Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was shootin

Discussion in 'Black Powder Shooting / Muzzleloaders / Handguns' started by Guest, Feb 23, 2003.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    bg
    Member
    Posts: 37
    (3/4/02 7:56:01 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del All Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was shootin
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    This is the first time to this forum for me.I'm generally at the 1911 forum,but made the mistake of watching Clint Eastwood's "Pale Rider"Sunday nite.What in heavens name is the pistol he's using in the movie called ? It looks like a Remington 1858 but I've also heard it's a Star Cap & Ball double action.I confess that this pistol has hooked me into trying out Black Powder.If I can find out what it is,I'll try and get two.End of Trail is in Apr.,I live about 20miles from it and am going.I was thinking of taking my Colt SAA,but I really would like to try this black powder thing.My thanks in advance.bg

    Stickthrower
    Member
    Posts: 1
    (3/9/02 7:52:24 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was sho
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    It is a Remington 1858 revolver. The Starr revolver looks very similar, and also has a topstrap. The difference between the two is mostly cosmetic. The Starr revolvers are, IMHO much clunkier looking. The cutout at the front of the frame where the ball rammer is located is shallower and kind of square, as is the back of the frame. I personally like the more 'organic' look of the Remington. It is difficult to tell in the movie, but Clint's gun could have either been an 1858 New Army in .44 or an 1858 New Army Police model in .36.

    I'm sure you noticed the speedloader effect of an extra cylinder. That and the strong topstrap made the Remington far superior to the Colt 1860 and 1851.

    A good place to get the 1858, or a Starr for that matter is Cabela's.

    Remington 1858's www.cabelas.com/cabelas/e...Type=index

    Starr revolvers
    www.cabelas.com/cabelas/e...ubcategory

    I own two Remington 1858 New Army's, one purchased from Cabela's, and the other given to me by my grandfather.
    The Cabela's revolver shoots magnificently ( In fact, better than I can!). The one I inherited has never been shot (gold and nickel plated), but I see no reason why it also wouldn't work well.

    I unhesitatingly encourage you to try the 1858 New Army, because IMO it is the best cap and ball revolver out there, and would make an excellent introduction to black powder shooting.

    BTW: The Muzzle Energy of a .44 blackpowder cap and ball revolver is almost identical to that of a standard .38. Not bad for almost 150 years old, eh!

    Edited by: Stickthrower at: 3/9/02 8:06:20 am

    bg
    Member
    Posts: 42
    (3/10/02 7:37:52 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was sho
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    Thank you for clearing this up for me and by all means,Welcome Aboard!You'll find not finer folks here.I've posted some questions and have always received great advise or info.I am intrigued by this black powder business.I was out at the local range and a fellow was firing a 50.cal Hawkins repro rifle.I confess I watched him shoot this rifle more than I shot.I've been told that Ruger Old Armies are very close to the Remington 1858's.I get Cabela's catalog here
    in Cal but because of the staunch left that rule this little kinigdom called Cal,they are unable to ship directly to me.I will wait for a gunshow down at the DelMar Fairgrounds,or maybe will run into some when I go to the SASS's "End of Trail".I live
    real close to where this will be held,and am planning on going in Apr.Once again thank you for your info,help,and company...
    bg {let's vote Bill Simon for Governor}

    Stickthrower
    Member
    Posts: 4
    (3/27/02 11:30:37 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was sho
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    bg,

    I had the unfortunate experience of being born and raised in the People's Democratic Republic of California. My parents and in-laws still live there, and every time we visit, we realize how glad we are we moved. I actually bought my Remington 1858 While I was in CA, many years ago.

    I also remember buying an Enfield No1 MK III at a Big5, and walking out the door the same day with it. They probably won't let you do that anymore either, will they?

    I saw in some of your earlier postings that you are in the San Bernadino area. My sister lives at the foot of the Tehon Pass, and my inlaws are in that area all the time with their appliance business.

    Even though Wisconsin doesn't allow firearms CC, it is a much nicer place to live. We actually have a RKBA amendment to the state constitution, and another protecting hunting, fishing and trapping from rabid AR activists.

    My one beef is with local politics, but no matter where you are, the knucklehead quotient is pretty high in that career field.

    It's good to hear from another of the oppressed masses of the PDRC!



    rjjrwi
    Member
    Posts: 12
    (4/13/02 9:46:31 pm)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was sho
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    Stickthrower: I see we share the same first name and we both live in Wi ! I'm not to far from Sparta, where do you live?

    Stickthrower
    Member
    Posts: 5
    (5/28/02 8:16:38 am)
    Reply | Edit | Del Re: Will someone tell me what "Pale Rider" was sho
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    I'm in Beloit.
     
  2. powdersmoke

    powdersmoke New Member

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    Clint was using the 1858 Remington with the 45 cartridge conversion. Since it did not have a cartridge loading cut out he used the spare cylinders.
     

  3. drobs

    drobs Member

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  4. woodsrunner

    woodsrunner New Member

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    check out this thread and scroll to the last picture. The gun is a Navy arms 1858 Remington with a R&D 45 Colt conversion cylinder. This conversion is the most simple one to do. In my case it worked right from the drop in. As a matter of fact it's timing is better with the conversion than with the original cylinder. The big advantage to the R&D over the Kirst is the T&D can be switched back to cap and ball quickly, the Kirst can't. The gun will shoot much better than the group shown. It was the first time I ever shot it and it was pouring rain.

    I paid $145.00 for the Remington in 1990 and $200.00 for the cylinder several years later. Expect to pay much more now.

    http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15627
     
  5. drobs

    drobs Member

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    The Kirst switches back to bp just fine and quick. Though that R&D one is less expensive. I may have to try one.
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2004
  6. woodsrunner

    woodsrunner New Member

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    I'm under the impression the recoil shield holding the firing pin is mounted to the gun on the Kirst. Thus reqiring removal before returning to percussion mode. On the R&D it's part of the cylinder. On the R&D you can roll the conversion out and roll the C&B cylinder in and continue shooting, just like changing from one C&B cylider to another.

    If I'm wrong on the Kirst correct me. I'm only commenting by what I've read. I've never had the oportunity to handle one. I do have a reissue Colt 1851 I'm thinking of buying a Kirst for. If I do I'm going to try and either fit it with a barrel from one of the factory built conversions, or reline to the correct .357 bore size.
     
  7. drobs

    drobs Member

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    The recoil shield slips over the rear of the cylinder.
    [​IMG]
    and locks into gun via the flat part on the shield. The negative on this is that you can no longer spin your cylinder by putting the gun on 1/2 cock. The whole assembly (cylinder(sp) & Sheild) is easily removable at least for the Remington, for the colt, you would still have to break down the gun unless you dremmel in a loading gate.