Thanks... going for the Dragonov

Discussion in 'General Military Arms & History Forum' started by ysacres, Mar 7, 2003.

  1. ysacres

    ysacres Well-Known Member Supporting Member

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    Pullman WA
    OneRoundShort
    Member
    Posts: 4
    (12/17/02 11:22:41 am)
    Reply Thanks...Going for the Dragonov
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    I just wanted to say thank you for helping me make a big decision. I believe I have made the decision to acquire a Dragonov. IF anyone has any other suggestions or comments I would like to hear them. Thanks again and have a great holiday!

    LIKTOSHOOT
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 6694
    (12/17/02 6:31:10 pm)
    Reply Re: Thanks...Going for the Dragonov
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    For a preban (REAL)....yes they are out there......expect to pay in excess of 3K. Do not confuse the name for the real thing! Just a heads up.


    LTS



    Ballistic
    Member
    Posts: 26
    (12/18/02 5:32:34 am)
    Reply where?
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    where can i get one? the real one! they are 7.62x54 correct?

    Go Get Beer
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 54
    (12/18/02 5:55:25 am)
    Reply Re: where?
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    They are 7.62x54R, to be exact. You never know what kind of wildcat your neighbour cooked up, so I list the whole designation, just to be on the safe side.
    Kalashnikov action, a valve on the gas chamber to increase gas pressure on the piston in case the action is fouled and needs more power to be cycled correctly, 10-round mag to accomodate firing from prone position.

    I must say the name fits you.

    1952Sniper
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 697
    (12/18/02 9:00:38 am)
    Reply Re: where?
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    LTS, are you saying that the Romanian Dragunovs currently on the market aren't worth buying? I've been considering looking into buying one... they tend to be in the $700-$800 range, like this one: www.interordnance.com/Mer...F7.62X54-S

    Do these not even compare to original Russian Dragunovs?
    Macht kaputt, was euch kaputt macht!

    Xracer
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 3238
    (12/18/02 10:14:28 am)
    Reply Re: where?
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    "SSG-97 Dragunov-style rifle with 8x42 scope".

    "Dragunov-style" means it ain't the real thing! As to whether it's comperable quality.....well, it may look like a real Dragunov, but I doubt if it will be as accurate as one.

    1952Sniper
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 702
    (12/18/02 10:43:34 am)
    Reply Re: where?
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    Well, yeah, that's what I'm wondering. What's the difference? Just quality? Or is it of a different design?
    Macht kaputt, was euch kaputt macht!

    Xracer
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 3241
    (12/18/02 11:31:04 am)
    Reply Re: where?
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    "The SVD (Snayperskaya Vintovka Dragunova)-Dragunov Sniping Rifle was the first rifle designed from scratch as a sniper rifle, and was introduced in the 1950's. It has very limited similarities to the Kalashnikov series of rifles. The SVD can be expected to shoot 2 MOA with quality ammo." :www.snipercentral.com/svd.htm

    To answer your question: I don't know, but judging from the difference in price between a "real" SVD ($3,000+) and the one you're considering ($7-800), my guess that the one advertised is a "gussied-up" AK converted to 7.62x54Rmm with a 'scope.

    As to how good it is......who knows?

    Tell ya what, Sniper....why don'tcha spend the 8 bills and let us know!

    1952Sniper
    V.I.P. Member
    Posts: 705
    (12/18/02 12:54:20 pm)
    Reply Re: where?
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    Hey Xracer, I would if I had it. Like I said, I'm considering it, but it's hard to cough up that much green at one time. Especially when there's so many other mil-surps out there that I would like to add to my collection first. But who knows... I may just decide that I need one of those Romanian knock-offs. They look pretty kewl.

    I must be missing something, though.... because 2 MOA doesn't seem too wonderful for an original SVD sniper rifle. IMHO that would be a waste of $3,000 if a person were really after the accuracy.
    Macht kaputt, was euch kaputt macht!

    LIKTOSHOOT
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 6742
    (12/24/02 4:21:25 pm)
    Reply Re: where?
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    Twelve inches is all you need a 1200 yards, like I said.....sub MOA`s mean little in the battlefield----if`in it don`t shoot....



    EVERYTIME!



    Celt
    Member
    Posts: 10
    (12/29/02 6:09:42 pm)
    Reply Re: where?
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    12" at 1200 yards is closer to 1MOA. That would be from a perfect shooting postition like a rock solid bench.

    Take into consideration wind, slight range mis calculation and shooter error and you have about 24" at 1200 yards with a rifle that shoot 1 MOA.

    Take a rifle that shoots 1/2 MOA and cut that in half to get your 12" at 1200 yards.

    a 12 MOA at 1200 yard gun means a miss if the shooter is off by even a fraction of an inch. Sheer luck hitting man size targets at that ringe with the first shot.

    Not to step no anyones toes, especially being new here, but I deal with alot of long range shooters and shoot LR my self. It is not near as easy as it sounds.

    Celt

    H.D. Rifles

    polishshooter
    *TFF Senior Staff*
    Posts: 3750
    (1/11/03 6:29:31 pm)
    Reply Re: where?
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    Keep in mind the Russian doctrine concerning snipers is NOT the same as ours...the sniper was a "support" weapon to the regular Infantry, usually 300m or so behind the assault troops, right there with the MMGs...meant to take on specific "problems" with point fire as opposed to area fire of the MGs..ie, individually exposed enemy troops, and crews from support weapons, firing slits on bunkers, exposed vehicle crewmen, disabling "soft" vehicles...NOT "one shot one kill" head shots at 1000yds with small dedicated teams like our doctine preaches.

    In the era of "Spray and Pray" assault rifles in the hands of "typical" conscripts, it was meant to bring back to the battlefield commander the option of aimed rifle fire like was normal when everybody on the battlefield had a Mosin Nagant. Actually this was not a bad idea.

    They were intended to be an integral part of a conventional infantry attack, and not free-lancing "Scout-Snipers" like we employ.

    The Dragunov, like many Russian designs excells at what it was meant to do, but it was never designed for 1 MOA like a Western sniper rifle. It was just supposed to be a lot more accurate and have better range than an AK-47...

    Lots of people slam the Dragunov compared to an M1A, or a M21, at 1000yds but it was never meant to be one. It would probably be more like if the Marine Corp today assigned a half a dozen "Sharpshooters" with stock M1Ds to each weapons platoon and doled them out as support weapons to each squad getting ready to attack, just to take out the occasional threat the 16s missed or couldn't hit.

    The Dragunov is pretty good when used like that, and used at 1000yds to hit a man SOMEWHERE only when necessary, not only in the head.

    "Don't hear him call you an ---hole, hear WHY he's calling you an ---hole." -------- From "A Season on the Brink"
     
  2. jimmy

    jimmy New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    Messages:
    7
    DRAGONOV

    JUST WANTED TO LET YOU KNOW THAT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A ROMANIAN DRAGONOV. DO NOT CONFUSE A ROMAK FOR A DRAGONOV IT MAY LOOK THE SAME BUT WHEN YOU TAKE A CLOSE LOOK AT THE RECIEVER YOU WILL NOTICE THAT ALL YOU ARE LOOKING AT IS AN AK RIFLE MOST LIKELY AN RPK WITH A DRAGONOV STYLE STOCK IN 7.62X54. YOU MIGHT WANT TO CONSIDER THAT THE DRAGONOV MUST BE USED WITH A RUSSIAN ISSUED 7.62X54 ROUND DESIGNATED SPECIFICALY FOR THIS RIFLE TO GET THE BEST POSSIBLE RESULTS. THE RUSSIANS WERE REALLY NEVER INTERESTED IN MAKING THIS ROUND AVALIABLE TO THE U.S. I WOULD JUST GET A DRAGONOV IN 308 CAL. THEY ARE JUST AS GOOD AND BEING 308 CAL IT WILL BE EASY TO FIND PREMIUM ROUNDS FOR IT.
     

  3. inplanotx

    inplanotx Active Member

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    Hi Jimmy and welcome to TFF. We are glad to have you with us.
    Stick around and have some fun with us.

    As a note, writing in all capital letters is considered shouting in computereze.

    Nice to have you with us!
     

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  4. rescue2553

    rescue2553 New Member

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    I have a original Russian Dragonov that I purchased almost 15 years ago and they are one of the best out of the box rifles I have ever shot. Now getting to the Romanian I have not seen or held one of them they look allot like the originals from the pictures. They are originally 7.62x54, I do not know about the.308 cal. but I can say most rifles I have ever worked with that have been altered or re chambered to a different cal. never works as good as the original. Also they are allot like the AK but stronger receivers and just a better rifle and I am only guessing now because I have never measured it but the barrel is about 3 to 5 inches longer than the AK and I have never found more than a 5 round mag for them I have been told that they make a 10 round mag for them but I have never looked for them or have seen one in my travels. It is a little odd that the Romanian Dragonov`s are selling for around $700 to $800 when I payed almost $1800 for mine when they first hit the market and if they are as good as the Russian I think the price may not be as high as I payed for mine but I am sure it would be up there.