[nyker]

Here is one for the Pros - please help me ID this. I'd love to know any more history about it, when made, use, estimated range of value either "as is" or subject to any refurbishing/repair.

From what I can tell, it is a percussion S/S made by Philly based American gunsmith John Krider, damascus barrels. I am guessing mid-late 1800s but don't know how to refine that date more accurate than that. Nice engravings are on metal side lock plates, under forearm, around screws, metal work on stock, on and around trigger guard and sides of hammers. One hammer had apparently been broken and welded at some point in time and needs to be repaired.

The only mfger marking I can discern is JOHN KRIDER & Co. on the side. (I have seen other Krider S/S say "KRIDER" or "JKRIDER" or "JOHN KRIDER" but not JOHN KRIDER & Co. The top of the barrels are marked with PHILADA, assume meaning it was made in Philadelphia. Barrels have single bead sight, maybe brass.

The overall length is ~44", barrels are just over 28". Wood stock appears to be walnut and is in decent shape, aged patina. Metal on gun is worn a bit and has some grime
from the last century but no heavy rust. Ram rod has small crack but otherwise has nice finish, no idea what kid of wood..hickory? Just a guess.
Butt plate is metal with two screws, no discernable markings. There is a small metal plate in front of the checkering with some writing on it, but can't quite make it out.

The checkering on the stock is in pretty good shape not much worn, but interestingly doesn't have the often seen sharp angular pattern behind the lock plate,
but a rounded pattern following the the curvature of the lock plate.

I've attached some shots, hope they are clear enough.

Thanks all

in advance!

 

[nyker]

One more shot showing muzzle/ramrod

 

[sharps4590]

Griz-1 sent me a list of USA Gunmakers and I checked for the Kriders. It appears there was two. As the name seems German to me a son following a father into the trade would have been common at that time. Given the evident operating period of John H. Krider, 1820-1870, and that almost completely encompasses the percussion period, I'd surmise John H. either made your double gun or it was made in his shop. I wouldn't lose any sleep over the "& Co." The rounded boss of the lock plate is pretty much a meaningless thing, merely one style over another. The escutcheon at the wrist probably had an owners initials at one time.

One thing I am curious about. The barrels have a decidedly British look to them, especially with what appears to be what was called a "blow out plug." The engraving also looks as if it could be British....or Continental. US makers often sourced barrel sets and locks from Britain and Belgium, and entire firearms. They would stamp, cut or engrave whatever the buyer wanted, wherever it was wanted on the firearm. If you would, pull the barrel key and lift the barrels away from the stock and see if there is any proof marks under there, don't forget to remove the ramrod. And, the barrel key might be captive with a pin through a slot so it isn't lost. If it resists complete removal, don't force it. Another thing, flat top checkering was very much the style for British and Continental makers of the era. Your dates might be as close as anyone will be able to get.

A GOOD gunsmith will be able to clean up the hammer and re-weld it and file to shape. Re-engraving it will be a gunsmith to gunsmith thing. A "fake" patina can be applied with various chemicals. Muriatic acid is the one I hear most mentioned BUT..I don't know !!

 

[Grizzley1]

It does have a British look to it including the stub twist barrels. The hammer could be repaired by a competent smith skilled in 'patina restoring' broken parts. Cost of such a repair would be whatever the smith wants to charge, it's a skill most modern smiths won't have and the cost to repair would likely not be recovered in gained value. If the insides of the bores were still in shootable condition, and I see rust and corrosion, so likely they are not, the cost might let you break even. It looks like silver braze in the pictures rather than a weld, but it's hard to tell from a picture over the internet.

 

[LIKTOSHOOT]

Very nice inletting if nothing else.

 

[TRAP55]

Krider "built" guns, but a lot his parts did come from England. Some of the barrel ribs will have the Philly mark, as well as Brit proofs. Most of the lockworks on those were made by Manton in England. If you know that name, you know Krider quality was above par. Later when they sold cartridge shotguns, the actions were made by Purdey.
Nyker, I don't know if these had a model designation. I dug up one that's identical to yours in 8ga, called a "Market Gun" by the seller, but I've only seen that used as a generic term of large bore shotguns used for commercial hunting.

 

[Grizzley1]

A GOOD gunsmith will be able to clean up the hammer and re-weld it and file to shape. Re-engraving it will be a gunsmith to gunsmith thing. A "fake" patina can be applied with various chemicals. Muriatic acid is the one I hear most mentioned BUT..I don't know !!

I do know a man who would have the skillset needed to weld it up or make a new one by hand and make it look like it was a well preserved 150 year old hammer but he generally doesn't do a lot of this kind of work anymore. What he uses to create a new "patina" on a newly made part on an antique, I have no idea. I have seen some of his repair work and you'd never know it had been repaired if you didn't know in advance that he'd fixed it.

 

[TRAP55]

I forgot to add, if you are searching "Krider S/S" for info, what you get will be limited. FYI on "gunspeak", S/S = Single Shot, SS = Stainless Steel, and SxS = Side by Side. Just using "Krider SxS" will result in a lot of cartridge shotguns too. Krider sold all kinds of guns. Narrow it down with "Krider SxS Percussion Shotgun" or use BP in place of percussion.

 

[sharps4590]

It isn't a Market Gun as a model. They had no model name or number.. That was a generic name for any large bore, 10 bore up to one inch, used by market hunters until such hunting for waterfowl was made illegal.