Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by 1952Sniper, Mar 6, 2003.

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  1. 1952Sniper

    1952Sniper New Member

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    JackRyann
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 87
    (12/28/02 1:41:29 am)
    Reply Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Smokeless Powder, Black Powder or Pyrodex – you choose the propellant! The bolt-action Model 10ML-II is the only muzzleloader versatile and strong enough to give you that choice.
    www.savagearms.com/muzzle...r_home.htm

    Anybody out there using one of these?
    --44 mag, when you're ready to get serious--


    AGunguy
    *TFF Staff*
    Posts: 2976
    (12/28/02 11:08:34 am)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Been reading about Hodgdon's Triple 7 being a wonder clean up powder, even with cold water...no sulfur compounds.

    I've been flirting with the thought of a black powder pistol, but if I got one would probably convert it to cartridge loader as I'm too lazy to ram a powder and ball down a piece of pipe.

    GG


    WyomingSwede
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 648
    (12/28/02 11:23:47 am)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Being a wanna be BP shooter, I checked out that frontloader on the savage website. Looks good...going 2300 fps instead of the 1100 fps of other bp rifles. There are days...we all feel the need for speed.

    I have a question though...do you think that we might be going beyond the "primitive aspect of the BP seasons" by this wondrous piece of technology??? Minnesota allows any muzzleloader as long as it is front loaded and over .45 cal. Colorado on the other hand does not allow in line muzzleloaders. Go figure. I am leaning toward an in line just for ease of cleaning and consistent ignition. Might some of these newer in lines be forced to hunt with centerfire rifles at some point? Opinions anyone???

    swede
    Wyoming Swede


    cointoss 2
    *TFF Staff*
    Posts: 1146
    (12/28/02 11:44:23 am)
    Reply
    Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Well I have both the newer in-line and the older side lock. Traditionalist would insist on Flint-locks. My choice was based on ease of cleaning; and being drilled and tapped for a scope. Of course some states solely limit you to use non powered scopes and flintlocks, that is fine but I like the enclosed primer and scope for the older eyes.
    cointoss2


    JackRyann
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 88
    (12/28/02 8:59:35 pm)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    I'm all with ya guys on the primive aspect of ML-ing. I've killed more deer with my hawken than anything.

    Now that aside, the rules are the rules.

    I'm trying to find out if this gun is any good or just a bunch of blow by the magazines helping out an advertiser.

    If I made the rules the in-lines would have to compete in regular firearms season where they belong, but I don't make the rules.
    --44 mag, when you're ready to get serious--


    warpig883
    *TFF Staff*
    Posts: 5655
    (12/29/02 11:33:00 am)
    Reply
    Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    What Jack said
    Don't blame yourself or anyone else for your mistakes or the downfalls of the USA. BLAME PRESIDENT BUSH.


    the real fredneck
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 1174
    (12/29/02 1:33:11 pm)
    Reply
    Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Have to disagree with the "traditionalists" and the regs that prohibit inlines the bottom line is you're limited to one shot . . . reload time is roughly the same between all types of front stuffers so if there is an edge in accuracy and CONSISTENT ignition w/inlines my opinion is that's GOOD, there's a better chance of getting a clean kill


    IShootBack
    Member
    Posts: 16
    (12/29/02 5:25:19 pm)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    I have two comments:
    1 - Smokless powder is not blackpowder and therefore not legal to use in many states during BP only hunting season.
    2 - The rate of twist (in the barrel) seems slow for smokless powder and faster bullet speeds.


    astute observer
    Member
    Posts: 28
    (12/29/02 7:29:51 pm)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    I can't help but believe that the manufacturer has opened a huge can of worms by bringing out this gun. It would not be legal to use this gun (with smokeless) for deer hunting in Illinois as well as a number of other states. Why? Because they specifically require blackpowder or a recognized black powder substitute!

    But the real problem I see is this. This gun may indeed be safe with SOME smokeless powders.....what about the newbie who supposes he can use ANY smokeless powder? And by blurring the lines between blackpowder and smokeless, how many will assume that they can also use smokeless in other blackpowder guns?


    SXSMAN
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 538
    (12/30/02 12:00:38 am)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    I've shot the 10ML and although they look good on paper (velocity,propellent) it does not look good on paper (target).
    Now it fairness this was a very early rifle.But I could not do better than 1"1/4 to an inch and a half at 100 yards.The shooter that had the 10ML was also not able to do better.

    Funny,he was able to put 5 shots in the size of a quarter at 100 yards with my Austin Halleck.A H guns are considered by many gun experts to be the most accurate.

    I do like having a breech plug that can be removed quickly for cleaning.But my true love is flint.

    I question if we really need that extra speed of smokeless or is it just some marketing people blowing smoke up our ... ?


    280freak
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 1101
    (12/30/02 10:17:50 am)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    SXSMAN -

    The main reason cited in their advertising for having the capability to use smokeless powder has more to do with ease of cleanup (ie - not having to worry about cleaning your gun as soon or as rigorously after shooting) than the perceived "benefit" of having more speed.

    You know how it is these days, anything that is quicker and easier HAS to be better, right?

    Also, you don't really think that the good folks in Marketing would blow smoke up our ...., now, do ya?


    kdub01
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 1659
    (12/30/02 3:30:01 pm)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    Used to have the percussion ML, a T/C Renegade in .50 cal.

    Eyes got to where a scope was mandatory (nope, even the fiber optics didn't work) and mounting one on the Renegade was sort of a disaster - extremely muzzle heavy and awkward.

    Got the T/C Blackdiamond for ease of proper scope mounting in a .50 BP and am well satisfied with it. Sure, it looks like a modern centerfire, but believe me, you still stuff one at a time down the barrel and can get hangfires with it just like the "traditional" jobbies. BTW, if you want "traditional", be sure to use only flintlocks and leave your binocular at home, including your scent-loc clothing, rangefinders, etc, etc.

    As long as the firearm uses BP or appropiate subsitute, can only fire one round at a time and is a muzzlestuffer, it should be legal anywhere, IMHO.
    "Keep Off The Ridgeline"


    armedandsafe
    Member
    Posts: 3
    (12/31/02 10:55:43 am)
    Reply Re: Savage smokeless powder Muzzle loader
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    I, too, was having trouble with the iron sights with these well-aged eyes. It got to where even the fiber sights didn't help that much. I got a pair of those stick-on bifocals for sun-glasses (not at home, so can't give you the brand name) and cut a small oval out of one. stuck this oval on the upper inside part of my right glasses lens. Could now see front sight clearly!
    Go to the optical shop where you get your glasses, with rifle in hand and have the lens cutter try different strength lenses until you find the one which allows you to see the front sight. Then buy the bifocal stick-ons that match. Mine is 1 diopter,now, but will probably be 1.25 by next hunting season.

    Armed and Safe - not just a theory
     
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