The Firearms Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
11,115 Posts
It would be stamped on the barrel if it was rated + P

The burning characteristics of black powder used in early cartridges meant that these cartridges operated at low pressures, generally under ~25,000 psi (~170 MPa). These cartridges were limited by their case capacity, and the only way to get more power was to increase the case to hold more powder; this can be seen in firearms such as those made by Sharps Rifle Manufacturing Company, which made rifles with nominal powder capacities from 70 grains (.45-70) to 110 grains (.45-110).[1]

With the advent of smokeless powder, which has a far greater energy density than black powder, it was possible to generate far more power in the large cases of the older black-powder cartridges. Cartridges such as the .32-20 Winchester and .44-40 Winchester were chambered in both revolvers and lever action rifles, and the rifles' actions could handle much higher pressures. This led to "machine gun only" loads in these calibers, which provided far more velocity and energy in the rifles, but were not safe in the revolvers due to the higher pressures they generated. These loads were eventually dropped due to a combination of safety concerns, and new smokeless rifle cartridges that offered even higher velocities, such as the .30-30 Winchester.[2]

The first modern smokeless powder cartridge deliberately loaded by a major manufacturer to higher than standard pressure was the .38 ACP, originally introduced in 1900. This cartridge provided performance similar to other .38 caliber cartridges of the time. However, in 1929 the cartridge was redesigned as the .38 Super Automatic, or just .38 Super, along with a significant increase in operating pressure and muzzle energy, making it the most powerful auto pistol cartridge available, in both energy and velocity, for many years. Like the "rifle only" loads, the .38 Super could still be chambered in the older .38 ACP guns, producing a dangerous combination. Capable of reaching a muzzle energy of 500 ft-lbs, the .38 Super remains a viable defensive cartridge, though it is most popular in shooting sports such as IPSC. A similar move to a high pressure loading was done on the .38 Special in 1930, producing the .38-44 HV loadings, and eventually leading to the development of the .357 Magnum.[2][3]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,687 Posts
Taurus guns are generally now (but not always in the past) considered one of the highest quality firearm manufacturers in South America.

They are the main arms suppliers of military and police departments of Brazil, where they are based, but also many other South and Central American countries.

The fact yours has Century import marks I would guess it’s a police turn in from a department from somewhere south of our border.

Most Taurus and other SA manufacturers that built revolvers built essentially “clones” of S&W or Colts. Parts usually will NOT interchange, and the metallurgy may or may not be as good as originals, but they are generally considered “strong,” not like some similar Spanish knock offs for example.


“Plus P” ratings for the .38 were never truly defined in the past, and only recently have they been “standardized,” but from my reading what are considered “Plus P” loads today are “tamer” than the earliest “Plus P” loads when that title was first coined (not all that long ago) and to some a lot tamer than the “heavy” .38 loads guys were experimenting with as early as the 1920s and 30s, which were almost in .38-44 range, which was just short of .357 magnum pressure.

IF (big IF!) the revolver is tight and (especially if you have it checked by a ‘smith!) otherwise safe, and most of what made it a “beater” is holster and storage wear and not from extensive shooting, if it was mine I would not hesitate to OCCASIONALLY shoot modern FACTORY “+Ps” through it to test, and if they seemed to handle a few cylinders of it on the range not hesitate to use it as “duty” ammo, but I would not feed it a steady “diet” of them.

But then again, like a lot of things to do with “marketing “ “Plus P” is a little overrated in my book and many times an excuse to charge you more. Especially with modern bullet and propellant technology, there are some very good defensive standard pressure .38 special rounds out there today, such as the Hornady 125 gr XTP which I like a lot and carry in a few of my old J frames not “Plus P” rated, but there are others, that will give you adequate power, and not necessarily shake your old Taurus to death😉
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Taurus guns are generally now (but not always in the past) considered one of the highest quality firearm manufacturers in South America.

They are the main arms suppliers of military and police departments of Brazil, where they are based, but also many other South and Central American countries.

The fact yours has Century import marks I would guess it’s a police turn in from a department from somewhere south of our border.

Most Taurus and other SA manufacturers that built revolvers built essentially “clones” of S&W or Colts. Parts usually will NOT interchange, and the metallurgy may or may not be as good as originals, but they are generally considered “strong,” not like some similar Spanish knock offs for example.


“Plus P” ratings for the .38 were never truly defined in the past, and only recently have they been “standardized,” but from my reading what are considered “Plus P” loads today are “tamer” than the earliest “Plus P” loads when that title was first coined (not all that long ago) and to some a lot tamer than the “heavy” .38 loads guys were experimenting with as early as the 1920s and 30s, which were almost in .38-44 range, which was just short of .357 magnum pressure.

IF (big IF!) the revolver is tight and (especially if you have it checked by a ‘smith!) otherwise safe, and most of what made it a “beater” is holster and storage wear and not from extensive shooting, if it was mine I would not hesitate to OCCASIONALLY shoot modern FACTORY “+Ps” through it to test, and if they seemed to handle a few cylinders of it on the range not hesitate to use it as “duty” ammo, but I would not feed it a steady “diet” of them.

But then again, like a lot of things to do with “marketing “ “Plus P” is a little overrated in my book and many times an excuse to charge you more. Especially with modern bullet and propellant technology, there are some very good defensive standard pressure .38 special rounds out there today, such as the Hornady 125 gr XTP, that will give you adequate power, and not necessarily shake your old Taurus to death😉
I really appreciate the history lesson. My pistol is “out for delivery” today. I’ll have more to tell once I have it in hand. I happen to have a SW model 10-3 heavy barrel correction department trade in to compare it to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,687 Posts
If you don’t mind me asking, what did it cost you?

Years ago we had a poster on here from Brazil but it looks like he moved on...I forget his screen name but he was a big Taurus Fan/ shooter, nice guy, I think either he worked at Taurus at one time and/or carried them in his professional life, I forget, but he could tell you anything or everything about them.

It was cool learning about their laws, like they were pretty permissive except it was like a felony or some serious offense for a civilian to own a gun that fired the “military” round, like other countries, so the .32 acp was big in autos and .38s in revolvers. He was jealous that we could buy a Taurus 1911 in .45 when they first came out but he couldn’t especially since the first ones were made there🤔
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
790 Posts
Brazilian air force officers sidearm or Panamanian gender gendarme officers sidearm or canal way lock facility security officer for certain...

Peruvian navy officer or NCO (3 stripe or higher rank) or embassy staff for certain but the mall triangle proofmark or acceptance stamp or contract run order mark usually found adjacent to the serial numbers would have to be intact and unaltered / not ground off to be certain...

As noted Taurus and INA sold a full line of small frame revolvers of all types to a ridiculous and comical number of agents or officers in bureau departments and military or gendarme branches across all of South America even in Mexico the USA and Canada.

They are ubiquitous and omnipresent and inescapable.

You had to buy your own gun from an approved list.

M
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
If you don’t mind me asking, what did it cost you?

Years ago we had a poster on here from Brazil but it looks like he moved on...I forget his screen name but he was a big Taurus Fan/ shooter, nice guy, I think either he worked at Taurus at one time and/or carried them in his professional life, I forget, but he could tell you anything or everything about them.

It was cool learning about their laws, like they were pretty permissive except it was like a felony or some serious offense for a civilian to own a gun that fired the “military” round, like other countries, so the .32 acp was big in autos and .38s in revolvers. He was jealous that we could buy a Taurus 1911 in .45 when they first came out but he couldn’t especially since the first ones were made there🤔
More than I should have. With auction fee, $321.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
A year and a half ago I’d have said you probably overpaid. In today’s market though I think you did OK for a used Taurus, especially a police trade in with at least a little more of an interesting history than a run of the mill Taurus “shooter.”
Well if you count the nice leather holster I guess you can say I paid about $250 for the gun.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
And now I have it in hand. The bore, cylinders and lockup is actually quite nice. The department stamp below the Taurus emblem looks as if someone sneezed while striking it. Oh well, it’s supposed to be a beater anyway. I bet it still shoot decent though.

247462

247463

247464

247465
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,687 Posts
I’d have to put some Hogues or Pachmyers on it but it might be tough with the lanyard ring, I kinda like them, funny that lanyards for handguns never were all that popular here...

A second option would be a Tyler grip adapter if you could find one...

But that’s me...I can never seem to like most factory da revolver grips, you might like them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I’d have to put some Hogues or Pachmyers on it but it might be tough with the lanyard ring, I kinda like them, funny that lanyards for handguns never were all that popular here...

A second option would be a Tyler grip adapter if you could find one...

But that’s me...I can never seem to like most factory da revolver grips, you might like them.
I may do something like that. But right now it’s cheaper to leave as is. I actually may have a spare rubber grip in The bottom of the safe I could try
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top