Just inherited an old shotgun
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Wow...you have a very nice example of a German combination gun with an extra set of double gun barrels. Proofed and probably made in Suhl, Thuringia and retailed by L. Damm Barmen who is quite possibly not the maker. Made "for the trade" meaning Barmen possibly ordered it from a maker in Suhl. Witten Excelsior is the steel from which the barrels are made, good stuff. 16 is the bore and the circled 16 indicates 2 1/2 in. chambers rather than the more modern 2 3/4 and the W on the left barrel simply indicates that it was choked but it's never mentioned what the choke is. 2 1/2 in. ammo is available from RST and others.
The right barrel of the set that is a rifle appears to be for the 9.3 X 72R Deutsche cartridge, a very popular cartridge of the era for combination guns and drillings. Sellier & Belloit still make ammunition for it that may fit and as the rifle is Nitro proofed it should be safe to fire but should be checked by a gunsmith competent in old German firearms. I can't quite make out the stamps on the side of the rifle barrel but that is the bullet weight and type for which the rifle was proofed. In 9.3 X 72R it is generally a bullet of about 200 grs. weight and in your case was a steel bullet. The combination gun barrels have the typical for the era claw type scope mounts. It also has the Greener crossbolt, that extension with the hole in it that extends from the rear of the barrels and the corresponding bolt in the top of the receiver. It also has the side clips, those extensions on the sides of the bosses. Very strong.
As there is no date code stamped, that I can see, I'm fairly certain that puts it pre-1921. Yours is somewhat rare in that it has two sets of barrels. All that is left to complete the ensemble is the claw rings and a period scope to go in them. The rings can be made but unfortunately they are pricey. The gun is a fine example of German craftsmanship of the era and, even today. You didn't mention it so my hope is that you are not thinking of having it re-finished. Please don't. If you do you will remove approximately 1/2 the value and the world will suffer the loss of yet another fine, original German firearm. I'm certain you're quite proud to own it, you should be. First of all for the men it came from, your Dad and Grandfather, and secondly for what it is. Again....Wow!!! Very nice!!!!! Congrats!!!
The right barrel of the set that is a rifle appears to be for the 9.3 X 72R Deutsche cartridge, a very popular cartridge of the era for combination guns and drillings. Sellier & Belloit still make ammunition for it that may fit and as the rifle is Nitro proofed it should be safe to fire but should be checked by a gunsmith competent in old German firearms. I can't quite make out the stamps on the side of the rifle barrel but that is the bullet weight and type for which the rifle was proofed. In 9.3 X 72R it is generally a bullet of about 200 grs. weight and in your case was a steel bullet. The combination gun barrels have the typical for the era claw type scope mounts. It also has the Greener crossbolt, that extension with the hole in it that extends from the rear of the barrels and the corresponding bolt in the top of the receiver. It also has the side clips, those extensions on the sides of the bosses. Very strong.
As there is no date code stamped, that I can see, I'm fairly certain that puts it pre-1921. Yours is somewhat rare in that it has two sets of barrels. All that is left to complete the ensemble is the claw rings and a period scope to go in them. The rings can be made but unfortunately they are pricey. The gun is a fine example of German craftsmanship of the era and, even today. You didn't mention it so my hope is that you are not thinking of having it re-finished. Please don't. If you do you will remove approximately 1/2 the value and the world will suffer the loss of yet another fine, original German firearm. I'm certain you're quite proud to own it, you should be. First of all for the men it came from, your Dad and Grandfather, and secondly for what it is. Again....Wow!!! Very nice!!!!! Congrats!!!
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Very nice German "Büchsflinte" with interchangeable SxS 16/65 shotgun barrels.
L. Damm was the retailer in Barmen, since 1929 belonging to Wuppertal. This special gun was manufactured between 1912 and 1925 in Suhl /Germany. The gunmaker is not shown, probably the sign of a dolphin under 9,3 x 72 d belongs to him. The barrels for rifle /shotgun combination are made from "Krupp Flusstahl Essen" (Krupp fluid steel), caliber is 9,3 x 72 R d. The d means "Dornheim", the strongest cartridge of this caliber with 685m/s muzzle velocity. The barrel was proofed with 2,35g (36,266gr) G.B.P. ("Gewehrblättchenpulver", special powder before nitro), also proofed with nitro powder past 1912 (crown over N). The bore of the rifle barrel is 8,7mm. 23847 is the serial number. Between 1912 and 1925 the proof date of Suhl was not shown.
The Barrels of the shotgun 16/65mm were made from special fluid steel "Witten Excelsior", another famous gun steel maker in Witten/Ruhr.
L. Damm was the retailer in Barmen, since 1929 belonging to Wuppertal. This special gun was manufactured between 1912 and 1925 in Suhl /Germany. The gunmaker is not shown, probably the sign of a dolphin under 9,3 x 72 d belongs to him. The barrels for rifle /shotgun combination are made from "Krupp Flusstahl Essen" (Krupp fluid steel), caliber is 9,3 x 72 R d. The d means "Dornheim", the strongest cartridge of this caliber with 685m/s muzzle velocity. The barrel was proofed with 2,35g (36,266gr) G.B.P. ("Gewehrblättchenpulver", special powder before nitro), also proofed with nitro powder past 1912 (crown over N). The bore of the rifle barrel is 8,7mm. 23847 is the serial number. Between 1912 and 1925 the proof date of Suhl was not shown.
The Barrels of the shotgun 16/65mm were made from special fluid steel "Witten Excelsior", another famous gun steel maker in Witten/Ruhr.
Wow! Thanks for the info guys! I'm stoked to have a peice of family history so I have no intentions of selling it but would be interested to now an approximate value for insurance purposes. Is that something a gunsmith would do? Can anybody suggest a good gunsmith in the Calgary, Alberta, Canada area by chance for these types of guns? Would really like to get it looked over as my dad never used it and doesn't recall his father ever using it either.
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I have to stand corrected. I thought the "d" was Deutsche but as soon as I saw Dornheim I recognized my error. Thanks Marble! I missed the hints at Krupp also, good catch Marble, I really had to look for it but I did find it!!!
Br, I have no idea the exchange rate between Canada and the US so take that into consideration. From me, down here, a loose estimate would be around $2,000.00. You see some for less but not much and usually higher for one in the condition that one appears to be in. I do believe the two sets of barrels worth a premium but I'm sorry I don't know how much to add....and I'd be hunting with that gun!!!!
Br, I have no idea the exchange rate between Canada and the US so take that into consideration. From me, down here, a loose estimate would be around $2,000.00. You see some for less but not much and usually higher for one in the condition that one appears to be in. I do believe the two sets of barrels worth a premium but I'm sorry I don't know how much to add....and I'd be hunting with that gun!!!!
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You can try to ask him, he comes from Germany, now living in Alberta and has excellent knowledge about German hunting guns.
https://forum.wildundhund.de/member.php?32209-AlbertanLuger
Or try it here:
http://www.buechsenmachergilde.de/Mitglied_Martin_Hagn.html
https://forum.wildundhund.de/member.php?32209-AlbertanLuger
Or try it here:
http://www.buechsenmachergilde.de/Mitglied_Martin_Hagn.html
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