Range time with chrono...FINALLY!!!

Discussion in 'Large-Bore/Small-Bore Rifle/Shotgun' started by sharps4590, Apr 1, 2020.

  1. sharps4590

    sharps4590 Well-Known Member

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    Since last fall I have been wanting to set up the chronograph and get numbers on what became 6 rifles. I only got to 5. Today all the stars aligned, (read that weather and wife cooperated!!..:D) and it happened. I got the chrono and targets set up and lined up by 9:00 and settled behind my Husqvarna 9.3 X 57 and the fun commenced!!!

    I ran across the screens:
    Husqvarna on a Mod. 96 Masuer in 9.3 X 57, 265 gr. cast bullet over 35 grs. of IMR-3031. 1951 fps avg. velocity. The same bullet over 15 gr. of Unique and a filler gave 1456 fps. One is about as accurate as the other, not enough difference to note. I screwed up and didn't reset the chrono for the different loads so have no idea as to the rest of the numbers. Hey, it's been a long time since I played with my chrono!

    The Vierordt double rifle in sort of 8 X 65R Brenneke was the one I wanted to see. Not displeased either! 200 gr. jacketed bullet over 38 grs. of H-4895 gave and average of 2047 fps for both barrels. The left barrel was quite a bit slower than the right barrel, which is backwards but, the left chamber is the one that was cobbled the worst. Accuracy opened up a little bit but not enough to matter, just enough to notice. I didn't bother to try to get the rest of the numbers for each barrel. Average velocity and accuracy were both more than satisfactory.

    My sweet little 1908 Mannlicher/Schoenauer in 8 X 56 M/S cartridge. I was curious about this load and it is ok. 20.5 grs. of IMR-4227 and a foam filler gave an average of 1680 fps. I'd like to see that closer to 1800 and there's plenty of room to do it. Accuracy was great as was AD, SD, and ES.

    My Haenel/Rasch 1890 sporter in 9 X 57 has become a real favorite. I like 35 cal./9mm anyway and this one just makes it easier to like it. Two loads, two bullets, one powder. 200 gr. RCBS 35-200 and an Accurate 240 gr. mold. 34 grs. of IMR-3031 under the 200 and 35 grs. under the 240. 1895 fps for the 200 grs. and real good average deviation of 5.6, extreme spread of 21 fps and standard deviation of 8.3 fps. Now, how's this for an average velocity, 1911 for the 240 gr. bullet. Numbers weren't bad but the group wasn't nearly so good as the 200 gr. bullet.

    Ok pdk, this one's for you buddy! The Wilhelm Brenneke '98 Mauser in 7 X 64 Brenneke. 178 gr. cast RCBS bullet over the minimum 25 grs. of Reloder 7. The barrel is 28 inches on this rifle and I expected that extra length to show up in velocities. It did. Average velocity was 1965 fps with excellent accuracy, (LONG sight radius!), 15 fps spread, 5.2 average deviation and 6.2 standard deviation.

    That constituted my morning...and it was great!!! This afternoon I stretched the legs on my 3 MG's....which was almost as much fun....boy I'd hate to have to choose between the two, rifles or cars. Sure was a pleasant day. Now if I could get my flippin' garden tiller out of the hospital!
     
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  2. tuckerd1

    tuckerd1 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator Supporting Member

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    Very good report. I'm glad you had such a great day.
     

  3. mudman35962

    mudman35962 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    WOW!! i said WOW!!! still got that smile too i bet.

    rick
     
  4. sharps4590

    sharps4590 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Don, Rick, it was good!. You guys getting anywhere with your rollers or is that project wrapped up? I forget where you and Rick were with them.
     
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  5. tuckerd1

    tuckerd1 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator Supporting Member

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    I was looking at my roller yesterday and the bullets I have loaded and casted. I need to get back on it. I got side tracked by a LR-308 build and horses.
     
  6. mudman35962

    mudman35962 Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    spring!! i did load 10 cases yesterday late. spent all day today with tree people. two 60 year old sycamores with dead tops had to take them both down. i hate to kill old trees. time will come to get back to it, when???

    rick
     
  7. PRR1957

    PRR1957 Well-Known Member

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    sharps4590,
    What brand and model chronograph do you have ?

    I would like one of the Labradar chronograph, but $560-$600 is a bit pricy for me rite now. Many moons ago, I and a friend co owned the least expensive model Chrony and my friend lent it to another friend of his who shot a bullet trough it. It never was replaced. Do not lend out your chronograph unless $ collateral is taken as a deposit ! :mad:
     
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  8. sharps4590

    sharps4590 Well-Known Member

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    My roller was the 6th I wanted to chrono. A week ago or so I did load and shoot 5 rounds from it loaded with Reloder 7 and the 170 gr. Lee bullet. Shot quite high but it was a good group.

    I have a BUNCH of red oaks that are going to die over the next 10 years...or more. 'Course they're in the woods and I need the firewood.

    PRR, I killed my first chronograph and it too was a Chrony. Pretty amazing what 520 grs. of bullet launched by 110 grs. of BP does to one at 10 ft..

    The one I have now is a Pact and I think it's a Model 1? I think it has to be 25-28 years old. I'll keep and use it....unless I shoot it too...
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
  9. PRR1957

    PRR1957 Well-Known Member

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    I was surprised at the accuracy of that little Chrony when one time at a gun range another shooter had one of the really expensive Oehler and he let me fire across his to compare its numbers with mine, and both were a couple of FPS with each other. I’ll buy another Chrony one of these days.

    I used to be into archery some years ago and used a Chrony to help establish a more consistent draw length with the bows I was competing with. Really made a big improvement with my target scores.
     
  10. DCman

    DCman Well-Known Member

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    A long time ago I ran across an easy-to-use formula for calculating bullet energy (thank you, Wiley Clapp).
    I ran Sharps4590's numbers and here's how things worked out....

    9.3x57 - 265gr. @ 1951 MV = 2240 ME
    9.3x57 - 265gr. @ 1456 MV = 1248 ME

    8x65R Brenneke - 200gr. @ 2047 MV = 1861 ME

    8x56 M/S - 200gr. @ 1680 MV = 1254 ME (thanks for filling in bullet weight -b)

    9X57 - 200gr. @ 1895 MV = 1595 ME
    9x57 - 240gr. @ 1911 MV = 1946+ ME

    7x64 Brenneke - 178gr. @ 1965 MV = 1527 ME
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2020
  11. ms6852

    ms6852 GUNZILLA Supporting Member

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    Hey Vic , is there a brand of black powder you prefer, and if you don't mind explaining why?
     
  12. sharps4590

    sharps4590 Well-Known Member

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    DC, the 8 X 56 bullet is 200 grs. That's also my plinking/fun load. On the old chrony data sheets I use there's a simple formula at the bottom. I use it and log it on the sheets but I never put much stock in the way FPE is calculated. Thanks for working up the #'s and posting them.

    Which BP....well, if you looked in my powder cabinet you'd think I couldn't make up my mind..lol! I use a lot of Schuetzen and I've found it to be a good, reliable, "accurate enough" powder. It's more accurate for me in muzzleloaders than cartridges but it has turned in some impressive groups with cartridges. GOEX has been a standby for a long time and it used to be DuPont. It's been good in muzzleloaders but never quite came up to snuff in cartridges. GOEX makes "Old Eynsford" and supposedly it's produced for cartridge use. I bought a couple cans and it is very good. Higher than the others but in cartridges it's definitely worth it, I think. And that brings us to Swiss. It's probably the best out there and the most like what we read the old BP's being like. It's "strong" as in it turns in higher velocities, it burns "wet", meaning the fouling doesn't get hard, or as hard as the others. However, all BP's require a good lube and enough of it. Swiss is also very consistent in the numbers it turns in across a chrono. Black powder in general turns in very good numbers over a chrono, all brands. Single digit numbers are more common than not. Swiss is also the most expensive. If I were still shooting competitively I'd use Swiss.

    I bought 2 cases of Schuetzen over a couple years so I have a surfeit of it and I use it most. I'm satisfied with it. Generally I can figure out a way to get excellent performance from it. If I didn't have all that Schuetzen I'd be buying Old Eynsford. It's close enough to as good as Swiss I don't think I can shoot good enough anymore to tell the difference.

    There, clear as mud?....lol
     
  13. BlackEagle

    BlackEagle TFF Chaplain Supporting Member

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    Sounds like a great day. Glad you got out. We've had fine weather here, but the lockdown has all the ranges closed, and will be for the next few weeks.

    I'm jealous.
     
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  14. ms6852

    ms6852 GUNZILLA Supporting Member

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    I think that applies to all of us, this is where I began to point fingers and blame everything else but me.
     
  15. DCman

    DCman Well-Known Member

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    You're welcome.
    Yeah, there's so many variables that one could account for, but detecting them, and then putting them into the calculation is laborious. Not for me.
    However, it does give you an idea of how much power you're dealing with and that is something.
    With a 200 gr. bullet, your M/S load is making 1254 ft./lbs. ME.
    That calculates about the same as a current .25-35 factory load and a little more than a traditional .357 mag load fired from a rifle.
    That's good enough to bring down a nice buck, if you keep the range within 100 yards (actually, that's a much heavier bullet than the other two rounds I mentioned, so you could probably stretch it to 125 yards).
    I'll pop those numbers into the other post, too.
    Thanks for filling in the blank.
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2020