[soonerfan66]

Here is the 1st shotgun a French St. Etienne SxS double hammer 12 gauge . Looking at the proof marks believe it shows good for modern ammo but with

these French proof marks not 100% sure . Can someone give more info on the stamps and the French words ? Like if date made , chamber size ect . I got some Magtech brass 2 1/2" 12 gauge shells for the older shotgun and they won't insert enough to close up but a plastic 2 3/4 "shotgun shell chambers and closes up fine . Measuring the 2 shells the brass is little larger in diameter .

A butt stock extension has been added to it and not sure if the stock is walnut or maybe maple ??? But the stock is what caught my eye . The not really a tiger stripe but pretty cool design . Sure someone probably has redone the stock and barrels . I was more interest in the older been around awhile sxs shotgun and like had said on other post put 2 low ball bids not expecting really to win this one and surprise won both auctions !!! Will post the 2nd one when it comes in .

 

[sharps4590]

sooner, you should be able to find the French proofs on line. If not, gimme a bit and I'll check my Wirnsberger's. I know he has them listed.

 

[sharps4590]

AAAARRRGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! As is typical with anything to do with French firearms their proof laws are a convoluted mess!!!! If they used powder T it might have this proof mark. If it was double proofed with Powder T this mark should be present. If it was Treble proofed with Powder T these marks should be present, unless it was proofed with Powder M but, sometimes they used Powder S so, with early French guns one must use great caution in assuming it is strong enough for modern powders as compared to French powders of the era.

The BEST I could determine was the gun MIGHT be single proofed for 14,223 psi

I think one would need the gun in hand to compare proofs with the gun.

If it's tight to face, I wouldn't shoot anything in it at any more than BP pressures until something more definitive could be determined.

 

[soonerfan66]

I feel much better !!! My head was spinning trying to understand the French markings !!! Just about the time I would go "ok think got it figured out" would come across something else . What do you mean "tight to face" . With some of the basic more easy to understand marks but the part of the proof pressure am lost a bit and would like to know year was made also but being lost on were to look with the info I got is very frustrating . Plan to shoot low BP mostly anyway and was excited about using the brass shells but that will have to wait and be used on the other shotgun coming . Wasn't expecting this issue . I have a few boxes of target loads and like said before they load good . I have a bag of fired plastic hulls can load BP for this one . Sure hope I have no issues with the brass working in the older shotgun . It arrived this morning but we are getting some snow and stuff so will wait till tomorrow to go pick up .

 

[sharps4590]

"Tight to face" should pretty much explain itself. That it is tight to the face of the standing breech. Pull the forearm off and leaving the action closed, shake it back and forth and up and down. You should not feel any movement between the barrels and the action.

I don't know if you know it Mike but, plastic hulls are only good for one BP loading. The BP eats little pin holes in the hull, nearly invisible and, it eats the base wad. That's a bummer about the brass hulls.

 

[soonerfan66]

That's what I thought but wanted to be sure . It's real tight , don't feel any wobble or anything . Thanks for the info on the plastic hulls I hadn't heard about that . Liked the idea of using and reusing the plastic hulls with BP cause am set real good on BP for it . I guess need to check into some shotgun powder now . More researching now !!!

 

[Grizzley1]

Sooner if you can find a source of paper hulls they will last more than one loading. They won't last as long as a brass hull but they are better than nothing. It's strange that they won't chamber in that gun.

 

[soonerfan66]

Will look and see on the paper hulls . . Here is a pic of the brass shell inserted as far can go into the chamber . Can force it into a little more but then need to knock it out with a rod .

 

[TRAP55]

Mike, does it fit like that in both chambers? Have you measure the chambers? I can see the Choke markings in the pics, but no chamber length markings? Might be another "French thing" on proofs.
I've got a big bag of new production Armusa once fired paper hulls..somewhere..that I've been trying to find for Firpo. If I ever find them, you and Mark can arm wrestle over them. I've got about 20? boxes of new loaded I could make into hulls, but this stuff was $40 a box 10-15yrs ago.They're 2.75" star crimped competition pigeon loads.

 

[Hawg]

I don't know if you know it Mike but, plastic hulls are only good for one BP loading. The BP eats little pin holes in the hull, nearly invisible and, it eats the base wad. That's a bummer about the brass hulls.

I'll back up what Sharps said about plastic shells. Depending on the brand you might get two loadings out of them. I mostly use Winchester AA shells and they're a one and done.

 

[soonerfan66]

Yes the brass shells chamber about the same . Not the most precise measurement but I got little over 2 3/4" . This was only using a small pencil and inserting till could feel and looking down the chamber so just a ballpark measurement .

 

[BillM]

Maybe it's chambered for 12 ga 2"? I've thought of picking up one of these several
times---chamber length and choke constriction checker.

 

[soonerfan66]

I had to look on youtube to get a clue on how to do it . May try a few other methods to get another idea . Or see what one those checkers goes for . Maybe cut one of the brass shells down and see if it will chamber ??????

 

[soonerfan66]

Just FYI picked up the other shotgun and will post on it also . It loaded the brass shells with no problem ,?.?.? I asked some questions on a shotgun forum about the French one and was told the barrels are fluid steel , smokeless proofed , good for 15,500 psi , has 65mm chambers . Trying to track down stuff in French is not my cup of tea or rather coffee in my case .

 

[sharps4590]

You know what, Mike, it can't cost much to have those chambers opened up for the brass hulls.

 

[Grizzley1]

Can you take it to a good smith in your area and have the chamber reamed to 2 3/4? You'd still be able to shoot black powder loads and smokeless 2 3/4 shells if you want to.

 

[TRAP55]

Mike, when you insert the brass case, is it stopping on the mouth of the case, or on the base of it?

 

[soonerfan66]

I will have to check on that Trap and try to see . I was messing with it but was at the kitchen table cause I have lost my reloading/work table to Dina's crazy "I got to get these quilts and stuff done before this weekend craft show " state of mind . Was using kitchen table but put everything up cause got company coming over and kids will be running around and don't want to lose anything and just don't like leaving even guns that are apart laying around . Inspecting the gun I noticed the left firing pin spring isn't working right and the not sure what call it "nipple" was not screwed in quite all the way . Tried to tighten it down but with hammer in way can't get a socket onto it . A wrench won't fit . Got the "nipple" backed out with fingers and the spring or part of a spring was broke . I am trying to use a ink pin spring to see if would work but can only hand tighten so much before gets to tight . Needing to find out can I with the hammer decocked be taken off by the screw holding it to side plate so can tighten down and hopefully fix it . Or does the side plate need to come off ? I know this is getting off track some so if need to start a new post in tech questions section can do . Also somebody from the shotgun forum post this on this shotgun . Didn't think was that old !!

 

[soonerfan66]

Woops forgot to load the picture !!!

 

[TRAP55]

If you just need the hammer out of the way to get to the FP, put it on half cock, and remove the screw and hammer.