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    well that's interesting. this is why i have a love hate relationship with these rifles. the following may or may not be your problem. this is just an observation. i had one that gave me problems like that no matter what i put in it. just like you after one clip it started. i learned to keep it clean and keep it wet. some of these guns need lub. the bolt assembly gets hot and tends to give you this problem. HK took and redisigned the gas system and they have developed a rifle that can shoot 100 rnds without getting the bolt hot. I saw it on tv and they say it is a very reliable weapon. Having said that i would find a good heavy lub. Pass on the remmington type oils that are light weight. Try to find something like the old LSA that will stick to the parts. The remmington stuff just burns off. if this helps then you may want to consider having your bolt carrier polished. This will change the surface of the assembly and aid in the sliding.

    What i have said is not law. just a possible of many things. check you gas rings and gas tube. get them clean also. i suspect that the bolt is not fully moving to the rear to pick up another round. lack of gas pressure and friction are the probable cause. good luck.
     
  8. mjforster

    mjforster New Member

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    I have never had any problem like this before but it did get better when I took the bolt out of the gun and wiped it down a little with what I had with me. It did seem to be quite dry and now that I think of it the gun sat in the case all winter and I not put anymore oil on it before I took it out. Thanks for you help.
     
  9. Crpdeth

    Crpdeth Well-Known Member

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    Just my experience here, but I bet that tossing those el cheapos will curb a lot of your problems as well...


    Crpdeth
     
  10. Tony22-250

    Tony22-250 New Member

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    Have you considered converting from direct impingement to gas piston last i checked bushmaster made a conversion kit that was relativley cheep. Gives your AR, AK reliability cant go wrong there.
     
  11. bluesea112

    bluesea112 Active Member

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    First, Wolf and Barnaul are not loaded with enough powder to properly work the bolt on an AR. Compound this with the fact they use steel cases that do not expand like brass to seal the chamber. A lot of gas pressure is lost of because of this. I would bet that you will not have a single problem if you shoot Remington or Winchester cartridges.
     
  12. delta13soultaker

    delta13soultaker New Member

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    Check your gas rings real quick. With the bolt/bolt carrier fully assembled, pull the bolt to it's furthest position (if it's lubed right a flick of the wrist will do this). Next set the bolt carrier vertically on a flat surface like a table. Bolt pointed at the ceiling. If the bolt falls on it's own into the carrier, get a gunsmith to check/replace your rings.

    Magazines. Slap the mag in real hard. If your hand don't hurt you ain't doing it right. Next...If it fails to feed, grab near the bottom and pull it fairly hard toward you. (I saw a S&W M&P M4 that would only feed with steel HK mags. Aluminum mags were so light they seated wrong to feed.) Mark your mags to ID which ones are good vs bad.

    Next check is lube. Miltec-1 is awesome. CLP is pretty good. 3-in-1 oil from the auto store works great. Rem Oil...some people swear by it and some curse it...for a direct gas system it may be a bit light.

    Ammo...not to beat a dead horse but try some better ammunition than Wolf before you toss the baby out with the bath water.
     
  13. LurpyGeek

    LurpyGeek Active Member

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    Great info, Delta.


    The AR piston conversions I have seen are not cheap. The full rifle is the same price as most brand new modern full piston rifles out there (Sig 556, Robinson XCR, etc.)

    Also, I've heard that there are some issues with piston AR systems since the AR wasn't originally designed to use one. There have been reports that the pistons are too skinny and weak due to the small profile of the Stoner platform. The other big issue is that on a D.I. system, the gasses enter the reciever and push the bolt carrier group uniformly while on a piston AR, the piston pushes only the top of the carrier causing the carrier to tip and rub / wear on the bottom of the buffer tube.

    Does anyone have a piston AR, or has anyone seen examples of this "carrier tilt"? Again, this is just hearsay at this point.
     
  14. glocknut

    glocknut Active Member

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    a mere 500 rounds is nowhere near "broke in" yet... Those AR rifles are tight when they are new.
    Very, very few firearms perform their best right out of the box. Most need to be fired a few times before they reach their reliable phase...

    mike
    gn
     
  15. TOOHSOTKIL

    TOOHSOTKIL Active Member

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    While I agree with some of the above, some I don`t.
    Wolf is dirty and Wolf uses steel cases on it`s lower end.
    The AR platform is way over gassed, as in maybe 100%
    I have several styles and makers of these rifles and all will digest the lowest fodder on the market.

    I will tell you a fair amount of Wolf ammo will foul the gas tube, replace it and you may solve your problem.