The Firearms Forum banner
1 - 7 of 7 Posts

·
Philogynist & Sycophant, Looking For Work
Joined
·
8,148 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What the heck's the difference? They appear to be the same size, so why is there a different part number?

The reason I ask is that a friend of mine who has an AR-15 but very little income wants to reload for his .223 Remington gun. He's got a bunch of brass, and a bunch of powder - the wrong one, but I think I have a fix for that - but no primers.

I ordered 5000 small pistol magnum primers for my 9mm, based on the advice of a local gun shop owner who reloads a lot, rather than the regular CCI 500 items. They're being delivered Monday, but I have no idea whether the supplier is going to deliver the original order - magnums - or the regular size, which I authorized them to substitute, if they became available sooner. I'll find out Monday... :)

By my reading, the difference is that pistol primers have thinner metal shells, because a pistol firing pin tends to strike with less force than a rifle typically presents. I also note that a magnum primer is a bit hotter, and capable of igniting a larger powder load more uniformly. This could be an important difference in the application I have in mind.

My friend has a bunch of Red Dot - not the right powder for a .223 round. Searching the Internet, I found a recommended load for that round using Red Dot, and I don't like it. It seems that 6 to 7 grains of Red Dot makes a good load for a 55 grain bullet, according to some sources, though I've yet to find a manufacturer list a tested loading for this powder and caliber. My worry is that using such a small charge in a relatively large cartridge will result in incomplete ignition of the full charge, and erratic performance, possibly even dangerous performance.

But on the other hand, if my primer order comes in as magnum primers, rather than the standard ones, will the additional friskiness of the primer make up for the light powder charge in the cartridge? Any thoughts?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
570 Posts
The red dot will work ( i believe 8g is considered max) to send the bullet out the barrel, but most likely wont have enough gas pressure to cycle the action. Kinda pointless in an AR in my opinion. As for primers, id recommed small rifle primers as that is what they are for. But, the small pistol (or mags) SHOULD work for your situation. You may get a few that the firing pin sticks in too. And i would expect hangfires to be fairly common with that small of a charge. But once it goes, it'll go fast. In short, I'd choose to get small rifle primets, and some decent rifle powder. Win 748 is a good choice and it seems to be fairly abundant. Theres several choices.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
I am new to reloading 223 but I Love the Win 748 powder for 223. Nice small ball powder that works great and meters good. Because of the pressure of 223 I would worry about using CCI 500 or 550 primers. You may have pressure blowing back in your face through a hole in the primer. Not good....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
603 Posts
I used to shoot informal handgun silhouette using a T/C Contender fitted with a .223 remington Super 14" barrel loading a 55 gr. bullet and 6 gr. of Red Dot. Chronographed velocity was around 1,700 fps. Not much more than half the velocity you are looking for in an AR. NOT a good choice for a rifle powder. The CCI primers are considered a "hard" primer so you may be okay using it in a rifle but only trial and error will tell you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,207 Posts
Small pistol primers are not as hot and have a softer primer cup. They are indeed the same size, but use small pistol primers in a small rifle round and you can have slamfires if used in an autoloader or hangfires due to the insufficient primer flame igniting the powder charge efficiently. Use small rifle primers in a small pistol round and you may have misfires because the fire control system of the handgun isn't strong enough to ignite the harder primers. And this is not to mention the possible pressure issues
 

·
Philogynist & Sycophant, Looking For Work
Joined
·
8,148 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Good information from everyone - Thanks!

I've got another option; buy his Red Dot for my 9mm Luger, and get him something else. The local gun shop bought a bunch of IMR 3031 and can't get rid of it, and it seems an average to good powder for the .223. I may try a few of the small pistol primers out, using a proper powder, but I'm still encouraging him to buy some proper primers. I'm a nice neighbor, but not nice enough to buy them for him. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
966 Posts
I used to shoot informal handgun silhouette using a T/C Contender fitted with a .223 remington Super 14" barrel loading a 55 gr. bullet and 6 gr. of Red Dot. Chronographed velocity was around 1,700 fps. Not much more than half the velocity you are looking for in an AR. NOT a good choice for a rifle powder. The CCI primers are considered a "hard" primer so you may be okay using it in a rifle but only trial and error will tell you.
I have some ammo like this. I use it where reduced loads are indicated. It is like a 22 Mag. Bolt gun by the way. Trail Boss is good for reduced loads also. Go to Hodgdon website for info on reduced loads. I believe that is where I found them.
 
1 - 7 of 7 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top