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Discussion Starter #1
First as you all know I do not reload as you can tell by my question.
I was looking up the FPS for the 25-45 round that I have decided to use Blitz King style (They have a few different loads).
It says word for word.
Load #1- CCI 400 small rifle primer and Sierra 70 grain Blitz King .257 bullet, Powder H335
Maximum load: 30.0 grains- maximum velocity of 3100 fps (needs a powder drop tube).
Load #2- CCI small rifle primer and 70 grain Blitz King .257 bullet, Powder A2200-
Maximum load: 27 grains - expected velocity 3100 fps.
So they both come in the same box cover.
What is the difference between them?.
Will both shoot the same?.
Why 30.00 grains for one kind of powder and 27 grains for the other?.
They only make one kind of Blitz King type (Other names for other kinds of ammo)
Why Maximum velocity fps for one and expected fps for the other?.
Why does it say CCI 400 and the other shows no numbers?.
To those of you that do this they may seem like simple answers but I don't understand.
Thanks for you help in understanding this it is all foreign to me.
 

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Powders very tremendously from one to the next. Primers don't make as much difference from my personal experience.
As both loads are the same fps that means pressure is the same. So I doubt any shooter could distinguish one from the other.
 

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CCI gives their primers numbers. Winchester primers are just called SP (small pistol) or LR (large rifle) or like that. CCI uses numbers. Small rifle is 400, small rifle Magnum is 450, small pistol is 500, small pistol Magnum is 550, etcetera.

https://www.cci-ammunition.com/reloading/primers/
 

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So if they pack up boxes with both loads in it I will not see, feel, hear a difference in the shots?.
At levels that close together, you probably won't hear or feel a difference but, you might see a difference in group size.

Mike, you kinda asked a mid-level experience question with, as you mentioned, a novice's experience. Lotsa variables come into play.
 

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All propellants have a burn rate. However, different tests give different results.
There is open burn rate tests and closed "bomb" burn rate tests.
So, get any someone's burn rate chart and you'll see all the powders spread out over a wide range. Pistol and shotgun powders burn fast to medium. Rifle powders burn from medium to very slow.
You could take two powders, pour a half inch of powder into the V in a 10' V-bar and time from burn at 1' mark to 9' mark and repeat for the other powder. You'll find, within the test errors, that the two powders burn at a different rate. Now, imagine pouring in the powder and sealing the V-bar and igniting the powder. The pressure/temperature of the sealed "bomb" would effect the burn rate. In fact, the two powders could switch places.
So, don't think that you can load Bullseye to the same weight as Rotumbo and get the same result. Rotumbo might produce 60ksi, while the same amount of Bullseye would produce a killer pipe bomb.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
OK thanks for the responses but as Alpo said I am at below novice in reloading so it took a conversation with Todd (Who can speak moron to a moron) to get me to understand some things (I am sure he wanted to reach thru the phone and slap me) but he did good.
He wants me to fill a spent cartrage with water weighing it before and after and tell him the numbers I come up with and he said he will look up on a chart (Of some kind) and give me more info. that I am sure i will not understand but after some time of explaining in moron talk I will.
I am just concerned that my shots will not group if these loads are mixed in a box.
And how much difference they could be.
I understand how aggravating it can be to explain to a moron about something you know inside and out.
Ever try to explain how to fix a gun to someone who only knows how to load aim and shoot a gun but never have broken one open. I do it allot here on TFF so I do understand.
Thank you for your help.
 

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OK thanks for the responses but as Alpo said I am at below novice in reloading so it took a conversation with Todd (Who can speak moron to a moron) to get me to understand some things (I am sure he wanted to reach thru the phone and slap me) but he did good.
He wants me to fill a spent cartrage with water weighing it before and after and tell him the numbers I come up with and he said he will look up on a chart (Of some kind) and give me more info. that I am sure i will not understand but after some time of explaining in moron talk I will.
I am just concerned that my shots will not group if these loads are mixed in a box.
And how much difference they could be.
I understand how aggravating it can be to explain to a moron about something you know inside and out.
Ever try to explain how to fix a gun to someone who only knows how to load aim and shoot a gun but never have broken one open. I do it allot here on TFF so I do understand.
Thank you for your help.
Mike, I'd bet that if you ever read the first section of say Lyman's 47th reloading book, you'd be amazed at how much you'd discover and questions you now have would make sense.
 

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So if they pack up boxes with both loads in it I will not see, feel, hear a difference in the shots?.
Nope. Won't see or feel any difference.
Same bullet weight, and same fps. You would not be able to tell them apart.
Reloading can become something that borders on alchemy. With many contributing factors that can cause differences from one load to the next most of of mere mortals turn to feet per second to measure the differences. As the only real difference between the two loads is the powder used, and each powder is adjusted to produce the same fps the two rounds are interchangeable.
 

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Mike, you asked a very good question. There are so many variables in loading cartridges that one simple answer has no hope of covering. That is why people who reload depend on reloading manuals and carefully follow the amounts/components almost to-the-letter.

When you were asked to fill a case with water and weight it - this is to establish "case capacity". This is another of the many variables. Powder types vary as to how fast they burn and how much pressure they generate. That is why reloading manuals use data tested and proven in laboratories with special testing equipment and only then published in reloading manuals for specific calibers and components.

You did better then I was able to. I haven't even found ".25-45" listed in any of my manuals. I'd go so far as to call you a wizard for finding reloading dies for such a critter. Exactly what are you preparing to load for and who the heck made it?
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Mike, you asked a very good question. There are so many variables in loading cartridges that one simple answer has no hope of covering. That is why people who reload depend on reloading manuals and carefully follow the amounts/components almost to-the-letter.

When you were asked to fill a case with water and weight it - this is to establish "case capacity". This is another of the many variables. Powder types vary as to how fast they burn and how much pressure they generate. That is why reloading manuals use data tested and proven in laboratories with special testing equipment and only then published in reloading manuals for specific calibers and components.

You did better then I was able to. I haven't even found ".25-45" listed in any of my manuals. I'd go so far as to call you a wizard for finding reloading dies for such a critter. Exactly what are you preparing to load for and who the heck made it?
I built a AR-15 .25-45 made by Sharps Rifle Co. in WY. (There is a thread about it). I believe they are the only ones that make it and the ammo. You can buy brass, Dies, and bullets from them.
They sell the barrels, bolts and even have some guns they build. I built mine from parts. I got the info. from there site in the load data section. I believe this a new cal. not been around for very long. I just ordered a case of these and it cost me (A new dealer for them) $15 a box.
 

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I'm always interested in new calibers. But my first question is always "what does it do that existing calibers don't?" The 300blk made perfect sense because to providers a bit more punch in the AR15 platform. I understand it was originally designed with special forces in mind. But I thought it would work equally well for harvesting hogs.
what niche does the 25-45 fill?
 

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What you typed word for word sounds like reloading data.

Such data comes from different sources. Bullet companies as well as powder makers all do reloading and publish their work. Hence the difference in wording and specifications
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I'm always interested in new calibers. But my first question is always "what does it do that existing calibers don't?" The 300blk made perfect sense because to providers a bit more punch in the AR15 platform. I understand it was originally designed with special forces in mind. But I thought it would work equally well for harvesting hogs.
what niche does the 25-45 fill?

I have used .223 in USMC and there after and did not want one.
I have a .50 AR (I built it when it first came out years ago) I built that for hunting so I do not need a large cal. and when I saw this And sense I have to have the "New" cal. when they come out I got the barrel and bolt group.
I had the striped lower and upper sitting here doing nothing and wanted a new AR.
And when I talked to them (Sharps) and they made me a offer on being a dealer for them in NY (The only one in NY) and said they would send me the barrel and bolt group and 6 boxes for free it was no choice.
The 25-45 is bigger and longer then the .223 so it hits harder (More damage) and sense I wanted to build a gun for self defense only and did not want a .223 and the parts I needed to build one were free it was a easy choice.
And sense there are few out there the ammo is available (Just got one case for $150) and have another case on order.
The 25-45 fps is the same as .223 but a larger bullet so a "More damage" bullet.
I was asked the same thing years ago when I was building the .50 and was the only one around that had one now they are all over. So the 25-45 could be the same.
I have already sold 8 25-45 builds and have interest from many more even LEO it was a money thing for me.
Not to be a smart butt but the niche it fills is.
I wanted one.
It is making me money.
AND
I always have to have what others do not have.
 

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I always have to have what others do not have.

Me too....but it's usually dated from around WWI.
 
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